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Insurance: Life, Loss of Licence, Sickness etc (NOT hull insurance)

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Insurance: Life, Loss of Licence, Sickness etc (NOT hull insurance)

Old 18th Feb 2006, 10:39
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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LOL and Life Insurance - YOUR benefit or your EMPLOYERS?

Having lost a (Bristow/Bond/CHC) career recently due loss of medical, some notes of the experience may be of interest to those still aviating.

The employer at time of LOL had amended the LOL insurance policies without notifying the pilots, with various 'downgradings' over the years, leading to the most 'interesting' - they now insure THEMSELVES against LOL, NOT the pilot. Check the policy document - if you can get one out of your employer - and also your contract of employment to see if it allows such an amendment.

Had I returned to flying, I would have been 'locked into' working for the same employer for life if I wished to retain LOL cover for the ailment/illness already encountered (and most likely to finish my career). The LOL insurers will not cover previously existing ailments/illnesses (and why would they?) when arriving at a new employer. Likewise the life cover that your employer provides.

I chose to withdraw my 'pot' from the company pension, to find that they - quite legally it seems - decided to lop 25% off MY money because the fund was undervalued. Has YOUR employer had a 'pensions holiday' in recent years? A final salary 'promise' is worth nothing if they havent' got the money!

The broad issue arising from this experience is just how much of a 'benefit' these 'perks' provided by your employer are? I suggest giving thought to providing your own LOL/Life cover and/or pension, which would be entirely mobile. Each to their own, but think it over NOW, don't wait for the day you need it.

Good Health and Good Flying!
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Old 23rd Feb 2006, 17:05
  #142 (permalink)  
 
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Well I opted out of the company LOL scheme since I was paying also for the old fogeys and therefore save me £700 plus the pay out would have been taxed but now I pay with taxed income the pay out will not be taxed.
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Old 23rd Feb 2006, 17:59
  #143 (permalink)  
 
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BS

You may be paying for the old fogeys now but you will be one some day and just watch your premiums rocket as you get older.

In our scheme the LOL insurance is taxed as a benefit in kind so it is classed as taxed income. The company council has tried to remove this as it is the company insuring itself, as explained by Notreally, but Brown's Tax Mafia won't budge at the moment.

HF
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Old 23rd Feb 2006, 18:57
  #144 (permalink)  
 
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Tax status of LoL

I understand that in the recent Bristow pay round, the revised LoL provision was changed to tax free status, by a simple change of the wording. BHL captains are now eligible to receive £125,000 tax free, with co-pilots on £85,000. And the company have agreed to pay any tax liability, should Gordon try to get his sticky paws on any of it!

bondu
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Old 24th Feb 2006, 08:37
  #145 (permalink)  
 
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Having lost my licence last year at the grand old age of 41, due to newly diagnosed Type 2 Diabetes I feel eligible to comment. At early middle age I am now looking to have to spend to retrain for a new career having flown for the last 20 years and not being qualified to do anything else.
Loss of Licence Insurance covers the unexpected. We all have medicals once or twice a year and normally pass them without any problems. But ANYONE can be diagnosed with something totally unexpected and suddenly everything changes in your life. A Doctor friend has just been diagnosed with non-operable lung cancer which has already spread into his bones. He is 33, never smoked and is/was a marathon runner. He knows he will be lucky to see 3-4 months.
You have got to think whether you have the finances to continue to pay your bills if you lost your licence tomorrow. Most of us couldn't. You young guys that have borrowed huge sums to get into this game - Where would you be?
Loss of Licence Insurance is as it says - an Insurance. It is covered by insurance premium tax, the same as your car, house, pet or Life insurances, currently at 5% of premium. Therefore there is no tax penalty if they have to pay out (incidently only after you have lost your ticket for 6 months. Do you have a salary that will pay for that period?).
For those of you with company LoL schemes, check your contract to see what you are insured for. If you feel you need more to cover your mortgage/bills in the event, either speak directly to your insurance company
or your HR department and arrange to top-up. Check the policy annually to make sure it is being increased in line with pay rises. Be honest on the proposal forms - if there is any chance of getting out of paying, the insurance companies will find it.
For those of you without company schemes - get insured. The BALPA scheme is regarded as one of the best in terms of cost & simplicity.
Stay healthy
Jon
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Old 24th Feb 2006, 08:57
  #146 (permalink)  
 
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902Jon: agree wholeheartedly and wise words to boot.
But............

I have just discovered (as a result of the Bristow fiasco) that the insurance is taxed either on the premium or the payout. Common sense would dictate that 40% on say a £1700/annum premium is better than 40% on a £200,000 pay out!
But paying tax on £1700/yr is always going to bite hard, if you think you may never have to claim. Rock and a hard place I suppose.

Out employer (police) has just realised that they might have to pay back tax on these premiums for the last 6 yrs! But from now on...it's down to the employee as a company perk.
Still waiting for the final word from the Inland revenue..........
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Old 30th May 2006, 20:47
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Insurance loaded 200%

I'm a cameraman in light helicopters, doing about 200 hours a year with commercial operators.

A couple of aviation insurance companies want to load my life insurance premiums by 200% for my aerial activities. So a base £1000 annual premium becomes £3000
No cover for private flight required.
Is this the same % loading for pilots?
Any tips on getting lower premiums?


Mickjoebill
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Old 30th May 2006, 21:46
  #148 (permalink)  
 
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Married with children....you need insurance. Seems a bit expensive somehow. I was refused insurance one time...as I was about to embark for my second tour of combat in Vietnam as a helicopter pilot.

Single...buy cheap term insurance to cover your mortgage and debts....or even go without if you don't have any "debts" to cover or a family member you wish to make rich on your demise.
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Old 30th May 2006, 22:45
  #149 (permalink)  

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Shop around!

(I to was once refused life insurance - once we mentioned the job was Search and Rescue in a Typhoon region the company simply said: "Next" ) .
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Old 31st May 2006, 08:19
  #150 (permalink)  
 
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As a military helicopter pilot my premiums were only cranked up by around 20%. As ST says, shop around!
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Old 31st May 2006, 13:45
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I know that in the States, group policies sometimes do not have aviation clauses in them, so that relatively cheap policies can be had by joining some affiliated group, such as the Reserve Officer's Association or such. For annual dues of perhaps $25, the term policies can be bought at annual prices typically about $1 per $1000 or so.

The Experimental Aircraft Association ($40 annual dues) has a policy that allows flight in experimental aircraft and insurance up to 150,000 at about 3X times the above rate.
http://www.harveywatt.com/eaa/index.html

Last edited by NickLappos; 31st May 2006 at 13:58.
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Old 31st May 2006, 14:05
  #152 (permalink)  
 
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Thanks for the suggestions.
I'm falling between the gap, not a pilot and not an employee.
Can't rely on legal liability insurance of the operator.
Keep the ideas coming!

Mickjoebill
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Old 31st May 2006, 15:02
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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Never quite understood the term "life insurance"
If I buy a car, insure it, then crash it - they give me a new car.
If the same principal applied to life, i'd definately invest.
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Old 31st May 2006, 15:48
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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Rude,

In regard to "life insurance", it is how one spends the "money" rather than where you spend it. Some salesman suggest wise investment can bring a great return.
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Old 31st May 2006, 16:36
  #155 (permalink)  
 
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One of my good friends was a part time insurance salesman at some point in his life. He managed to sell a life insurance policy to the original motorcycle jumper, Evil Knievel, before he attempted the Snake River canyon rocket jump!

Needless to say, when it got to the head office and the realised what they had undertaken, they terminated the policy.

The original policy is still hanging on his wall!
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Old 31st May 2006, 18:52
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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I feel for you, as a heli insructor I tried to get life insurance to cover the morgage but when they said that the wife could have it for 7 pound a month but it would cost me 45 pound a month I told them where to stick it ......
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Old 5th Jun 2006, 20:35
  #157 (permalink)  
 
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Thanks for the suggestions they have helped me being even more bolshy than usual, seems to be working, premium has dropped to £100 per month for £500k and is still falling.


Mickjoebill
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Old 23rd Jun 2006, 12:01
  #158 (permalink)  
 
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info on loss of licence insurance

Hi
Just wondering what the general concesus was regarding loss of licence insurance. My company stopped providing LOL in march this year so i'm just looking for the best one. They have provided an alternative withe a company called Global flying insurance services Ltd (London). I've also been in touch with BALPA and their financial section have sent me details on their recommended LOL which is about £220 per year for coverage of £100,000 (with a co. based in Guernsey). which is very similar to the what my company are charging.
just wondered what i should be looking for in the LOL insurance, and anybody with past experiences of LOL, whether claiming or just searching for the best one
Thanks
RA
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Old 3rd Oct 2006, 16:23
  #159 (permalink)  
 
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Red face Life insurance premiums loaded for heli pilots - are we that likely to die?!

OK chaps,
I'm a low time PPL(H) with about 100 hours. I apply for a Life Insurance Policy of over £1m and am told the premium is around £300/month. I then fill in a form and tick the box that says I fly rotary for recreation - I'm not asked for any details of how many hours I fly. Elsewhere on the form, I'm asked about other types of flying e.g. microlighting, gliding, parachuting etc and in these sections you're asked how many hours you've completed (about 200 in my case). My broker then gets a call saying that the premium will be double because I fly helicopters. At this point, I've not revealed how many hours a year I plan to fly. Does anyone know whether the fact is that I'm twice as likely to die as a result of being a heli pilot based on some real actuarial statistics, or is it just a case of a misinformed industry who think that helicopters must be inherently unsafe? Additionally, am I a better risk to them if I fly less (less opportunity to crash but more likely owing to less experience) or if I fly more (more opportunity to crash but less likely owing to more experience) - not that they've asked of course?!
2Sticks
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Old 3rd Oct 2006, 17:21
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it's not that you're more likely to die of a crash. But more likely to be killed when telling your wife how much you're spending to fly helicopters as a PPL.
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