Whats Happening in the Torres Straits
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why all the anger???
High NR
You say Australian(Marine) were a highly respected company taking it to the fore for Aus.
Australian(Reef Helicopters) were also a very respected helicopter company on the up and up in the Australian Industry. Yet merge these two powerhouses of Australian industry and for some reason it all turns to great Aussie roo poo.
Did the owners/directors of Australian ever take the time to seriously view who they had placed their trust in to run this company and perhaps consider that here is where the problems lie?
Or perhaps it is the owners/directers who are having too much micro management input and not letting managers do their job by blocking them at every turn?
Consider this and perhaps you will find reason for anger grasshopper!
Confucious
You say Australian(Marine) were a highly respected company taking it to the fore for Aus.
Australian(Reef Helicopters) were also a very respected helicopter company on the up and up in the Australian Industry. Yet merge these two powerhouses of Australian industry and for some reason it all turns to great Aussie roo poo.
Did the owners/directors of Australian ever take the time to seriously view who they had placed their trust in to run this company and perhaps consider that here is where the problems lie?
Or perhaps it is the owners/directers who are having too much micro management input and not letting managers do their job by blocking them at every turn?
Consider this and perhaps you will find reason for anger grasshopper!
Confucious
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Straylya mate
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
High NR, hope you did well at the pokies.
The tree shaking comment was made in the early days of the 412 on TI. Work out the spruker from that.
I also have heard that another pilot from the McKay base has moved and he is definately moving up.
Some very good comments from Rotorwing, all major factors in the state of the AH Torres Strait operation. You have to wonder though, why can't or why won't the management of AH identify the real cause of the mass exodus? Do they believe "it will be right on the day", "we'll get by" ?
From the info I have got, the problem for a lot of the people at the coalface is the lack of integrity of the management in conducting the operation safely and looking after their most valuable asset, THE CREW.
The lack of confidence the, (money making), crews have in the management to at least do the right thing by them is the biggest incentive to move to a better, more transparent operation with fair dinkum people managers.
One of the "magestic" visitors from the head office once said, " if they don't like it they will vote with their feet". Hey, the Ballots are in!
The tree shaking comment was made in the early days of the 412 on TI. Work out the spruker from that.
I also have heard that another pilot from the McKay base has moved and he is definately moving up.
Some very good comments from Rotorwing, all major factors in the state of the AH Torres Strait operation. You have to wonder though, why can't or why won't the management of AH identify the real cause of the mass exodus? Do they believe "it will be right on the day", "we'll get by" ?
From the info I have got, the problem for a lot of the people at the coalface is the lack of integrity of the management in conducting the operation safely and looking after their most valuable asset, THE CREW.
The lack of confidence the, (money making), crews have in the management to at least do the right thing by them is the biggest incentive to move to a better, more transparent operation with fair dinkum people managers.
One of the "magestic" visitors from the head office once said, " if they don't like it they will vote with their feet". Hey, the Ballots are in!
Last edited by Op's Normal; 6th Oct 2006 at 23:45. Reason: OOP's
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Straylya mate
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, Well, Well !
Here we are just 13 hours since my last post and news is that another two crewies are heading for the Horn Island door.
Their 412 is due to return to service in a week or so. Will AH have time to train and qualify the required numbers to service the Coastwatch contract?
Will the 412 have the magic wand passed over it to have it properly serviced with all inspections and first class maintenance done in the alloted time frame? Therefore filling the crews with the confidence in the machine that is required on overwater night operations.
Me thinks,,,,NOT !
Any word from the Brisbane management team ???
Again, me thinks,,,,NOT !
Here we are just 13 hours since my last post and news is that another two crewies are heading for the Horn Island door.
Their 412 is due to return to service in a week or so. Will AH have time to train and qualify the required numbers to service the Coastwatch contract?
Will the 412 have the magic wand passed over it to have it properly serviced with all inspections and first class maintenance done in the alloted time frame? Therefore filling the crews with the confidence in the machine that is required on overwater night operations.
Me thinks,,,,NOT !
Any word from the Brisbane management team ???
Again, me thinks,,,,NOT !
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How hard can it be??
OPS Normal
Well said. Couldn't agree more. Having worked around the world, I have trouble understanding why these guys can't see the problems they are creating for themselves right now. I believe someone said previously that the ballots are in, the voting has been with the feet, and still no reaction. Oh well, goodbye to a once good Australian company I suppose. Bring on the multi-nationals, at least they offer a decent renumeration for the nationals that still decide to work at home.
When you can pluck the petal from my hand Grasshopper............
Cheers
Rotor
Well said. Couldn't agree more. Having worked around the world, I have trouble understanding why these guys can't see the problems they are creating for themselves right now. I believe someone said previously that the ballots are in, the voting has been with the feet, and still no reaction. Oh well, goodbye to a once good Australian company I suppose. Bring on the multi-nationals, at least they offer a decent renumeration for the nationals that still decide to work at home.
When you can pluck the petal from my hand Grasshopper............
Cheers
Rotor
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Straylya mate
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rotor W,
To direct your parting words to the AH management should it read;
"When you pull your heads out of the sand Grasshopper..................."
See ya when I'm lookin' at ya.
Op's
To direct your parting words to the AH management should it read;
"When you pull your heads out of the sand Grasshopper..................."
See ya when I'm lookin' at ya.
Op's
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Straylya mate
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Had a chat the other day with some of the chaps who have moved on from AH.
It seems that regardless of which company these guys have gone to they have realised what a crap deal they were getting from AH.
As said in earlier posts that, it isn't always about money, the treatment they are getting from their new employers sounds very refreshing for them.
AH needs to take a leaf out of their books and learn where their most valuable asset is on the grand scale of things.
It seems that regardless of which company these guys have gone to they have realised what a crap deal they were getting from AH.
As said in earlier posts that, it isn't always about money, the treatment they are getting from their new employers sounds very refreshing for them.
AH needs to take a leaf out of their books and learn where their most valuable asset is on the grand scale of things.
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Maitland
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just wondering, who is doing the maintenance of this 412?
It's just that there are some accusations on this thred that they may not be doing it properly. Big call gentlemen, big call.
It's just that there are some accusations on this thred that they may not be doing it properly. Big call gentlemen, big call.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Oz
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The prophets of doom are left with egg on the face this time. Australians 412 has been back on Horn Island for over a week now and better than new - literally. The machine is flying better than it ever has. The 5000 hr inspection is a credit to everyone involved. Chook and his team at Redcliff lived up to their reputation for excellence and a few of the engineers and support staff from Australian can take a bow too. The entire exercise shows what can be done with careful planing and quality people.
If you don't believe me then ask the people at Horn Island. That's what I did.
If you don't believe me then ask the people at Horn Island. That's what I did.
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mcgowan
Not saying anything about the company DOING the job,,,heard all good things about them.
A/H are known to do ONLY the required maintenance and not any extra which there is always if you have a machine in the tropics all its life eg There would have to be SOME corrision,,,and knowing this machine there IS,
speaking to a bloke i know O/S,, he told me a 5000 hourly where he is takes about a min 3 months,,not 4 weeks
Not saying anything about the company DOING the job,,,heard all good things about them.
A/H are known to do ONLY the required maintenance and not any extra which there is always if you have a machine in the tropics all its life eg There would have to be SOME corrision,,,and knowing this machine there IS,
speaking to a bloke i know O/S,, he told me a 5000 hourly where he is takes about a min 3 months,,not 4 weeks
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
skid shoe
"Australians 412 has been back on Horn Island for over a week now and better than new - literally. The machine is flying better than it ever has."
S/S you sound as if you are in A/H management???????????
Well that wouldnt surprise me..... obviously the Redcliffe boys know what they are doing and A/Hs boys dont
Is that what you are saying skid shoe?
skid shoe you seem to be in the real know about this machine. Tell us what was this I heard ( from a reliable source in redcliff) about CORROSION in the left MAIN BEAM?? Doesnt sound good?
Was there any damage found to the head? Cracks etc??
At the last major they did at Horn, one of the I know everything engineers up there drop it on the concrete floor from a height of 60 cm ( enough to chip concrete away)
Pruners who are still at YHID will remember that incident.
Glad its up and going again..
"Australians 412 has been back on Horn Island for over a week now and better than new - literally. The machine is flying better than it ever has."
S/S you sound as if you are in A/H management???????????
Well that wouldnt surprise me..... obviously the Redcliffe boys know what they are doing and A/Hs boys dont
Is that what you are saying skid shoe?
skid shoe you seem to be in the real know about this machine. Tell us what was this I heard ( from a reliable source in redcliff) about CORROSION in the left MAIN BEAM?? Doesnt sound good?
Was there any damage found to the head? Cracks etc??
At the last major they did at Horn, one of the I know everything engineers up there drop it on the concrete floor from a height of 60 cm ( enough to chip concrete away)
Pruners who are still at YHID will remember that incident.
Glad its up and going again..
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Maitland
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
benq, trust me when I say I have no connection what so ever with AH. I know one pilot who works there and that's it.
I have dealt with and have been very very impressed with the engineers at Redcliffe. I just can't see them letting a machine go on line that needs work done on it. That's not the way they work. If they let it back in the air it is ready to go.
I have dealt with and have been very very impressed with the engineers at Redcliffe. I just can't see them letting a machine go on line that needs work done on it. That's not the way they work. If they let it back in the air it is ready to go.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Oz
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What's Your Problem
benq
Sorry to take so long to respond. Computer problems and family commitments have stopped me getting a reply to your questions posted any sooner. You asked if I am AH management.
Answer is no.
I won't say too much because I don't want my opinions mis-construed as anything other than just that - my opinion. Yes I do have a connection with Australian but it is not what I think you're implying and certainly not one that would make me post just to support the company. After nearly 30 years in the industry I've got "connections" in lots of places. I know most of the AH staff on Horn Island so this thread piqued my interest enough that I made a couple of phone calls. The things that I was told were relevent to the direction this thread was taking and I reported in my earlier post what I was told. There is nothing more to it.
I didn't post just to get into a pissing contest with you benq, but the general tone of your last post on this thread is an absolute insult to everyone that was involved in the heavy.
"Obviously the Redcliff boys know what they are doing and the A/H boys don't"........"Is that what you are saying skid shoe?"
Bloke you need to read my first post again. Those are your words champ - not mine. Don't try to put them into my mouth. I hope that one of the AH engineers knows who you are and gives you a black eye. You deserve it for a statement like that.
Those people, both Redcliff and AH alike, planned carefuly, worked bloody long hours and maintained a very high standard of workmanship right throughout the heavy. They deserve any praise that I gave them and probably more. I was able to see the job they did on RHJ over the last few days that the machine was at Redcliff. I was blown away that they still had so much enthusiasm for the task after 5 or 6 weeks of 11 or even 14 hour days, 7 days a week. The only reason Australian were able to get their 412 back on line so fast was that they managed to put together a dammed fine team of just the right people.
benq, you go on to talk about corrosion and cracks in the M/R head. If you know that they found corrosion then can I assume assume that you would know what was done about it? How bad was the corrosion? Was it within limits? Were the engineers able to blend out the corrosion and treat the area IAW the aircraft manuals or an approved repair scheme? Have Australian put an inspection in place to monitor the corrosion area? or do they even need to?
OR ARE YOU TRYING TO MAKE AN ORDINARY MAINTENANCE EVENT THAT WAS REACTED TO APPROPRIATELY OUT TO BE SOMETHING IT IS NOT?
As for the head being dropped. Mate that was a couple of years and close enough to 3000 hours ago. The head was inspected iaw all the right manuals and advice from Bell at the time. During the 5000 hr inspection just done, the head was sent to Helitech for O/H. That includes crack testing does it not. The old china plate running Helitechs O/H shop doesn't miss much. I doubt that there is a better man anywhere to do that sort of work. If he is prepaired to release the head then there is nothing wrong with it. Again I'll ask ARE YOU TRYING TO MAKE THINGS OUT TO BE SOMETHING THEY ARE NOT?
benq, reading back over this and various other threads that you have started or posted to, it is obvious that you have some real issues with Australian. I think that you have let your bitterness cloud your view. The over all tone of many of your posts is anti-AH but I think that this is the first time that you have actually attacked the boys and girls on the floor. You want AH to do better than you perceive them doing so far and yet when they do, you sink to new lows and attack the staff at the coal face. There are some pretty good people on the floor at Australian. They deserve better than the crap you are chucking their way. Keep having a go at Australians management if you must. I agree that they have brought a lot of it on themselves - BUT LEAVE THE STAFF ALONE.
Take what I have said here as constructive criticism. I don't know who you are (although I probably do know you - maybe even shared a beer or two outside the units at YHID). And I don't know your motivations, but if you continue to post the way that you have here, then the credability of anything you say is questionable. Why don't you enlighten us a little and tell us all why you are down on AH in such a big way.
skid shoe
PS: This will probably be my last post on rotorheads. The forum belongs to you pilots and engineering is my game. I'll go and play in my own forums.
Sorry to take so long to respond. Computer problems and family commitments have stopped me getting a reply to your questions posted any sooner. You asked if I am AH management.
Answer is no.
I won't say too much because I don't want my opinions mis-construed as anything other than just that - my opinion. Yes I do have a connection with Australian but it is not what I think you're implying and certainly not one that would make me post just to support the company. After nearly 30 years in the industry I've got "connections" in lots of places. I know most of the AH staff on Horn Island so this thread piqued my interest enough that I made a couple of phone calls. The things that I was told were relevent to the direction this thread was taking and I reported in my earlier post what I was told. There is nothing more to it.
I didn't post just to get into a pissing contest with you benq, but the general tone of your last post on this thread is an absolute insult to everyone that was involved in the heavy.
"Obviously the Redcliff boys know what they are doing and the A/H boys don't"........"Is that what you are saying skid shoe?"
Bloke you need to read my first post again. Those are your words champ - not mine. Don't try to put them into my mouth. I hope that one of the AH engineers knows who you are and gives you a black eye. You deserve it for a statement like that.
Those people, both Redcliff and AH alike, planned carefuly, worked bloody long hours and maintained a very high standard of workmanship right throughout the heavy. They deserve any praise that I gave them and probably more. I was able to see the job they did on RHJ over the last few days that the machine was at Redcliff. I was blown away that they still had so much enthusiasm for the task after 5 or 6 weeks of 11 or even 14 hour days, 7 days a week. The only reason Australian were able to get their 412 back on line so fast was that they managed to put together a dammed fine team of just the right people.
benq, you go on to talk about corrosion and cracks in the M/R head. If you know that they found corrosion then can I assume assume that you would know what was done about it? How bad was the corrosion? Was it within limits? Were the engineers able to blend out the corrosion and treat the area IAW the aircraft manuals or an approved repair scheme? Have Australian put an inspection in place to monitor the corrosion area? or do they even need to?
OR ARE YOU TRYING TO MAKE AN ORDINARY MAINTENANCE EVENT THAT WAS REACTED TO APPROPRIATELY OUT TO BE SOMETHING IT IS NOT?
As for the head being dropped. Mate that was a couple of years and close enough to 3000 hours ago. The head was inspected iaw all the right manuals and advice from Bell at the time. During the 5000 hr inspection just done, the head was sent to Helitech for O/H. That includes crack testing does it not. The old china plate running Helitechs O/H shop doesn't miss much. I doubt that there is a better man anywhere to do that sort of work. If he is prepaired to release the head then there is nothing wrong with it. Again I'll ask ARE YOU TRYING TO MAKE THINGS OUT TO BE SOMETHING THEY ARE NOT?
benq, reading back over this and various other threads that you have started or posted to, it is obvious that you have some real issues with Australian. I think that you have let your bitterness cloud your view. The over all tone of many of your posts is anti-AH but I think that this is the first time that you have actually attacked the boys and girls on the floor. You want AH to do better than you perceive them doing so far and yet when they do, you sink to new lows and attack the staff at the coal face. There are some pretty good people on the floor at Australian. They deserve better than the crap you are chucking their way. Keep having a go at Australians management if you must. I agree that they have brought a lot of it on themselves - BUT LEAVE THE STAFF ALONE.
Take what I have said here as constructive criticism. I don't know who you are (although I probably do know you - maybe even shared a beer or two outside the units at YHID). And I don't know your motivations, but if you continue to post the way that you have here, then the credability of anything you say is questionable. Why don't you enlighten us a little and tell us all why you are down on AH in such a big way.
skid shoe
PS: This will probably be my last post on rotorheads. The forum belongs to you pilots and engineering is my game. I'll go and play in my own forums.
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SkidShoe
Your point is taken on board
I'll have a crack at the management and company YES
the staff NO that was not what i wanted to do and neither did I intend to do..( words can offend and the offender doesnt even realise he has offended))
If I have Offended any of the staff at horn and the Redcliffe shop I am sincerely and humbly SORRY.
Your point is taken on board
I'll have a crack at the management and company YES
the staff NO that was not what i wanted to do and neither did I intend to do..( words can offend and the offender doesnt even realise he has offended))
If I have Offended any of the staff at horn and the Redcliffe shop I am sincerely and humbly SORRY.
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Australia
Posts: 149
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
G'day All,
Would have been interesting if it found itself in the same vicinity as the tail rotor on the way past. Lucky boys.......
(From ATSB Weekly report)
31-Oct-06, 200606722, Incident, 5, 31km NE Horn Island, Aerodrome QLD
Bell Helicopter Co 412EP. Other Aerial Work OCTA G
During the cruise, the helicopter's left sliding door bubble window blew out. The helicopter returned to land at Horn Island without further incident.
Cheers,
MPT
Would have been interesting if it found itself in the same vicinity as the tail rotor on the way past. Lucky boys.......
(From ATSB Weekly report)31-Oct-06, 200606722, Incident, 5, 31km NE Horn Island, Aerodrome QLD
Bell Helicopter Co 412EP. Other Aerial Work OCTA G
During the cruise, the helicopter's left sliding door bubble window blew out. The helicopter returned to land at Horn Island without further incident.
Cheers,
MPT
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
mpt
this happened about 2 weeks ago
I was going to post the news but would get slagged as a !!!t so didnt bother and I certainly didnt want to upset any one who worked their guts out on this machines last major
and it actually happened twice..
the first time the window blow out and landed in the school grounds at horn ( lucky there were no injuries i would say)
the team recovered it and stuck it in again...
then it blew out again
dont know what happen to the last window,,grown tired of this......
actually the reason i didnt report it here was i was leaving it to see who had the b--ls to do it and how long it would take to appear here..
i actually deleted this thread so i dont know how it got back on...
cheers
AH i have a bubble window in my back yard if you want to claim it
this happened about 2 weeks ago
I was going to post the news but would get slagged as a !!!t so didnt bother and I certainly didnt want to upset any one who worked their guts out on this machines last major
and it actually happened twice..
the first time the window blow out and landed in the school grounds at horn ( lucky there were no injuries i would say)
the team recovered it and stuck it in again...
then it blew out again
dont know what happen to the last window,,grown tired of this......
actually the reason i didnt report it here was i was leaving it to see who had the b--ls to do it and how long it would take to appear here..
i actually deleted this thread so i dont know how it got back on...
cheers
AH i have a bubble window in my back yard if you want to claim it
