Banner Towing
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A wunderfil bit of humore witch had me smiling from ere 2 ere I fli a squrill an I'll rite it that way 4 evr. Witch reminds of a silly joke. What is the longest word in the English language?
Answer - smiles, as there is a mile between the first and the last letter
Answer - smiles, as there is a mile between the first and the last letter
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I can't find any news reports of this 'incident'? 
Did it actually happen?
Was it some non-event exaggerated by some busybody "caller to BBC Cambridge"?
It's just the sort of thing which gets the nannies of this world calling for even tighter restrictions than those we have to live with already.
Did it actually happen?
Was it some non-event exaggerated by some busybody "caller to BBC Cambridge"?
It's just the sort of thing which gets the nannies of this world calling for even tighter restrictions than those we have to live with already.
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I can confirm that the DVD Piracy banner that flew in Cambridge yesterday flew without incident. The call to the BBC was a hoax.
The banner took off from Cambridge airport and landed at Connington.
If you require any more info please contact the Heli Banners UK OPs - [email protected]
The banner took off from Cambridge airport and landed at Connington.
If you require any more info please contact the Heli Banners UK OPs - [email protected]
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Flying Lawyer:
Believe it or not, my previous post was intended to be serious, but I'm not sure that the same applies to your response - a case of "lingua in bucca" perhaps? Both traffic and pedestrians are controlled and constrained in order to prevent accidents for which the likelihood is defined by normal statistical means. My point about banner flying over built-up areas was that it should be subject to the same controls and that the referenced accident - if indeed it was thus and not a hoax - might be relevant to the statistical analysis involved therein. I'm sorry if this was not clear.
Believe it or not, my previous post was intended to be serious, but I'm not sure that the same applies to your response - a case of "lingua in bucca" perhaps? Both traffic and pedestrians are controlled and constrained in order to prevent accidents for which the likelihood is defined by normal statistical means. My point about banner flying over built-up areas was that it should be subject to the same controls and that the referenced accident - if indeed it was thus and not a hoax - might be relevant to the statistical analysis involved therein. I'm sorry if this was not clear.
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Personally, I'd rather take my chances standing underneath the possible jettisonable sandbag and banner that pass overhead occasionally rather than standing next to ‘the cars and even buses and trucks that travel at 30 mph and even 40 mph in some places, only feet from pedestrians!' With regard to the regulatory bodies that preside over both -- I hope they do so equally.
Last edited by 21st Century; 1st Dec 2005 at 16:14.
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Seloco
I realised, after overcoming my initial incredulity, that your post was intended to be serious. My response, albeit expressed in a tongue in cheek manner (as you correctly suggest), was also intended to make a serious point.
"The results of such a large, albeit soft object falling suddenly on a busy street of traffic would be unfortunate, to say the least."
I agree they could be, but so could be the results of one of the many large flags flying from official buildings detaching and landing across a windscreen of a moving vehicle. Or a vehicle going out of control as a result of a driver suffering a heart attack. The chances of such events happening are relatively slim, but the consequences could easily be terrible.
The greater the likelihood of some event happening and the greater the likelihood of serious injury or death resulting if it does, the greater the effort which should be made to minimise the risk so far as reasonably possible, but only within reason.
eg Should the CAA prohibit single-crew aircraft from flying over built up areas in case the pilot has a heart attack?
No, in my view.
Banner flying is subject to control by the CAA. All my dealings with the Authority over the years makes me confident that a thorough risk assesment must have been made by competent personnel before permission was granted.
If the point in your earlier post was simply that (had this incident actually occurred) it should be recorded for the purpose of statistical analysis then I agree with you. I'm sorry if I misunderstood the thrust of your earlier post but I formed the impression you disapproved of, or were worried about, banner towing being permitted over London and other built up areas.
Notwithstanding that "traffic and pedestrians are controlled and constrained", I consider the likelihood of a stray banner causing injury to people on the ground pales into insignificance compared with the likelihood of them being injured on the road or pavement by negligence or medical incapacity (their own or someone else's) or mechanical failure.
The risk of being injured (directly or indirectly) by a falling banner doesn't concern me in the slightest, particularly when considered in the context of all the other misfortunes which are far more likely to befall me by reason of living in London.
(I freely admit I dislike the increasing spread of 'nanny state' legislation designed to protect us from any sort of risk.)
I realised, after overcoming my initial incredulity, that your post was intended to be serious. My response, albeit expressed in a tongue in cheek manner (as you correctly suggest), was also intended to make a serious point.
"The results of such a large, albeit soft object falling suddenly on a busy street of traffic would be unfortunate, to say the least."
I agree they could be, but so could be the results of one of the many large flags flying from official buildings detaching and landing across a windscreen of a moving vehicle. Or a vehicle going out of control as a result of a driver suffering a heart attack. The chances of such events happening are relatively slim, but the consequences could easily be terrible.
The greater the likelihood of some event happening and the greater the likelihood of serious injury or death resulting if it does, the greater the effort which should be made to minimise the risk so far as reasonably possible, but only within reason.
eg Should the CAA prohibit single-crew aircraft from flying over built up areas in case the pilot has a heart attack?
No, in my view.
Banner flying is subject to control by the CAA. All my dealings with the Authority over the years makes me confident that a thorough risk assesment must have been made by competent personnel before permission was granted.
If the point in your earlier post was simply that (had this incident actually occurred) it should be recorded for the purpose of statistical analysis then I agree with you. I'm sorry if I misunderstood the thrust of your earlier post but I formed the impression you disapproved of, or were worried about, banner towing being permitted over London and other built up areas.
Notwithstanding that "traffic and pedestrians are controlled and constrained", I consider the likelihood of a stray banner causing injury to people on the ground pales into insignificance compared with the likelihood of them being injured on the road or pavement by negligence or medical incapacity (their own or someone else's) or mechanical failure.
The risk of being injured (directly or indirectly) by a falling banner doesn't concern me in the slightest, particularly when considered in the context of all the other misfortunes which are far more likely to befall me by reason of living in London.
(I freely admit I dislike the increasing spread of 'nanny state' legislation designed to protect us from any sort of risk.)
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Banner Towing
There was some threads regarding helicopter banner towing, i have just read that the amended ano article 65 does not allow article to be suspended at any height over a congested area, does this now mean that banner towing by a helicopter is not allowed?
Tony
Tony
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Re: banner towing
Tony, I am not aware of ano article 65 could you please supply further information relating to this, which country are you operating in?
I am quite current in banner towing operations.
I am quite current in banner towing operations.
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Re: banner towing
Operating in the UK
the air navigation order 2005 amdt 1/2005
part 5 operation of a/c
art 65
(5) A helicopter shall not fly at any height over a congested area of a city, town or settlement at any time when any article, person or animal is suspended from the helicopter.
Does banner flying come under this rule?
The safety systems, routes and the fact that it is an aerial advertising operation may exempt it. I know that cabair operate over some congested areas so there has to be some exemption.
TAZ
the air navigation order 2005 amdt 1/2005
part 5 operation of a/c
art 65
(5) A helicopter shall not fly at any height over a congested area of a city, town or settlement at any time when any article, person or animal is suspended from the helicopter.
Does banner flying come under this rule?
The safety systems, routes and the fact that it is an aerial advertising operation may exempt it. I know that cabair operate over some congested areas so there has to be some exemption.
TAZ
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Re: banner towing
Not sure of UK regulations, however banner towing op's over bulit up or public areas in Australia is strictly prohibited unless the operator is using a sand bag release system that only a handfull of operators have approvals for.
The sand is released from the bag prior to the rest of the unit being released from the aircraft.
Sorry I cant answer your question. Best of Luck!
The sand is released from the bag prior to the rest of the unit being released from the aircraft.
Sorry I cant answer your question. Best of Luck!
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Re: banner towing
Thanks euro i believe it is the same system being used over here in the UK. The CAA have approved an operator here in the UK aslong as the same safety systems are being used and proved then i can't see any major issues.
Thanks for your reply.
Tony
Thanks for your reply.
Tony
I'll get me coat......
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Re: banner towing
Eurorobell,
I have heard of the sand bag system, you say they release the sand first and then release the rest of the unit. What about the 'D' shackles, swivel joint and long line? Surely they can't be letting those fall away from the aircraft.
CH
I have heard of the sand bag system, you say they release the sand first and then release the rest of the unit. What about the 'D' shackles, swivel joint and long line? Surely they can't be letting those fall away from the aircraft.
CH
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Re: banner towing
Cant really go into detail on the workings of the system ,as I am unsure of the devise, never utilised this setup, maybe someone else can throw some light on the operation of this system.
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Re: banner towing
The UK version is an adaptation of the Australian for which Cabair have done the paperwork and approvals. It has flown over Cardiff, Manchester and London (at least) with full approval hanging off an AS355.