Who engage auto pilot?
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What does it say in your OPS manual. Or failing that the FCTM or FCOM's? Just fly the thing as the company employs you would like as its their trainset - assuming it is safe of course.
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But I feel that PM should do it because PF need to leave his hand from throttles
DIVOSH!
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Same training here as in mutts company. Hands have to be moved away from the thrust levers at the V1 call (which in case of the auto-callout is V1 - 2kts). Besides, the aircraft should be in a trimmed out state of flight when engaging the autoflight system which would mean that removing ones hand from the thrust levers to lazily reach up and push the autopilot engage button is an absolute non-issue.
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Hi!
At my airline, the PF, when hand flying, calls for everything and the PM does it.
Once the Autopilot is back on, then the PF is responsible for all the button pushing (but they can always ask the PM to do it for them if the PF wants it that way).
cliff
KMIA
Note: The most important point, at my airline, is getting the button pushed at the correct time, and it does not really matter who does it. The crew needs to work together to run the trip safely and efficiently.
At my airline, the PF, when hand flying, calls for everything and the PM does it.
Once the Autopilot is back on, then the PF is responsible for all the button pushing (but they can always ask the PM to do it for them if the PF wants it that way).
cliff
KMIA
Note: The most important point, at my airline, is getting the button pushed at the correct time, and it does not really matter who does it. The crew needs to work together to run the trip safely and efficiently.
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No - I think it is an interesting question.
Most European ops manuals I have seen dictate that the PNF engages it (although PF's quite often seem to reach for it anyway)
When I have asked pilots from other regions, to engage the A/P for me, they have looked at me like I have gone mad!
On some types (eg 744) the button is positioned quite some way from the instrument scan. I think, as PF, making stabs for it at 400' in IMC isnt a good idea. What if it doesnt engage for some reason, and while your attention is directed at the button, you have accidentally let the wing and/or nose drop.
Could be nasty. Unexplained rolling into the deck at night or IMC shortly after takeoff isn't a new thing.
The PNF is best placed to reach for the button, and ensure the A/P has engaged properly.
Most European ops manuals I have seen dictate that the PNF engages it (although PF's quite often seem to reach for it anyway)
When I have asked pilots from other regions, to engage the A/P for me, they have looked at me like I have gone mad!
On some types (eg 744) the button is positioned quite some way from the instrument scan. I think, as PF, making stabs for it at 400' in IMC isnt a good idea. What if it doesnt engage for some reason, and while your attention is directed at the button, you have accidentally let the wing and/or nose drop.
Could be nasty. Unexplained rolling into the deck at night or IMC shortly after takeoff isn't a new thing.
The PNF is best placed to reach for the button, and ensure the A/P has engaged properly.
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If pressure is applied to the control column at the point of A/P engagement the A/P may not engage/may engage in degraded mode. The best person to know if there's any pressure is PF so that's why most of the firms I have worked for sensibly say PF.
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Depends on your ops manual as many others have said. Where I fly, the PF will, while handflying, call out for modes [select ....] and values [set...] and the PM will do it.
However, that is not to preclude the PF from selecting/setting things himself if the PM is busy, but he then has to inform PM at an appropriate time.
When the autopilot is on, PF selects modes and sets values and informs the PM correspondingly.
However, that is not to preclude the PF from selecting/setting things himself if the PM is busy, but he then has to inform PM at an appropriate time.
When the autopilot is on, PF selects modes and sets values and informs the PM correspondingly.
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For wide body aircraft.PF or PM to push the Auto pilot botton?
We do it one of two ways; the pilot flying can request an autopilot, or he can simply reach up and engage it. No difference, really. Our company policy is that no autopilot is engaged until after flap retraction on takeoff, and many of us hand fly until higher altitudes (largely because we don't get much handflying, otherwise). Some will engage it shortly after flap retraction.
Our general policy is that if one is hand flying, one commands the other pilot to do whatever is required, whether it's engaging the autopilot or setting a flight director setting. One may also engage the autopilot. Once the autopilot is engaged, one takes care of the other input parameters, such as the navigation mode (heading, INS, ILS, etc), the vertical mode (altitude hold, airspeed, mach hold, etc), and any autothrottle settings, if applicable. Much of the time we operate with the autothrottle off, and the pilot flying manually works the throttles.
In general, during a takeoff and climb, we don't work the throttles if we're flying. We have a strict company policy regarding autothrottles on takeoff; we don't use them. During the takeoff, if the captain is flying, he removes his hand at the V1 call, and puts both hands on the yoke. Thereafter, he won't manipulate the thrust levers unless he sees a need, during the climb. If the first officer is flying, he sets initial power, then calls for the takeoff thrust ("set reduced thrust," etc), and thereafter doesn't touch the thrust levers during the climb unless he sees a need.
We operate with a flight engineer, and the flight engineer manipulates the thrust levers, setting takeoff thrust and maintaining the thrust during the takeoff, and then setting climb thrust at a thousand feet above field elevation, on departure.
But I feel that PM should do it because PF need to leave his hand from throttles.
We don't have an "autopilot button," per se. We have one of two or three autopilot levers that can be selected to "manual" or "command," and several other mode selectors that are used to tell the autopilot what is desired.
A typical autopilot use for us would be to call for a flight director airspeed mode just after the gear comes up "IAS Hold." If one a heading and then given a direct-to clearance, the pilot not flying will set the FMS, then engage the INS position on the nav mode selector. When a new altitude is assigned, the pilot not flying will set the altitude in the altitude selector, ensure the altitude hold selector is set to altitude select, and then say the new altitude while pointing to it. The pilot flying will also point to the new altitude and repeat it out loud. When the autopilot is desired, the pilot flying may call for it "Autopilot A to Command," or he may simply engage it and announce it "Autopilot A to Command." Not a big deal.
Thereafter, if a heading is assigned, the pilot flying will dial in the new heading, select heading mode, and fly the airplane through the autopilot. If a clearance direct to a new waypoint is assigned, then the pilot not flying will enter it in the nav computer and the pilot flying will confirm it, before the change is executed. The pilot flying will select INS (our nav mode which selects the computers), and off we go. When the flight is approaching within a thousand feet of the cleared altitude, the pilot flying will announce the approach; leaving Thirty Four for Thirty Five," and the pilot not flying will reply "A thousand feet." As the airplane reaches the desired altitude, the pilot flying will select the altitude hold selector from Altitude Select to Altitude Hold.
Likewise, depending on which airplane we're flying, we're confronted with several different types of autohthrottle functions, or no autohthrottle functions. Some of these may be called-for in the climb to alleviate the FE of having to monitor the power, or it may be manually operated by the pilot flying or the FE.
Who actually engages the autopilot...really depends on what the pilot flying wants to do. In the end, it really doesn't matter, so long as it happens when the pilot flying wants it.
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It is my company policy for PF to push the button for B777.What happen was we lost right transfer bus during ILS approach causing auto pilot to trip and the mode selector panel integral light was out. As a PF at night, I had trouble finding the auto pilot button. So I think it would be nice for PM to do it. That why's I ask. Thanks for all the answers.
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A good reason for the PF to do it himself is another backup to ensure it has been done.
Seen more than one example where the PF has called for (and subsequently assumed) that the A/P was engaged, when in fact it was not.
Yes, should be checked off the FMA - but I prefer to do it myself.
No reason if the workload is too high, such as lighting failure, bad weather, etc to ask for it though. Just double check the PM actually presses the A/P button (and it engages).
Seen more than one example where the PF has called for (and subsequently assumed) that the A/P was engaged, when in fact it was not.
Yes, should be checked off the FMA - but I prefer to do it myself.
No reason if the workload is too high, such as lighting failure, bad weather, etc to ask for it though. Just double check the PM actually presses the A/P button (and it engages).
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Not saying that just because the airlines I flew for did it a certain way, it's right ... but surely there is a Closed Loop thing here ?
PF: "Autopilot 2"
PNF: "Engaged"
To me its not a question of who has the nearest hand, but that by the PF calling it, and the PNF doing it, the loop is closed, and both Pilots know that the Autopilot is engaged.
Its one of those 'routine' things that you get used to doing a certain way perhaps, and it then feels right .. but I still think it makes the most sense.
Ultimately, every action on the flight deck should have a logical basis, not just a "Ah sure whatevers easiest".
PF: "Autopilot 2"
PNF: "Engaged"
To me its not a question of who has the nearest hand, but that by the PF calling it, and the PNF doing it, the loop is closed, and both Pilots know that the Autopilot is engaged.
Its one of those 'routine' things that you get used to doing a certain way perhaps, and it then feels right .. but I still think it makes the most sense.
Ultimately, every action on the flight deck should have a logical basis, not just a "Ah sure whatevers easiest".
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It is my company policy for PF to push the button for B777.What happen was we lost right transfer bus during ILS approach causing auto pilot to trip and the mode selector panel integral light was out. As a PF at night, I had trouble finding the auto pilot button. So I think it would be nice for PM to do it.
"Bob, the autopilot kicked off."
"So it did, Harry. So it did."
"Would you be a good chap and press the button, Bob, old pal?"
"You know I would, harry, but it's very dark up there."
"So true, Bob, but I can't hand-fly this thing. Please don't make me try."
"But it's dark, Harry. So, so dark."
"Don't you have a flashlight over there, Bob?"
"You know I do, Harry. The thing is that if I use it for you, then everyone is going to expect me to use it, and next thing you know, I'm going to to have to buy a new set of batteries."
"Bob, you use the energizer batteries...the ones with the energizer bunny. They go forever. The commercials say it's so."
"I don't like the bunny, Harry. It frightens me. If I use the flashlight, the bunny is activated, and that's troubling. Besides, how do you expect me to afford to buy another couple batteries on a 777 pilots salary?"
"I'm sorry, Bob. I didn't think of that. What if I write you a check for half of the battery cost when we get on the ground?"
"I'm going to need to see some identification, Harry. I hardly know you."
"Would you take a very sincere promise, and my lucky rabbit foot for collateral, Bob?"
"It's not from the Energizer Bunny is it, Harry?"
"Okay, well, yes. It is. Will that be a problem?"
"No, I hate that damn rabbit. It gives me the creeps. Okay, you had me at 'would you be a good chap and press the button.' Of course I'll press the button."
"Hold off a moment, Bob. We landed fifteen seconds ago. Would you be a good chap and give Ground a call?"
"You know I will, Harry. You know I will."
Was that so hard?
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Who engages the auto pilot?
In my company, normally we wait for the Divine intervention and with the presence of the Holy spirit that sends a neurological signal from the top of the occipital lobe area to the left hand finger of the Sapiens Sapiens seated on the left (or the right !?) to push the right button.
Now, remenber that the Holy spirit must be in his good day's. The signal that he sends is to press the button that reads A/P, not the fire discharge pushbutton.
SNS3Guppy:
Loved your report. You have a writting-artistic vein.
WYA
In my company, normally we wait for the Divine intervention and with the presence of the Holy spirit that sends a neurological signal from the top of the occipital lobe area to the left hand finger of the Sapiens Sapiens seated on the left (or the right !?) to push the right button.
Now, remenber that the Holy spirit must be in his good day's. The signal that he sends is to press the button that reads A/P, not the fire discharge pushbutton.
SNS3Guppy:
Loved your report. You have a writting-artistic vein.
WYA
