Why does SQ sometimes use 06R for dep at MAN
 

ive seen this a few times, SQ 777-200 especially taking off from 6R at MAN, is this due the weather, quickness, or just that the crew does want to go over 'the bump' on 6L?


please can someone shead some light on this issue, i have never seen anybody else do this





thankyou
Scott Waterworth

Hi mate,

never seen the 777s go off 06R, however their 747s do it all the time. Apparently, I've been told, the hump on 06L makes them performance limited or something like that. Then again, looking at PIA 747's roll off 06L, SQ may be onto something - only a matter of time before those houses have their roofs blown off again!!! :}

Cheers,

Speedy

hey,

ive only seen the SQ's T7's exercise this departure, nobody else. What gets is why dont other heavy operators like PIA(like u stated) or Malaysian use 6R, i know its takes time to taxi( this should be solved soon when i new taxiway is created down the the entery of 6R) but if it will maintain the performance of the aircraft then why not, i have seen the bump on 6L i to me i would be alittle hesitant to take a 74 or a 77 for that matter down, by the same token would this increase the probability of a tail strike in the pilot rotates on the bump?(im just rabbiting sorry), has anyone every experienced this 'bump'?


cheers
Scott Waterworth

Hasn't "the hump" been there for the last 50 years before the construction of the new parallel runway, without problems ?

Haven't got my plate with me. Does 6R give a greater TODA than 6L ? If I recall correctly from another article Singapore had a SOP to always use the maximum length available.

why didnt they make the runway flat in the first place?lol

Why not ask in a drivers forum rather than air traffic?

Actually I think the drivers probably don't know why the runway isn't flat either. Better ask a civil engineer !

Seriously it's the sort of thing that happens with incremental lengthening of a runway. Originally it would be either level or at least on a constant gradient. When extensions occur (and the main runway at Manchester had a lot of these over the years) maintaining the constant becomes impossible when you extend over a hilltop and down the other side (which is what happened at Manchester). What was originally a runway under one mile long that fitted into a site has ended up as one over two miles long.

With the new runway there was no history to tack onto the end of and they could start again.

For a 737 06R has better RTOM.

AFAIK, which ain't a lot......
After dep on 06R there is a [slightly] better "climb profile" , ie no habitation on the end of the runway :ok: Also there is no [appreciable] upslope.
As an aside, the Alitalia DC9 freighter [remember that?] would not depart 06 [single r/wy then] without at least 15kts
Hope this helps
watp,iktch

It's all to do with performance.

For starters, think how far it is from Manchester to Singapore. Yep - it's along way, thus there is a need to maximise both payload and fuel. The 777 is a clever beast, just stick all the relevant figures into the performance request page and out comes the data you need for your chosen runway. MTOW ( or TOPL) Flap setting and V speeds. All you need to do is compare available runways (in this case 6L & R) and then request the "better" one from the Worlds Finest ATC crew............

Sorry, went a bit OTT at the end there. Wont happen again ;)

WHBM.....I seem to remember that part of "The Hump" was removed many years ago , so it was even worse before !

When the original runway 24(L) was built
back in 40`s the threshold was at top of hill but as extensions were added at threshold they ran down the otherside of the hill and I guess that at the time these extension were put in it wasn`t seen as a problem but as speeds and weights increased this came back to haunt them,
as I have seen it catch a few people out over the years as landerds have floated down the hill so to speak

G-I-B

In my early years, following a rather firm arrival on the 24 hump my very witty Captain commented over the PA....We've moved Heaven and Earth to get you here on schedule and I've just moved the hump!

I continued for another 35 years doing exactly the same!

I had a few goes at it myself.... :ouch:

From my experience, north easterly departures from MAN are mostly obstacle limiting (Stockport, Saddleworth Moor, Pennines etc.). Both rwys are close to one another, so a general assumption that they are affected by the same obstacles holds true.

However, their two thresholds are significantly displaced with 06R being the further to the west. This puts 06R further away from the obstacles, ergo better take performance & less limiting on weight.

.and I thought that hump was an early BAE ski-jump trial..........

No, we don't have any such SOP. The reality is that for every B777 flight that I've crewed from MAN-SIN we're on ABSOLUTELY maximum weight, and the runway offering the greatest RTOW is not only the preferred, but the required runway.

Regards,

Old Smokey

Nurse! Screens for BOAC please!!
 

Now, now BOAC, calm yourself you're not in a Harrier any more! But here is an airfield that uses them instead of "Follow Me" trucks, the hump is so bad. Also no kidding, the upslope is so steep that unless on max power at brake release you roll backwards. So they installed arrester gear to stop you falling in the sea.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2.../happydaze.jpg

Smokey, thanks for the correction. The article I recall, some years ago, made a point that SQ 747s out of LHR 27L, unlike all the others, turned initially left at the threshhold when lining up to get an extra 50m or so of take-off run, and it said it was the "SQ way".

Regarding "humps" I used to do some skydiving work out of a farm strip in a C206 (hey, from a 747 to a C206 in one paragraph !) which had a distinct hump at the midpoint, it was surprising how much of a nuisance it was. If you were light it helped getting airborne, if not careful on touchdown and you landed a bit long it could bounce you up again.

Thanks for the calming influence, enicalyth, saves a 'bad dream' night:D

Looks like a good detachment place, near the beach. Any clues?