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EC135 missing in NSW

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EC135 missing in NSW

Old 12th Nov 2015, 00:32
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by LeadSled
Mick,
There had been filming at Breeza and around the general area in the days before, but there was no film crew on this flight.
Not sure if you are being pedantic or have a witness that saw JD board without a camera.

"Film crew" equals solo operator with dslr or video camera, as per how the MP says his interview was recorded.

If there were memory cards on board they have probably survived, given there has been no reports of post crash fire.


Mickjoebill

Last edited by mickjoebill; 13th Nov 2015 at 05:37.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 01:10
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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Just out of curiosity, if Richard has been using his helicopter for the purposes of aerial filming (whether it was this particular flight or previous ones), does he have an AOC or was he operating under someone else's AOC?

This is a genuine question, as there have been quite a few accidents I've noticed in the past that could have been prevented purely by way of the flight should not have legally been able to occur in the first place. Eg CFIT at night when the pilot wasn't night current or not enough fuel to have legally carried out the flight in the first place etc.

** I didn't know Richard at all, sad to see more fatalities in this game.

Last edited by havick; 12th Nov 2015 at 02:12. Reason: Being more specific
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 01:23
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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Condolences to all those lost, and with all due respect but repairing rotor blades with epoxy, such a critical part of the aircraft, I mean, that is just absolute madness!

I'm trying to read through these posts and all I can envision is this machine sitting on the ground while someone is mixing up a little resin and hardener and smearing it on the rotor blades. Must have used a decent quality epoxy if he got it all the way down the coast to his house.

Anyway,

Hopefully a thorough investigation proves fruitful in providing some answers.
As much as the guy is getting slammed for his record of incidents, nobody knows what happened yet.

CFIT, windshear, mechanical failure, engine failure, bird strike etc.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 02:17
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Mmmmmm ....

......In the USA you can do your IFR in an R22 or Jetranger and it is everlasting. Not even a requirement for a specific helicopter bi annual review- do it in a VFR Cessna 150 if you want to......

Dick ... that is just not quite correct ... yes you can get a Helicopter Instrument Rating that stays on your pilot certificate BUT you still HAVE TO MEET THE RECENCY REQUIREMENTS in order to exercise the privileges of that rating ... if you do not maintain the currency then you have to do a flight with a CFII to renew those privileges ... having said that it does seem easier to us here BUT they do have a very much more workable system and it has proved its worth over time.

Cheers
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 02:18
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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Rest in Peace
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 03:11
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reasons

Freewheel,
Thank you for correcting me; I was unaware of the fact that there were two seperate MR strikes in two seperate helicopters. As I said, it was a great dinner!

Sarcs, Ledsled;

Just hold on a minute fellas. I have no interest in entering into your war with CASA.
It should come as no surprise that Richard Green's epistles should be in support of his own position. It would have been ludicrous if his missives were presented in some other way.
That; however, makes neither Richard nor CASA (nor anyone else for that matter) either erroneous or correct.

Similarly, I am not trying to relate the entire proceedings of the AAT. I just found the information of interest. As I have also said, we will have to wait for the report of this tragic accident to commence to understand the trail of events.

As for 'a priori'; theoretical deduction is commonly used in the construction of test flying programmes, for instance. You get the test points and then you go out, fly them and seek evidence (the 'scientific method') that the theoretical is demonstrable in the practical.

It does not mean that 'a priori' predictions are always of less value. Somethings you either cannot or do not want to test in the air, or are items that cannot be faithfully replicated in a simulator.

'Evidence', 'demonstration' are the things that you achieve; never 'proof' unless it is 'proof' of the catastrophic; something that inevitably leads to disaster and must be avoided by all means.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 10:08
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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thomas coupling

Thomas coupling you are a ********
What are you telepathic?
How do you or anyone else know what occurred as yet
Stop flogging the dead before we know what went on
Get a frigging hobby or something
Do you get off on hearing (seeing) yourself in print or something?
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 11:04
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Moderators, time to put a leash on Thomas, too many warm beers I think. Show some respect.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 11:52
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Condolences to all those lost, and with all due respect but repairing rotor blades with epoxy, such a critical part of the aircraft, I mean, that is just absolute madness!
MajorLemond,
Could you please re-read previous posts, and today's Australian.

The temp. field repair was made to manufacturer's instructions for continuing airworthiness, using materials as specified by the manufacturer.

When the blades were returned to the factory for overhaul, no further work was required on the temp. repair, and it was certified and released for return to service, as was.

Does that really sound like "absolute madness" by the manufacturer/type certificate holder or by Richard Green.

Tootle pip!!

PS: The F-27 was the first aircraft to use extensive epoxy bonding (trade name, Araldite for one chemical company, tradename Redux for Fokker.) in primary structures. It was the primary reason for the for the tremendous fatigue resistance and long life of the F-27 structure. I doubt there is any modern aircraft flying that doesn't use "Araldite" metal to metal bonding --- by whatever proprietary name.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 16:01
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Onetrack ...you sound like a slightly more "chippy" version of our TC .....
It is amazing what a mean spirited bunch helicopter pilots are ...i would have thought there would be some sort of bond that stopped people from making accusations about a fellow ( dead ) pilot regarding his final flight . The theory that there is no smoke without fire is one that only the really low grade people use . I very much doubt the discussion would have been the same if he had not have been rich and owned his own machine . Some of you need to get over your own inadequacy and stop being jealous and judgmental . IF he flew when he should not have and it was pilot error im sure the AAIB will find out but give the bloke a chance !!!
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 19:42
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Well said nigelh - no shortage of commentators here who'd qualify for a job with the regulator !~

Rest in peace Richard and Carol.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 20:17
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Thanks for that, chaps.
I also found TC's pontifications, in particular, objectionable at this stage.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 20:19
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Sad to see a thread on this respectable forum descend into the depths of ignorant regulator bashing. You don't want rules and regulations? Piss off, and don't fly in my airspace, then.
Forget the salacious gossip and intrigue, the media hype, the half truths. Have some respect for the families left griefstricken by this accident, let the investigators do their work, and be done with it. Forget the personalities and empty speculation. It's just a tragic, fatal accident.
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Old 12th Nov 2015, 21:02
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Nigel well said.
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Old 13th Nov 2015, 00:50
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Call me sceptical, but . . . .

Quote - "The temp. field repair was made to manufacturer's instructions for continuing airworthiness, using materials as specified by the manufacturer.

When the blades were returned to the factory for overhaul, no further work was required on the temp. repair, and it was certified and released for return to service, as was." - End quote

And the source of this information is/was?
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Old 13th Nov 2015, 01:20
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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It is amazing what a mean spirited bunch helicopter pilots are ...i would have thought there would be some sort of bond that stopped people from making accusations about a fellow ( dead ) pilot regarding his final flight .
Yes - especially those who claim he was their friend. If he had friends like that then I'd hate to see his enemies!

DF.
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Old 13th Nov 2015, 05:02
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And the source of this information is/was?
Red Line.

CASA!! That good enough for you?

You will also probably find it in the AAT transcripts of evidence in the case that Richard won, requiring CASA to reinstate his MAs.

Tootle pip!!
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Old 13th Nov 2015, 08:38
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Poor Richard, he was very smart, he was a nuclear physicist. Poor Richard, he was very outspoken on issues he believed in. Poor Richard, he was very critical of bureaucracy and red tape and probably felt he was above all those menial rules for stooped people. Poor Richard, it looks like his demise was caused by simple CFIT, something CASA has been trying very hard to reduce the frequency of.

Seen it before with a friend's super smart mate who done himself in during a take-off in a very benign Cessna 172.

It was the primary reason for the for the tremendous fatigue resistance and long life of the F-27 structure.
Not quite, according to our resident blamax who has taken the time to enlightened us all on bonding techniques, it's all in the application.
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Old 13th Nov 2015, 12:41
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Look guys, I know there are some close mates of Green on here. But can we remove emotion from the equation for a moment and look at hard facts. Pilots are supposed to bias more towards facts and less towards emotion when dispensing their profession, so let's keep it like that when we look at what is presented to us.

A friend of mine died in the Police Strathclyde crash, an associate died clipping a crane in Vauxhall, London. I looked at the facts and even though they were my colleagues - the facts painted a very ugly picture.

In this instance, I have been reading a lot about this persons track record between him and CASA and his earlier "incidents".

I can't speak for the mentality of aussie pilots and their industry but I would definitely align it to ours because of the synergies we have between our relative societies.
Now in the UK, ANYONE who clacks a blade, not once but twice - and then attempts a field repair as an UNqualified helicopter engineer - and then continues in flight; is most definitely guilty of gross negligence as a pilot. Someone who nearly collides with / blows over other a/c is guilty of negligence .
Someone who flies his a/c in IFR conditions without the correct qualifications is guilty of negligence and poor airmanship.

All of the above paints a picture.

In this country, any/all of these attributes (or lack of them) would describe a very very unprofessional approach to one's trade, I would suggest.

Now - either all the sources (newspapers/colleague interpretations/reports/casa statements are untrue or unsubstantiated - in that case I profusely apologise for second guessing and retract any distasteful comments. OR
They are true and this man was a liability to all around him and the industry is safer now that he has 'moved on'.

Out of curiosity who witnessed himlanding for a while before he took off again back into the bad weather? How is it known that he did this, so far out in the boondocks?
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Old 13th Nov 2015, 13:10
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Pilots are supposed to bias more towards facts and less towards emotion
Absolutely, I'm with you regarding the posthumely promotion of them dip**** US-army pilots, but let's look at the facts here:

A)
Thomas coupling
Now in the UK, ANYONE who clacks a blade, not once but twice - and then attempts a field repair as an UNqualified helicopter engineer - and then continues in flight; is most definitely guilty of gross negligence as a pilot.
True, but he was qualified (acc. to Eurocopter) and his repaired blades didn't need any mod. by the manufacturer.

B)
Thomas coupling Someone who nearly collides with / blows over other a/c is guilty of negligence
True, and he's guilty of that.

C)
Thomas coupling
Someone who flies his a/c in IFR conditions without the correct qualifications is guilty of negligence and poor airmanship.
True, but we dont know that, yet. That short video clip of his passing over the videographer didn'tlook like IMC to me.

Case A) is on the border of calumny, especially coming from CASA. Looking at the facts everyone who - despite the facts - publicly claims, that back then he were flying a badly reapaired, unworthy a/c owes him an apology, CASA, you(?), all the rich-guy bashers led by emotion instead of fact.

Case B) is plain and simple true, he did behave like an asshole sometimes.

Case C) is totally open to investigation, facts are currently unknown, and, as you stated correctly, we ought grant him benefit of doubt until proven otherwise.

Which currently(!) leaves us with an definitely sometimes ignorant, selfish, but nervertheless in many cases very cacpable pilot/mechanic.

Last edited by Reely340; 13th Nov 2015 at 13:47.
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