Air-Car, Anyone?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: USA
Age: 75
Posts: 3,012
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
After watching that, the whole Moller project looks more and more like a very elaborate hoax.
The advanced 300mph Skycar 'on the market by 2010'? Sorry to be such a cynic, but snowballs in hell have got better chances than that...
The advanced 300mph Skycar 'on the market by 2010'? Sorry to be such a cynic, but snowballs in hell have got better chances than that...
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Missouri, USA
Age: 58
Posts: 235
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
aircar
You can still call me a skeptic as it's difficult to believe that either will be more than just another kit for sale. But every bit of awesome technology that we take for granted today started somewhere.
Watch a few Modern Marvels on The History Channel and then say that you're convinced that fifty years from now we'll still be flying the same aircraft we are today.
Watch a few Modern Marvels on The History Channel and then say that you're convinced that fifty years from now we'll still be flying the same aircraft we are today.
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Wales
Age: 38
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I remember reading an article about the skycars back when I started high school. Sounded like a gimmick then... a lot of people were saying it would be a flash in the pan.
10 years on and the idea and the company are still up and running. I believe I read somewhere that they've hovered them and were going to start the high speed flight testing...
Who knows. I doubt they'll ever become the new car, but as a replacepent for some helicopters maybe...
I wouldn't mind having CPL(skycar) on my licence!
10 years on and the idea and the company are still up and running. I believe I read somewhere that they've hovered them and were going to start the high speed flight testing...
Who knows. I doubt they'll ever become the new car, but as a replacepent for some helicopters maybe...
I wouldn't mind having CPL(skycar) on my licence!
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Wales
Age: 38
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Think the idea was so many engines one going wouldn't be a problem. Believe there's also a parachute in there to bring it down safely even if they all went (complete fuel starvation for example) - Cirrus CAPS style.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: USA
Age: 75
Posts: 3,012
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The hidden agenda is that there is nothing new in the Moeller stuff. Lots of little fans at high disk loading moving air. Little risk, really, but enormous power requirements, enormous fuel bill, and lots of maintenance. It is likely that a Moeller air car would take 4 times the power of a helicopter with similar payload.
No great advancement there, just a guy who can sell the concept to folks who have no idea what questions to ask.
No great advancement there, just a guy who can sell the concept to folks who have no idea what questions to ask.
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Wales
Age: 38
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just had a look at their website. Claimed 275 mph cruise with Vne 375, and a fuel consumption of 20mpg.
Any fool can come up with numbers I realise - achieving them's another thing.
If they do though... well I don't think there's too many questions left to ask. The numbers speak for themselves
I say good luck to the guy!
Any fool can come up with numbers I realise - achieving them's another thing.
If they do though... well I don't think there's too many questions left to ask. The numbers speak for themselves
I say good luck to the guy!
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Port Townsend,WA. USA
Posts: 440
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Parachutes are old fashioned
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: USA (Naturalized but bits still British!)
Posts: 103
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just wanted to let those contemplating buying one know, that I have a large oceanside property in Indiana available on which they can store their investment, (nice views of the mountains) - cheap rates...honest!
Are you talking about the Skycar (with 4 engines/fans) or the M200 thing (with a few more)?
For the former, I bet that even one of the engines failing will be critical. If it loses one of the fans whilst in the hover, do you think that there's still going to be 'equilibrium' of lift? I'm no aerodynamicist (obviously!) but it doesn't look like it will remain very stable to me...
And as for a parachute? (Ballistic or not) This will probably work fine if you are at a couple of thousand feet (unless you're doing 300mph at the time, of course!). But what exactly happens if you're <500ft? I can't see a parachute being very effective at these sorts of heights...
Like I've said already, 'thanks, but no thanks'!
For the former, I bet that even one of the engines failing will be critical. If it loses one of the fans whilst in the hover, do you think that there's still going to be 'equilibrium' of lift? I'm no aerodynamicist (obviously!) but it doesn't look like it will remain very stable to me...
And as for a parachute? (Ballistic or not) This will probably work fine if you are at a couple of thousand feet (unless you're doing 300mph at the time, of course!). But what exactly happens if you're <500ft? I can't see a parachute being very effective at these sorts of heights...
Like I've said already, 'thanks, but no thanks'!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, UK
Posts: 1,334
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The latest development on the Moller theme seems to have sprouted some strange aerodynamic apendages either side of the fuselage. I wonder if these could be connected to the generation of mysterious lifting forces?
http://www.moller.com/m400.htm
Perhaps another futuristic evolution of the concept could be that one of those little rotors becomes larger, sheds its coanda effect empennage, and repositions itself above the fuselage.
So all those shareholders are making the future happen... again.
http://www.moller.com/m400.htm
Perhaps another futuristic evolution of the concept could be that one of those little rotors becomes larger, sheds its coanda effect empennage, and repositions itself above the fuselage.
So all those shareholders are making the future happen... again.
Last edited by Graviman; 1st Sep 2007 at 09:31. Reason: speeling mistaike
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Wales
Age: 38
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was talking about the Skycar. Maybe I should point out I know nothing about this aircraft apart from 10 year old memories, a BBC News video and a 2 minute look through the website. Who knows how well it'll work...
What I am saying though is that I hope it DOES work. New ideas are never popular. This company has made big claims and who knows whether it'll ever live up to them; I hope it does. In 1903 did anyone believe that a hundred years later over a million people would be airborne at any given moment?
What I am saying though is that I hope it DOES work. New ideas are never popular. This company has made big claims and who knows whether it'll ever live up to them; I hope it does. In 1903 did anyone believe that a hundred years later over a million people would be airborne at any given moment?
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Not here
Posts: 174
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Carnage....complete and utter carnage !! there could be some very interesting police pursuits going on tho, or some muppet decides to drive straight through Heathrow to take a short cut to McDonalds???
SL
SL
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Downwind
Posts: 348
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Skycar etc
I have to admit that when I look at the Skycar or any of the other developments of the concept, I find it hard not to think of seeing one go by one day and shouting "Pull!"
The one thing that always brings down the Moller concept (sorry for the bad pun) is all of those little two-stroke engines beating their hearts out simultaneously. ...And all the dead dinosaurs that have to feed them. ...And the problem of one (or more) of them quitting at exactly the wrong time. Nope, it doesn't work very well with conventional powerplants driving the fans.
But what if...?
What if there were some alternate source of power for the fans? I didn't dream this up (although I like to dream) but I've seen the idea of small direct-drive power sources that could be mounted right on the wheel of a car - at all four corners, say - freeing up the area that *used* to be occupied by the engine, fuel tank, etc. Such "power sources" would have to be of some so-far-unknown design and material. But who says it can't or won't happen?
We shouldn't get so pompous as to think that everything that's already been invented is all that's ever going to be invented. Or that future inventions will always be offsprings and outgrowths of existing technology. There will be some energy breakthrough that renders the infernal internal combustion engine obsolete and facilitates machines like the Moller SkyCar...some day...hopefully in our lifetimes although perhaps not, which would be a big shame and disappointment for me. Remember, it was Leonardo da Vinci that dreamt of the helicopter. And he never saw it invented either. Let's just hope that there are still big dreamers out there.
But what if...?
What if there were some alternate source of power for the fans? I didn't dream this up (although I like to dream) but I've seen the idea of small direct-drive power sources that could be mounted right on the wheel of a car - at all four corners, say - freeing up the area that *used* to be occupied by the engine, fuel tank, etc. Such "power sources" would have to be of some so-far-unknown design and material. But who says it can't or won't happen?
We shouldn't get so pompous as to think that everything that's already been invented is all that's ever going to be invented. Or that future inventions will always be offsprings and outgrowths of existing technology. There will be some energy breakthrough that renders the infernal internal combustion engine obsolete and facilitates machines like the Moller SkyCar...some day...hopefully in our lifetimes although perhaps not, which would be a big shame and disappointment for me. Remember, it was Leonardo da Vinci that dreamt of the helicopter. And he never saw it invented either. Let's just hope that there are still big dreamers out there.
