White - Red STROBE LIGHTS and Anti-Col Lights
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If by having my driving/dipped headlights on all the time means I'm a poser then I'm a helicopter poser as well.
I believe it is far the most important thing to use every aid available to increase the chance of being seen.
I like so many of you will put on the landing lights if there are reported to be others nearby which I havent seen. I know that any pilot looking into the sun will have difficulty seeing a northbound aircraft, so on go the front landing lights.
What I was really asking was:-
1. Do you agree that white stobes are the most effective warning light?
2. Do you agree that white strobe lights used in dispersals would damage the eyesight of marshallers and engineers and that a switchable strobe to 'red' would be an adequate warning light?
3. Do you agree that nav lights are useless during the day and of only of benefit at night, in flight and for marking parked helicopters?
4. Do you agree that landing lights should be used at pilots discretion, but when approaching landing sites/airports should be used to aid other aircraft and air traffic controlles.
5. Do you agree that red rotating beacons/ anti col lights are ineffective during daylight?
Thank you.
I believe it is far the most important thing to use every aid available to increase the chance of being seen.
I like so many of you will put on the landing lights if there are reported to be others nearby which I havent seen. I know that any pilot looking into the sun will have difficulty seeing a northbound aircraft, so on go the front landing lights.
What I was really asking was:-
1. Do you agree that white stobes are the most effective warning light?
2. Do you agree that white strobe lights used in dispersals would damage the eyesight of marshallers and engineers and that a switchable strobe to 'red' would be an adequate warning light?
3. Do you agree that nav lights are useless during the day and of only of benefit at night, in flight and for marking parked helicopters?
4. Do you agree that landing lights should be used at pilots discretion, but when approaching landing sites/airports should be used to aid other aircraft and air traffic controlles.
5. Do you agree that red rotating beacons/ anti col lights are ineffective during daylight?
Thank you.
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Responses...
1) At night, yes. In the day, I dont' know.
2) Maybe, I don't know.
3) Yes.
4) Yes.
5) Yes. That said, sometimes you can see them (clouds rolling in and you have a grey background against traffic).
2) Maybe, I don't know.
3) Yes.
4) Yes.
5) Yes. That said, sometimes you can see them (clouds rolling in and you have a grey background against traffic).
Landing lamps ON should be as second nature as raising the collective to lift off. NO EXCUSES. Why wait until you are 'in a high traffic density area' ???? What is the point?
Most readers on this forum don't own their own helicopters so bloody well use them, especially if you're anywhere near me
If it is rotatable, point that one aft and your other (taxi light) fwd. If you have the option obviously. Who cares that you fly everywhere with headlights blazing?
L Lamp and taxi lamp: 8/10
Nav lts: waste of time (day). 1/10
Strobes: 5/10.
Conspicuity colours 4/10
HISL: 4/10
TCAS: 8/10
Altogether: about 7/10 ish, I would say
Most readers on this forum don't own their own helicopters so bloody well use them, especially if you're anywhere near me
If it is rotatable, point that one aft and your other (taxi light) fwd. If you have the option obviously. Who cares that you fly everywhere with headlights blazing?
L Lamp and taxi lamp: 8/10
Nav lts: waste of time (day). 1/10
Strobes: 5/10.
Conspicuity colours 4/10
HISL: 4/10
TCAS: 8/10
Altogether: about 7/10 ish, I would say
Gomer Pylut:
Really! How do you check them on preflight to make sure they're all working? A very strange set-up if you ask me! Is that correct? Calling Dr. Nick!
No matter. The hazard that helicopters pose is when their rotors are turning. As long as you can get those POS lights on before you release the rotor brake, it's all good. I think that's what the FAA intended anyway.
Thomas coupling indignantly asks:
Well...to keep from having them burn out when you really need them? Like when landing at night perhaps?
Or maybe because the landing light electrical circuits were not designed to be used continuously, as the mechs have told me about the Bell 206? Mechs who were, by the by, pissed at having to replace burnt wiring in the nose from pilots who left the landing lights on all the time...
I used to own a personal airplane with two "landing" lights. I kept one on nearly all the time. Then I sold that plane and bought one with only a single landing light. My home aerodrome is a private field with poorly-maintained runway lights; a black hole at night. I have had the distinct displeasure of arriving at night, turning the landing light on and having it go Pop! and then having to land with no light. Greaaaaaaaat.
Head Turner asked:
1. Do you agree that white stobes are the most effective warning light? This should be obvious, yes.
2. Do you agree that white strobe lights used in dispersals would damage the eyesight of marshallers and engineers and that a switchable strobe to 'red' would be an adequate warning light? I thought strobes were not to be used on the ground? One red anti-collision light/strobe ain't gonna blind anybody.
3. Do you agree that nav lights are useless during the day and of only of benefit at night, in flight and for marking parked helicopters? Absolutely true.
4. Do you agree that landing lights should be used at pilots discretion, but when approaching landing sites/airports should be used to aid other aircraft and air traffic controlles. Agreed, unless the a/c is equipped with other recognition-type landing lights that are designed to be left on all the time.
5. Do you agree that red rotating beacons/ anti col lights are ineffective during daylight? Anyone who thinks differently is probably hallucinating.
Oh, and PF1, some helicopters can't be started with the nav lights on. On the S76, they don't work until you have at least one engine running. Don't blame me, I didn't design the electrical system on the thing.
No matter. The hazard that helicopters pose is when their rotors are turning. As long as you can get those POS lights on before you release the rotor brake, it's all good. I think that's what the FAA intended anyway.
Thomas coupling indignantly asks:
Why don't pilots keep their landing lights on ALL THE TIME?
Or maybe because the landing light electrical circuits were not designed to be used continuously, as the mechs have told me about the Bell 206? Mechs who were, by the by, pissed at having to replace burnt wiring in the nose from pilots who left the landing lights on all the time...
I used to own a personal airplane with two "landing" lights. I kept one on nearly all the time. Then I sold that plane and bought one with only a single landing light. My home aerodrome is a private field with poorly-maintained runway lights; a black hole at night. I have had the distinct displeasure of arriving at night, turning the landing light on and having it go Pop! and then having to land with no light. Greaaaaaaaat.
Head Turner asked:
1. Do you agree that white stobes are the most effective warning light? This should be obvious, yes.
2. Do you agree that white strobe lights used in dispersals would damage the eyesight of marshallers and engineers and that a switchable strobe to 'red' would be an adequate warning light? I thought strobes were not to be used on the ground? One red anti-collision light/strobe ain't gonna blind anybody.
3. Do you agree that nav lights are useless during the day and of only of benefit at night, in flight and for marking parked helicopters? Absolutely true.
4. Do you agree that landing lights should be used at pilots discretion, but when approaching landing sites/airports should be used to aid other aircraft and air traffic controlles. Agreed, unless the a/c is equipped with other recognition-type landing lights that are designed to be left on all the time.
5. Do you agree that red rotating beacons/ anti col lights are ineffective during daylight? Anyone who thinks differently is probably hallucinating.
Prude fart No:94:
Unless the FLM states there is a restriction on the use of a landing light (a la 355), then no excuse NOT to use it.
You shouldn't be flying at night to a site where your landing strip lights are poorly maintained...whats the matter with you can't you afford to maintain them properly?
To be of the opinion that leaving your LL off all day long in the event you will need it for a once in a blue moon night landing..speaks realms about you, doesn't it?
Stick to waffling..its much more illuminating
Unless the FLM states there is a restriction on the use of a landing light (a la 355), then no excuse NOT to use it.
You shouldn't be flying at night to a site where your landing strip lights are poorly maintained...whats the matter with you can't you afford to maintain them properly?
To be of the opinion that leaving your LL off all day long in the event you will need it for a once in a blue moon night landing..speaks realms about you, doesn't it?
Stick to waffling..its much more illuminating
Thomas, it's nice to see that your state of mental retardation continues undiminished. It is unbelieveable to me that someone could be as (intentionally?) obtuse as you, but your very existence proves otherwise, much to my dismay.
Tell that to the mechs who've griped to me about burnt wiring in the 206 landing light circuit over the years.
I don't know; you'd have to ask the airport owner, which is not me. I just keep my plane there. And Thomas, if you were a pilot you'd know that in aviation some things are beyond our control and we sometimes take what we can get. I could keep my plane at the bigger public airport with better runway lighting, but it is nearly an hour away from the house whereas the home field is less than five minutes away.
Yes. It says that I have my priorities straight. I guess if you believe that "most" pilots only fly during the day, then your philosophy would make sense. But if you were a pilot you'd know that many of us fly at night a lot, especially in these winter months in the northern hemisphere, when days are depressingly short. I dearly wish my night ops were "once in a blue moon." I dearly wish I again owned a plane with more than one landing light. But I don't. And to drive around all day with my headlight burning as you suggest would not be wise. I learnt that the hard way.
Thomas, I don't know about others here, but I do wish that you'd just stop posting on this board. Please leave this board for real, certificated pilots. Your illogical rants and general contrariness annoy even me, and that takes quite a lot!
Unless the FLM states there is a restriction on the use of a landing light (a la 355), then no excuse NOT to use it.
You shouldn't be flying at night to a site where your landing strip lights are poorly maintained...whats the matter with you can't you afford to maintain them properly?
To be of the opinion that leaving your LL off all day long in the event you will need it for a once in a blue moon night landing..speaks realms about you, doesn't it?
Thomas, I don't know about others here, but I do wish that you'd just stop posting on this board. Please leave this board for real, certificated pilots. Your illogical rants and general contrariness annoy even me, and that takes quite a lot!
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Thomas coupling and PPRUNE FAN#1, you two crack me up! Always good for a laugh in the morning. Thanks for starting the day with a little comedy (I just hope the two of you never meet in the same room).
Poon flit No:36(a)
I especially enjoyed your last para. It shows all is not in vain...I am slowly....albeit very slowly...getting under your skin.....
Now all I've got to do is: be a real pilot
drip......drip......drip.........drip.......drip
I especially enjoyed your last para. It shows all is not in vain...I am slowly....albeit very slowly...getting under your skin.....
Now all I've got to do is: be a real pilot
drip......drip......drip.........drip.......drip
Last edited by Thomas coupling; 17th Dec 2003 at 03:11.
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Cultural exchange.........
Now I know why all foreigners are refferred to by US authorities as "aliens" when us foreigners actually think the opposite and why the first line of the Brit CAA regs sez "Thou shall not fly, unless.............
Now I know why all foreigners are refferred to by US authorities as "aliens" when us foreigners actually think the opposite and why the first line of the Brit CAA regs sez "Thou shall not fly, unless.............
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TC - The 350s at Shawbury IAW RAF rules flew everywhere with the landing lamp on; very good it was too! Except when the wiring started to burn out and smoke filled the cockpit etc, etc! They had to modify their fleet - Have you modded yours?
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PF, you check the nav lights by turning the battery on. You need to be looking at the light as you do, and it flashes on briefly, then goes back out. It helps to have 2 pilots, one watching each side. They come on as soon as the starter is released and the generator starts working, if you have them turned on, and I have them turned on all the time. As for mechanics whining about replacing landing lights - tell them it's job security, they always have something to do. Better to replace landing lights and even a few wires than complete helicopters, with pilots. The only time things burn is when the pilot forgets to turn it off after landing. I keep mine on all the time during the day, and did when I flew 206s. I turn it off at night when out in the Gulf, because I can't see anything outside with it on in cruise (as if there were that much to see anyway) and I want to try to keep some semblance of night vision. When there is lots of haze it's really bad. I don't turn it on until short final. On and approaching the beach, I keep it on at night, because being seen is more important than seeing.
Avoid imitations
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We fly with red anti-collision light on before the rotor turns, as required by UK authoritiy.
Plus navigation "glow-worms in glass jars", as required by UK authority, by night, which as already stated, only come on with the first generator on line.
Then u/c mounted white landing lights (one each side) plus searchlight as required, day or night for taxying & t/o.
Then white strobes ON plus white HISLs ON before entering a runway or before takeoff from a helipad by day, or even by night - unless the reflections become distracting.
"As required" in the cruise for the searchlight = as soon as conflict with other traffic is likely e.g. if detected by visual means, TCAS or ATC, or when entering ATZs or other choke points.
And STILL we are often the ones to take avoiding action when it's the responsibility of the other pilot according to the rules of the air. Beats me how many pilots ever got a medical on eyesight or passed the air law exam ....
TC and PF#1, your double act gets better
Plus navigation "glow-worms in glass jars", as required by UK authority, by night, which as already stated, only come on with the first generator on line.
Then u/c mounted white landing lights (one each side) plus searchlight as required, day or night for taxying & t/o.
Then white strobes ON plus white HISLs ON before entering a runway or before takeoff from a helipad by day, or even by night - unless the reflections become distracting.
"As required" in the cruise for the searchlight = as soon as conflict with other traffic is likely e.g. if detected by visual means, TCAS or ATC, or when entering ATZs or other choke points.
And STILL we are often the ones to take avoiding action when it's the responsibility of the other pilot according to the rules of the air. Beats me how many pilots ever got a medical on eyesight or passed the air law exam ....
TC and PF#1, your double act gets better
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Those of you who fly B206 - get the wiring sorted by the mec's and fly safer.
The wiring on those Bells are pretty fragile but was ok way back when they were first built but we now fit all sorts of gadgets which demand greater current flow.
The wiring on those Bells are pretty fragile but was ok way back when they were first built but we now fit all sorts of gadgets which demand greater current flow.
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On our 61 we have two red strobes, one on the top of the tail, one for'd under the belly, plus two white strobes on the sponsons, plus two landing lights and standard nav lights.
Just before getting airborne, the whole lot goes on; the landing lights get a rest when we go offshore, (there's not much traffic off our coast). They also go off after landing, because they do tend to burn out.
I would say that careful management of the LLs will ensure no burn out.
Just before getting airborne, the whole lot goes on; the landing lights get a rest when we go offshore, (there's not much traffic off our coast). They also go off after landing, because they do tend to burn out.
I would say that careful management of the LLs will ensure no burn out.
