Auto's into forestry
Thread Starter
Auto's into forestry
I've heard different opinions about how to end the auto into forrestry i.e. large tree areas with no open space to land, and would like to throw it out to the guys flying over these jungle what they think about when flying over them...
Sometimes it is unavoidable so we can rule out going around...
Sometimes it is unavoidable so we can rule out going around...
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PPrune
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nose up, tail down would be my preferred option - try and use the tail as a crumple zone. This seems to be the "safest" way to me.
Landing on the canopy and keeping it there sounds almost impossible - nose down involves speed, not a good thing when strapped in and facing the ground!
Landing on the canopy and keeping it there sounds almost impossible - nose down involves speed, not a good thing when strapped in and facing the ground!
An old forestry pilot gave me a tip one time that saved my bacon later on. The topic was "what to do if there ain't nothing but Trees under you...".
He said when it sank into your adrenal charged brain that you were going into the trees no matter what you did.....the best bet was to get there with bags of Rotor RPM and in a good position to have some control over the ending. His view was far better to make a good crash landing into the trees rather than a very poor crash landing just shy of a clearing.
One evening just at Sundown in Alaska....late in the Summer Season when it actually got dark....I lofted off Mount Neuhaeuser near Tok. I had taken a TV Repair crew up to work on the Village TV repeater. As I hovered for takeoff...an unusual but not terminal change in sound to the engine was heard....did several power changes and noted everything was still hunky dory....and departed.
Upon lowering the Collective to start the descent.....the Donk Died Abruptly....leaving me at about 9,000 feet too high for things ilke that to happen. After determining I was now in an unpowered Gyrocraft....I began a search for a place to park.....and determined there was not much in the way of options beyond big tall trees or short small bushy trees. After a bit i did see a bit of a clearing.....no big trees and lots of very soft looking Pussy Willows. I opted for that cushy looking spot.
Well into the fun and games it became very plain I was not going to make it to the clearing of choice....and from out of the remnants of an alcohol ravaged brain....came the guys advice. "Put the Collective down....get to your max glide airspeed.....and when committed to where you are going...go full down on the Collective....do a hard Flare....build your Main Rotor RPM as much as you can....and as your airspeed runs out pick the softest thing you can to land onto/into."
I did that....and as I was going to make that last decision....I saw there was a small line of trees between me and the clearing filled with Pussy Willow....and having flown the same aircraft all Season....knew....in my heart....I could do a Pop UP over the trees.....and did so. I crossed the line of trees....leveled the aircraft and did a vertical authoritative landing into the Pussy Willows.
Two days later after helping with an engine replacement...I flew the aircraft out of the bush and finished the Season. Not a mark on the aircraft shy seat cover damage.
Key lesson learned was to get to the end with lots of Rotor RPM...and with enough airspeed to be able to maneuver the aircraft to the best place possible. In logged over forest areas....pay very much attention to old tree stumps...as they can be hard on your hind end if they punch up through the bottom of the aircraft.....or cause you to roll over if only one skid or wheel lands on them.
New young trees are good targets.....very tall...hard trees are bad targets.
Land vertically....perhaps as some have suggested...tail first....but I would suggest landing flat. If the nose falls through and the tail hangs up....the shorter a distance the nose (and you) have to fall the better.
There are two places to look for when in hilly country....Tops of hills or in the creek bottoms....as they tend to be flatter than the hillsides....and rolling down a hillside is not considered good form.
He said when it sank into your adrenal charged brain that you were going into the trees no matter what you did.....the best bet was to get there with bags of Rotor RPM and in a good position to have some control over the ending. His view was far better to make a good crash landing into the trees rather than a very poor crash landing just shy of a clearing.
One evening just at Sundown in Alaska....late in the Summer Season when it actually got dark....I lofted off Mount Neuhaeuser near Tok. I had taken a TV Repair crew up to work on the Village TV repeater. As I hovered for takeoff...an unusual but not terminal change in sound to the engine was heard....did several power changes and noted everything was still hunky dory....and departed.
Upon lowering the Collective to start the descent.....the Donk Died Abruptly....leaving me at about 9,000 feet too high for things ilke that to happen. After determining I was now in an unpowered Gyrocraft....I began a search for a place to park.....and determined there was not much in the way of options beyond big tall trees or short small bushy trees. After a bit i did see a bit of a clearing.....no big trees and lots of very soft looking Pussy Willows. I opted for that cushy looking spot.
Well into the fun and games it became very plain I was not going to make it to the clearing of choice....and from out of the remnants of an alcohol ravaged brain....came the guys advice. "Put the Collective down....get to your max glide airspeed.....and when committed to where you are going...go full down on the Collective....do a hard Flare....build your Main Rotor RPM as much as you can....and as your airspeed runs out pick the softest thing you can to land onto/into."
I did that....and as I was going to make that last decision....I saw there was a small line of trees between me and the clearing filled with Pussy Willow....and having flown the same aircraft all Season....knew....in my heart....I could do a Pop UP over the trees.....and did so. I crossed the line of trees....leveled the aircraft and did a vertical authoritative landing into the Pussy Willows.
Two days later after helping with an engine replacement...I flew the aircraft out of the bush and finished the Season. Not a mark on the aircraft shy seat cover damage.
Key lesson learned was to get to the end with lots of Rotor RPM...and with enough airspeed to be able to maneuver the aircraft to the best place possible. In logged over forest areas....pay very much attention to old tree stumps...as they can be hard on your hind end if they punch up through the bottom of the aircraft.....or cause you to roll over if only one skid or wheel lands on them.
New young trees are good targets.....very tall...hard trees are bad targets.
Land vertically....perhaps as some have suggested...tail first....but I would suggest landing flat. If the nose falls through and the tail hangs up....the shorter a distance the nose (and you) have to fall the better.
There are two places to look for when in hilly country....Tops of hills or in the creek bottoms....as they tend to be flatter than the hillsides....and rolling down a hillside is not considered good form.
Last edited by SASless; 11th May 2012 at 17:52.
Go in flat between big trees. That's what we were told on Borneo and one of ours that went in in Malaya did just that. Tail first means that the helicopter will be going backwards into the timber and the first obstruction is going to tip the tail up and give you a good view of the ground. When you are flat you have some idea where to put the tail.
There is an awful lot of energy used up by the main rotor as it beats itself to death whilst you are falling through the branches so you only really drop the last few feet. The aircraft structure is strong enough to save you then.
There is an awful lot of energy used up by the main rotor as it beats itself to death whilst you are falling through the branches so you only really drop the last few feet. The aircraft structure is strong enough to save you then.
Thread Starter
That is why this website is so fantastic.............
You get different views and experiences.
SAS.... I enjoyed your story - you should write a book one day because you have an enjoyable way of telling it, and I think you have a lot of stories that youngsters can learn from.....
If only I had some soft Pussy Willows to land on. I'm flying over dense jungle in central africa so it's thick with no "pussy" landing options.... Ideally it would be nice to have a twin, but this is Africa...
2 options...
You get different views and experiences.
SAS.... I enjoyed your story - you should write a book one day because you have an enjoyable way of telling it, and I think you have a lot of stories that youngsters can learn from.....
If only I had some soft Pussy Willows to land on. I'm flying over dense jungle in central africa so it's thick with no "pussy" landing options.... Ideally it would be nice to have a twin, but this is Africa...
2 options...
- Tail in first. Heard that this was the prefered method because once your blades start hitting timber the cab apparently rolls over...and you're going down upsite down. But, The thought of all those t/r rods, shafts, gearboxes and engines coming through the back wall just don't excite me too much.
- Try and land it on the canopy inbetween the big trees and see what comes next....
