Helicopter charter
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Helicopter charter
Evening Gents,
I have ventured out of my safety zone, the bizjet forum just south of here, to see if I can find answers to some questions regarding chartering a helicopter.
To make a long story longer...
I am currently researching possibilities for a project scheduled for May or June of 2011. For this I need some information about technical issues and pricing.
I have put my scope on a Bell 206, without really knowing too much about helicopters at all.
I need transportation for 2 persons, possibility to either open or remove door or window for photographing - is this possible? I am a seasoned photographer, but only from fixed wing aircrafts. Using handheld equipment.
What is the REALISTIC time aloft for a Bell 206? a ballpark figure will do.
It will be most convenient (read cheap) to charter from an operator in Northern Scotland, Aberdeen, Inverness due to proximity to my target locations etc. Any recommendations who to talk to?
What is the going hourly rate wet charter for a Bell 206? or similar helicopter.
Am I correct that the Bell 206 is single pilot ie. possible to sit in the right seat to facilitate communication with the pilot?
Should I even consider an R44 when substantial overwaterflying is part of the project?
Your kind help in answering the above is highly appreciated.
Best regards,
PicMas
I have ventured out of my safety zone, the bizjet forum just south of here, to see if I can find answers to some questions regarding chartering a helicopter.
To make a long story longer...
I am currently researching possibilities for a project scheduled for May or June of 2011. For this I need some information about technical issues and pricing.
I have put my scope on a Bell 206, without really knowing too much about helicopters at all.
I need transportation for 2 persons, possibility to either open or remove door or window for photographing - is this possible? I am a seasoned photographer, but only from fixed wing aircrafts. Using handheld equipment.
What is the REALISTIC time aloft for a Bell 206? a ballpark figure will do.
It will be most convenient (read cheap) to charter from an operator in Northern Scotland, Aberdeen, Inverness due to proximity to my target locations etc. Any recommendations who to talk to?
What is the going hourly rate wet charter for a Bell 206? or similar helicopter.
Am I correct that the Bell 206 is single pilot ie. possible to sit in the right seat to facilitate communication with the pilot?
Should I even consider an R44 when substantial overwaterflying is part of the project?
Your kind help in answering the above is highly appreciated.
Best regards,
PicMas
welcome to world of rotary - may I suggest you contact the British Helicopter Association through their website - section on charter.
Charter :: British Helicopter Association
web site will also provide details of suitably located BHA member who could advise further.
Charter :: British Helicopter Association
web site will also provide details of suitably located BHA member who could advise further.
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PicMas, my strong recommendation if you are in the north of Scotland is to talk to Dave Brown at PDG Helicopters in Inverness. Very professional organisation with significant experience in aerial filming and photography.
- PDG Helicopters - Helicopter Charter, Lifting, Filming and Surveying, Passenger Transport and Scenic Tours
+44 (0)1667 462740
Mc H
- PDG Helicopters - Helicopter Charter, Lifting, Filming and Surveying, Passenger Transport and Scenic Tours
+44 (0)1667 462740
Mc H
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Out of curiosity, why are you set on a 206 and not a R44?
The overwater safety (assuming both are fitted with floats, etc) is probably far more dependant on the pilot than the aircraft, and assuming a suitable competent pilot, about the same for either. Endurance is usually of the order of 3-ish hours for small helicopters, assuming you have the weight allowance to fill the tanks. R44s are usually cheaper than 206s.
R44 speed is slightly higher than 206 (so you get where you're going faster), but there's not much in it. You can remove doors from a R44, I assume you can from a 206 too.
I'd certainly get quotes for both, see how they compare.
The overwater safety (assuming both are fitted with floats, etc) is probably far more dependant on the pilot than the aircraft, and assuming a suitable competent pilot, about the same for either. Endurance is usually of the order of 3-ish hours for small helicopters, assuming you have the weight allowance to fill the tanks. R44s are usually cheaper than 206s.
R44 speed is slightly higher than 206 (so you get where you're going faster), but there's not much in it. You can remove doors from a R44, I assume you can from a 206 too.
I'd certainly get quotes for both, see how they compare.
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Don't forget - with doors off VNE (speed) reduces.
e.g. Bell 206:-
With rear doors off down to 87 knots
With front doors off 69 knots.
This will significantly reduce your range if you are going location to location.
Better to use opening window with handheld gear.
If, as you say, substantial overwater flying is involved, you will need either a float equipped aircraft, or if you are away from engine-off distance from land, a twin-enginned helicopter - significant price increase.
e.g. Bell 206:-
With rear doors off down to 87 knots
With front doors off 69 knots.
This will significantly reduce your range if you are going location to location.
Better to use opening window with handheld gear.
If, as you say, substantial overwater flying is involved, you will need either a float equipped aircraft, or if you are away from engine-off distance from land, a twin-enginned helicopter - significant price increase.
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To clarify a bit.
The overwater flying portion is to and from the location. Once there it will all be over land/within gliding distance.
The trip overwater is about 240NM (about 200 over water) which will give an estimated flight time of around 2hrs each way.
The R44 is definitely a viable option, never knew they existed with floats. Like I initially wrote, I am completely unfamiliar with helicopters, so no particular reason for locking the focus on a B206.
Could the ferry flight be completed with the doors in place and the remove them once on location? Can it be done with use of simple tools or is an engineer required?
The overwater flying portion is to and from the location. Once there it will all be over land/within gliding distance.
The trip overwater is about 240NM (about 200 over water) which will give an estimated flight time of around 2hrs each way.
The R44 is definitely a viable option, never knew they existed with floats. Like I initially wrote, I am completely unfamiliar with helicopters, so no particular reason for locking the focus on a B206.
Could the ferry flight be completed with the doors in place and the remove them once on location? Can it be done with use of simple tools or is an engineer required?
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You are into serious distance over water with 200 nm. You will need a twin with floats, a liferaft, probably immersion suits for passengers etc.
Also your destination will need fuel as you are unlikely to have a helicopter with 4 hours transit fuel + task fuel + reserves.
You will need to discuss the whole task in a very detailed way to an operator as this will be quite complicated. I would recommend speaking to PDG in Inverness as they will be able to give you a ballpark figure for you to start budgeting on. This will not be cheap though.
Also your destination will need fuel as you are unlikely to have a helicopter with 4 hours transit fuel + task fuel + reserves.
You will need to discuss the whole task in a very detailed way to an operator as this will be quite complicated. I would recommend speaking to PDG in Inverness as they will be able to give you a ballpark figure for you to start budgeting on. This will not be cheap though.
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I did have a very pleasant conversation with PDG, that cleared things up a bit. Seems a twin engine helicopter will be required which, in return, will make the project prohibitively expensive.
Fuel is available at the destination, its the distance overwater that blocks the use of a (for this project) reasonably priced helicopter.
Looks like I will be rambling my way across in a C182 sweating in survival suit and carrying a raft.
Helicopter would have been perfect, but is not an option.
I thank you for your kind input, it is truly appreciated, though it has been potentially expensive - now I REALLY want a PPL(H)
Best regards,
MAS
Fuel is available at the destination, its the distance overwater that blocks the use of a (for this project) reasonably priced helicopter.
Looks like I will be rambling my way across in a C182 sweating in survival suit and carrying a raft.
Helicopter would have been perfect, but is not an option.
I thank you for your kind input, it is truly appreciated, though it has been potentially expensive - now I REALLY want a PPL(H)
Best regards,
MAS
Highly amusing reading!
Too bad you need to use a Single-stuckwing, instead of a helicopter due to the regs.
I know of instances where single-Squirrels have been doing aerial photos of off-shore installations in the north-sea.
Now, how come would it be legal in a C-182 by the way?
Maybe the offshore boys will be happy to offer you a good deal on a 332 or S-92, as it might meet the regs.
Too bad you need to use a Single-stuckwing, instead of a helicopter due to the regs.
I know of instances where single-Squirrels have been doing aerial photos of off-shore installations in the north-sea.
Now, how come would it be legal in a C-182 by the way?
Maybe the offshore boys will be happy to offer you a good deal on a 332 or S-92, as it might meet the regs.
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Or......
You could seek out a willing private owner of a floated helicopter and talk them into doing this as a private flight (cost sharing only allowed, you can't pay the full rate).
Imersion suit and raft still a good idea
Floated R44, EC120, Jet Ranger (if fuel available at the destination) possible
Fly there doors on - in the warm. Refuel, take the doors off and fly the picture sortie. Land and refuel, refit the doors and return.
Simples!
(If you can find a willing owner)
You could seek out a willing private owner of a floated helicopter and talk them into doing this as a private flight (cost sharing only allowed, you can't pay the full rate).
Imersion suit and raft still a good idea
Floated R44, EC120, Jet Ranger (if fuel available at the destination) possible
Fly there doors on - in the warm. Refuel, take the doors off and fly the picture sortie. Land and refuel, refit the doors and return.
Simples!
(If you can find a willing owner)
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You could seek out a willing private owner of a floated helicopter and talk them into doing this as a private flight
It is also the reason that accidents happen. PPL's are by definition not qualified to the same level. Photography involves low/slow or hovering at levels inside the avoid curve. If there was an accident, do you think that the insurance would cover anything, knowing that this was in essence a commercial flight? Personal injury claims, 3rd party claims, aircraft damage claims?
902Jon
Whilst I share the sentiments (as an AOC holder) there is nothing to say that the private owner may not be a CPL or an ATPL holder, and quite capable of flying the sortie.
But the concept of rejecting a single engine helicopter for an extended overwater flight yet proposing a single engine fixed wing appears quite bizarre to me. Do the UK Regs really allow that?
Whilst I share the sentiments (as an AOC holder) there is nothing to say that the private owner may not be a CPL or an ATPL holder, and quite capable of flying the sortie.
But the concept of rejecting a single engine helicopter for an extended overwater flight yet proposing a single engine fixed wing appears quite bizarre to me. Do the UK Regs really allow that?
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OK John - I agree that a CPL/ATPL owner could do this. Yet again though, why would they on a cost share basis? If they owned & operate the aircraft it is usually because they they have an AOC for commercial operations. Also, with respect, I suspect you probably don't realise how expensive AOC's are in EASA/CAA land in comparison to CASA nowadays. The Belgrano doesn't fund itself.
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I too ask Why would a CPL/ATPL(H) holder want to do a job like this (and I mean job), on a "cost sharing" basis?
He is going to "pay his share" of the costs of a float equipped aircraft and safety equipment hire, for the benefit of someone he has never met before? I doubt it.
I also have a good idea what the insurance company would say about it.
He is going to "pay his share" of the costs of a float equipped aircraft and safety equipment hire, for the benefit of someone he has never met before? I doubt it.
I also have a good idea what the insurance company would say about it.