Aviation English Course
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Aviation English Course
Dear Aviators,
I am a Student currently studying in Leeds University Aviation technology and I am aiming for the big captain's seat! I've recently got my PPL and gradually I shall continue Modular! There is a tiny detail ... I am not from the UK and I will definitely need an English course in Aviation , won't I ?
I want to ask if there is anyone who could recommend a good place to do it?
Is it for life or how do I keep it updated?
I would very much appreciate your help!
Best regards!
I am a Student currently studying in Leeds University Aviation technology and I am aiming for the big captain's seat! I've recently got my PPL and gradually I shall continue Modular! There is a tiny detail ... I am not from the UK and I will definitely need an English course in Aviation , won't I ?
I want to ask if there is anyone who could recommend a good place to do it?
Is it for life or how do I keep it updated?
I would very much appreciate your help!
Best regards!
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G is right as long as someone at some point ticks the level 6 box on a test sheet thats you got it for life.
If they don't you have to go for a test at a center and they will grade you. Anything less than 6 and you will have to do the test again after a period of time.
If you already have the PPL and haven't had to do the test to get your radio license I suspect you already have a 6.
If they don't you have to go for a test at a center and they will grade you. Anything less than 6 and you will have to do the test again after a period of time.
If you already have the PPL and haven't had to do the test to get your radio license I suspect you already have a 6.
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But doesn't most of airlines and companies require a level 4 as a minimum ? I think it would be a great practice overall but if anyone knows more please feel free to share it ?
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If you already hold a radio license on a British issued PPL your more than likely already have a level 6 anyway because the examinors can only tick the box for that level. If they hadn't ticketed the box you would have been required to get an assement of your english level before license issue.
As MJ and Genghis point out, if you did your RT licence along with the PPL then you almost certainly have a 6. Don't have mine to hand but on the radio licence page there is definitely something about english level 6.
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Hi troops,
I'm an English Language Assessor and have done stacks of formal assessments over the past four years.
In the UK Flight / RT Examiners can do INFORMAL Assessments but as previously stated can only assess a candidate at Level 6 and then only if the candidate is fluent and meets the criteria as defined in the ICAO English Language Descriptors. (http://www.aviation-esl.com/scale.doc.pdf - PS. I do not work for this company)
If the candidate does not meet this criteria the Flight / RT Examiner cannot sign him/her off at Level 6 and he/she must be formally assessed by a person trained in English Language Assessment.
The problem is that, unfortunately, there are a number of Flight / RT examiners who tick the Level 6 box, regardless of the candidate's ability and I have personally seen some worrying examples whereby people who do not even meet Level 4 criteria have been signed off at Level 6. Therefore, the Flight Examiners concerned have authorised those persons to fly internationally when those persons do not have the ability to communicate adequately in English.
Regrettably, the names of certain ATO's crop up time and time again but I am not prepared to name them here.
In defence of the Examiners, they have not received training in this area and do not know what to look for. As is very obvious to a trained assessor, just because you can understand someone does not mean they automatically meet Level 6 criteria. Furthermore, most of the examiners I have talked to have no idea what to do if the person is not fluent in English and cannot advise the candidate where to go for formal testing so the easiest thing to do (and human nature kicks in here) is sign them off at Level 6 and trust (hope?) that nothing goes pear shaped in the years to come.
This aside, there are many airlines that insist on proven certification from a formal assessment, therefore, the informal Level 6 sign-off is not worth the paper it's written on.
I have had to do many assessments for native-English speaking airline pilots now working overseas where the airline has required formal certification and I have even assessed an English pilot for a British Airways job.
Also, at the moment nothing is printed on the UK issued licences to state the assessed level of English - all it states is "Language Proficiency: English" (or something to that effect) but no level.
My advice is that, if you intend working overseas (native English speaker or not) get an assessment done formally as you will have the certificate in your CV portfolio and it saves any headaches at the last moment.
There are plenty of places around that do assessments, apart from my own organisation, so you should be able to find one in your neck of the woods.
Under EU Regulations, Level 4 (Operational) needs retesting after 4 years, Level 5 (Extended) after 6 years and Level 6 (Expert) is valid for life.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to drop me a PM.
I'm an English Language Assessor and have done stacks of formal assessments over the past four years.
In the UK Flight / RT Examiners can do INFORMAL Assessments but as previously stated can only assess a candidate at Level 6 and then only if the candidate is fluent and meets the criteria as defined in the ICAO English Language Descriptors. (http://www.aviation-esl.com/scale.doc.pdf - PS. I do not work for this company)
If the candidate does not meet this criteria the Flight / RT Examiner cannot sign him/her off at Level 6 and he/she must be formally assessed by a person trained in English Language Assessment.
The problem is that, unfortunately, there are a number of Flight / RT examiners who tick the Level 6 box, regardless of the candidate's ability and I have personally seen some worrying examples whereby people who do not even meet Level 4 criteria have been signed off at Level 6. Therefore, the Flight Examiners concerned have authorised those persons to fly internationally when those persons do not have the ability to communicate adequately in English.
Regrettably, the names of certain ATO's crop up time and time again but I am not prepared to name them here.
In defence of the Examiners, they have not received training in this area and do not know what to look for. As is very obvious to a trained assessor, just because you can understand someone does not mean they automatically meet Level 6 criteria. Furthermore, most of the examiners I have talked to have no idea what to do if the person is not fluent in English and cannot advise the candidate where to go for formal testing so the easiest thing to do (and human nature kicks in here) is sign them off at Level 6 and trust (hope?) that nothing goes pear shaped in the years to come.
This aside, there are many airlines that insist on proven certification from a formal assessment, therefore, the informal Level 6 sign-off is not worth the paper it's written on.
I have had to do many assessments for native-English speaking airline pilots now working overseas where the airline has required formal certification and I have even assessed an English pilot for a British Airways job.
Also, at the moment nothing is printed on the UK issued licences to state the assessed level of English - all it states is "Language Proficiency: English" (or something to that effect) but no level.
My advice is that, if you intend working overseas (native English speaker or not) get an assessment done formally as you will have the certificate in your CV portfolio and it saves any headaches at the last moment.
There are plenty of places around that do assessments, apart from my own organisation, so you should be able to find one in your neck of the woods.
Under EU Regulations, Level 4 (Operational) needs retesting after 4 years, Level 5 (Extended) after 6 years and Level 6 (Expert) is valid for life.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to drop me a PM.
Last edited by 2close; 25th Jul 2012 at 12:51.
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UK CAA English Language Assessment
I'm not entirely sure how some of these posts help enquirers, if they do. It's true that UK CAA Flight Test Examiners are authorised to assess candidates as Fluent or Level 6, as are RT examiners. If you cannot be assessed as being Level 6, you must be assessed by a language school. This secret list of those authorized to conduct tests is controlled by British Council, who do not themselves administer tests, as they have not been trained to do this, and have no expertise in English for Aviation purposes.
Anyone who is less than Level 6 will have to be retested as often as the regulator issuing their licence designates, for example, every 3 years according to the original ICAO intention for Level 4, except EASA has now done the wrong thing and increased this to 4 years. EASA of course denies they have done anything wrong, stating that their many years (no doubt) of language data reveals that 3 years is unnecessarily soon.
Since EASA would argue that 4 years is sufficient and therefore safe, it could be argued that the actual limit might be 5 or 6 years, or even 10 years. The truth is EASA has no scientific basis for saying 4 years, just as ICAO has none for saying 3 years. EASA has presumably succumbed to external pressure related to cost. Thus cost, not safety is already the controlling factor.
UK CAA have created an anomalous category in which some pilots, like myself have been designated Language Proficiency - English. This means that I was informally assessed over the phone, without my knowledge, as being provisionally Fluent, or Level 6, but without this official designation being assigned, and on the assumption that I would be 're-qualified' each time I received a proficiency check of my flying skills, which for instruments would be annually. In this case I would be continually re-qualified as unofficial Level 6, and never need to be officially assessed, but never officially be designated Level 6.
Of course all this may have changed since the last time I enquired, but why would UK CAA notify me of this.
The main thing is to be aware that ICAO did such a poor job of setting up the language program that it was pre-destined to fail, and it has. Consequently, there are no qualifications or experience requirements for teachers, other than the basic ones such as TEFL or CELTA, which only equips teachers to teach 'how to buy bread and milk', not RT and not 'will you be executing a missed approach, a low approach or a go around this time?', because most English teachers have no clue what all this means. This isn't really their fault, it is the fault of the regulators and the customers who are willing to settle for 'how to buy bread and milk', while paying inflated prices for English tuition.
There is also no benchmark curriculum for teaching pilots, air traffic controllers, mechanics, engineers, technicians and a host of other aviation professionals, the kind of English they really need. We know what it is, but it isn't officially mandated, and therefore it is largely unavailable.
Beware English schools that tell you they teach English for Aviation Purposes, and charge accordingly, but can actually only teach 'how to buy bread and milk'.
Finally, don't be complacent about a Level 4 qualification. I know this is Operational (Level 4), but if you are a marginal Level 4, under conditions of increasing workload, you will likely become Level 3, at best, but don't take offence at this, because under conditions of increasing workload, native English speakers and Fluent or Level 6 non native speakers will tend to lose their ability to communicate fluently and interactively.
If ICAO did a poor job, the regulators all over the world must accept their share of the blame, after all they are the regulators for the 191 member nations of ICAO. They could collectively have rescued the programme, but didn't. I won't go into the many opportunities that were missed or list all the shortcomings and failings, but there is plenty of blame to go around.
The final group on my critics list are the English speaking nations - Australia, Britain, Canada, New Zealand, USA and a few other less wealthy nations. All these nations were handed a gift - the international or global language of aviation in the interest of increased situational awareness and safety will be - ENGLISH. Did they rush to offer assistance to all the other nations, offer teachers and funding, considering the programme was costing them essentially nothing? No, they did virtually nothing, just sat idly by and watched the whole programme fail, but will quite likely be first in line to complain when other nations are not achieving a good level of general proficiency in English.
I should of course acknowledge that many non English speaking nations have done a fine job all on their own, but unfortunately just as many have struggled, and some have achieved very little to date.
If you understand all this and that your test designed by academics to conform to traditional linguistic intentions and standards gives you access to the workplace, but guarantees little else, you will be quite well armed to select appropriate English tuition, and understand your potential limitations.
I hope this will be helpful for some, educational for others, and both interesting and inspiring for those who are involved in delivering, regulating, enforcing and sanctioning the expectations, and apparent assurances of the ICAO 9835 document.
Anyone who is less than Level 6 will have to be retested as often as the regulator issuing their licence designates, for example, every 3 years according to the original ICAO intention for Level 4, except EASA has now done the wrong thing and increased this to 4 years. EASA of course denies they have done anything wrong, stating that their many years (no doubt) of language data reveals that 3 years is unnecessarily soon.
Since EASA would argue that 4 years is sufficient and therefore safe, it could be argued that the actual limit might be 5 or 6 years, or even 10 years. The truth is EASA has no scientific basis for saying 4 years, just as ICAO has none for saying 3 years. EASA has presumably succumbed to external pressure related to cost. Thus cost, not safety is already the controlling factor.
UK CAA have created an anomalous category in which some pilots, like myself have been designated Language Proficiency - English. This means that I was informally assessed over the phone, without my knowledge, as being provisionally Fluent, or Level 6, but without this official designation being assigned, and on the assumption that I would be 're-qualified' each time I received a proficiency check of my flying skills, which for instruments would be annually. In this case I would be continually re-qualified as unofficial Level 6, and never need to be officially assessed, but never officially be designated Level 6.
Of course all this may have changed since the last time I enquired, but why would UK CAA notify me of this.
The main thing is to be aware that ICAO did such a poor job of setting up the language program that it was pre-destined to fail, and it has. Consequently, there are no qualifications or experience requirements for teachers, other than the basic ones such as TEFL or CELTA, which only equips teachers to teach 'how to buy bread and milk', not RT and not 'will you be executing a missed approach, a low approach or a go around this time?', because most English teachers have no clue what all this means. This isn't really their fault, it is the fault of the regulators and the customers who are willing to settle for 'how to buy bread and milk', while paying inflated prices for English tuition.
There is also no benchmark curriculum for teaching pilots, air traffic controllers, mechanics, engineers, technicians and a host of other aviation professionals, the kind of English they really need. We know what it is, but it isn't officially mandated, and therefore it is largely unavailable.
Beware English schools that tell you they teach English for Aviation Purposes, and charge accordingly, but can actually only teach 'how to buy bread and milk'.
Finally, don't be complacent about a Level 4 qualification. I know this is Operational (Level 4), but if you are a marginal Level 4, under conditions of increasing workload, you will likely become Level 3, at best, but don't take offence at this, because under conditions of increasing workload, native English speakers and Fluent or Level 6 non native speakers will tend to lose their ability to communicate fluently and interactively.
If ICAO did a poor job, the regulators all over the world must accept their share of the blame, after all they are the regulators for the 191 member nations of ICAO. They could collectively have rescued the programme, but didn't. I won't go into the many opportunities that were missed or list all the shortcomings and failings, but there is plenty of blame to go around.
The final group on my critics list are the English speaking nations - Australia, Britain, Canada, New Zealand, USA and a few other less wealthy nations. All these nations were handed a gift - the international or global language of aviation in the interest of increased situational awareness and safety will be - ENGLISH. Did they rush to offer assistance to all the other nations, offer teachers and funding, considering the programme was costing them essentially nothing? No, they did virtually nothing, just sat idly by and watched the whole programme fail, but will quite likely be first in line to complain when other nations are not achieving a good level of general proficiency in English.
I should of course acknowledge that many non English speaking nations have done a fine job all on their own, but unfortunately just as many have struggled, and some have achieved very little to date.
If you understand all this and that your test designed by academics to conform to traditional linguistic intentions and standards gives you access to the workplace, but guarantees little else, you will be quite well armed to select appropriate English tuition, and understand your potential limitations.
I hope this will be helpful for some, educational for others, and both interesting and inspiring for those who are involved in delivering, regulating, enforcing and sanctioning the expectations, and apparent assurances of the ICAO 9835 document.
