Uni or not? (Merged 2013)

[Dillon318]

College

Hey,
I am beginning flight training and I'm 16, but I have always seen ads for colleges that just do airline pilot training and I was wondering if a lot of people do that or go to college for something else as a back up plan. I know it's probably a dumb question but I was curious what other people did.
Thanks

[zondaracer]

I went to college for something else as a backup plan. I asked some of my friends who studied aviation what they learned in four years that isn't covered in the normal Commercial, instrument, and instructor training, and they said not much. Comparing knowledge base, what I learned in 6 months of doing the European ATPLs seems to be more in-depth in many subjects than what is covered in a 4 year university aviation program, but your results will vary from program to program. One of my friends wishes that he studied something different like business or economics.

[sudden twang]

Uni or not?
This is for those who dream of being an airline pilot.
Let's consider 2 school leavers perfectly equal in all respects with a decent set of A levels.
One goes to uni the gets a place on a mentored scheme, the other goes straight for the mentored scheme.
The latter will always be 3 years senior to the former and will always be 3 paypoints ahead.
Work out the difference in earnings over a 45 year career and you will be v surprised how much that degree will cost you. Think of a figure between 3 and 5 and add 5 zeros.
Factor in the possibility of the mentored scheme door closing in those 3 years and the possibility of fully automated flight decks in the future.
Going to uni is a great idea and a great life experience but make the decision using logic and a risk assessment tool and not what your teachers or parents expect.
If I had my time again ( and I'm v lucky to have the Ts and Cs and variety of work that I have ) I know what I'd do to maximise my chances of success accepting that nothing is guaranteed in this world.

[Seabreeze]

good luck with no education. you will need it.

Uni might just teach you to think, appreciate technology and human factors, and why airline managers do what they do. I suspect airline managers enjoy chewing on the working conditions for dumb pilots who are basically Only bus drivers.

It is a harsh new world. Try reading Darwin's "Origin..". On the other hand don't bother simply become extinct

[LastMinuteChanges]

This is a tough question, for which the answer will either be as clear as day to you, or you will 'umm and arr' about for years if given the opportunity.

Essentially speaking, I was in your position a few years back, and stubbornly elected to straight in to a well known integrated cadet course offered by an established flying school almost immediately after completing my A-Levels at a traditional Sixth Form, instead of attending University.

With hindsight, I now wish I had attended University for a plethora of reasons which I'll list as follows:

Maturity:
You may feel and look mature, but the simple matter of the fact is, between the ages of 18 and 21, there is still a vast amount of maturing for you to do regardless of how you feel upon leaving A-Levels or College Education. Furthermore, your flying course mates will either be in the same boat or they won't and you'll have to accommodate that.

Education:
It's in the title, not only do you get an education to a discernible level which can be applied to Plan B, Plan C or Plan D, but you get an education in 'Life' that you won't have necessarily obtained living at home with the parents, doing A-Levels or College studies.

Your CV:
From my very recent experience in job hunting as a 200hr Cadet Pilot, it would appear that for this position an individual with 'any' degree (i.e. something substantial, and not in beauty or hair products) would be more appealing than someone without a degree. Plus, it's a great filler even you have a relatively vanilla piece of A4 with not much on it.

Plan B, Plan C and Plan D:
Take a degree that can help your Plan B, Plan C and Plan D - something irrelevant to aviation in some respects, but on the other side of the coin, can be beneficial to you in your potential future aviation career. Prepare for the future, you cannot plan, but take things in to account - there could be another recession, or there could be vast numbers of cadet pilot recruitment in the next 5 years. Have alternate Plans B, Plan C and Plan D at the ready - just in case.


What did I do?

I finished my training in late 2011, commenced a Part-time Degree (Education) in early 2012, established a Company unrelated to aviation (Plan B) in late 2012 commenced employment in Flight Operations (Plan C) in early 2013, and then found a job with an airline recently.

If necessary, look in to government grants. But always focus on the 'Bigger Picture' - education is an investment and at the very least that extra line on your CV could one day land you that dream airline job.

Lastly, ignore the flack that you'll receive from some cynical and pessimistic individuals and never, ever give up. Ever. I mean it.

Don't hesitate to drop me a PM if you've got any questions, I know how tricky this is for those in your position. Good luck with it all.

[nicolasbta]

Degree that can complement me as a CPL ?

Hi, im doing my CPL but i wonder if is a good idea to study some degree before staring to work because it can may can help me in my future.. Which degree do you think guys can help me as a CPL? not now maybe in the future I have been thinking something like, av management? or av security ? or accidents investigation?

which courses do you know ?

thanks for the advice

[206Fan]

Just thought I would link this thread to here!

http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/389...important.html

[elvispilot]

university is a big plus when it comes to becoming a pilot for a major airline,
i was born and brought up in dubai and have spoken to the vice president of emirates too. He advised me to go to university when i told him that i'm interested in joining the ab initio pilot training program.

[GeorgEGNT]

During my time at University I have...

1) Cocked up, brushed myself off and come back stronger.

2) Met the woman I am now engaged to.

3) Moved out and established myself in a lovely house with said fiancee.

4) Partied like hell.

5) Gained some serious self respect (Achieving high marks in coursework etc).

6) Obtained a far greater appreciation for life beyond ones career.

7) Learned how to survive on a £10 shop for a week.

8) Found myself in a far superior position applying for ground based roles than without my degree.

9) Had lots of highs and lots of lows. (My mother's death between 2nd and 3rd year didn't help but certainly made me stronger)

10) Become a far happier person who appreciates everything in life.

I want to fly for a living. I did before I went to University. The difference is I want to do it for different reasons now and feel I have far more discipline and motivation to go out and achieve it.

University is a fantastic experience which no 'glossy brochured' FTO can provide you with.

(About to graduate with an Aviation Technology degree)

[Hagop]

elvispilot,
Since you have a U.A.E. nationality, why don't you apply for the Emirates National Cadet Pilot Program from now? It is a GREAT opportunity with a major airline! You can continue uni afterwards.
Regards.

[meatlover]

Looking to start studying again(bachelors). Any advice is appreciated.

Hello all,

Long story short for everyone. I jumped into my all time dream of becoming a Pilot very early on, and because of that I never got a chance to get a degree/go to uni.
I am now flying for an airline, and feel ready to further educate myself.
Looking to get a bachelors degree that may aid in any way in the future.

Be it a managerial position 10/15 years down the line, a degree that would help in the case that I lost my medical, or anything that would be beneficial to progress in this career.

I am deciding between aviation management and aviation safety/security, but all other suggestions are very welcome.

Thank you guys in adv

[joshfly97]

Flying training

I am currently in year 10 in melbourne and have completed my first solo training at RVAC. I am also planning on doing a B.Aero Engineering after school. My question is do i do my PPL during or before university or is it best to wait until after uni to go full intergrated. Also can you start an intergrated course with 80ish hours of ppl flying? I plan on flying for an airline so please tell me which is best for airline employment. Thanks

[kyle941]

UNSW Bachelor of aviation ? Or private flight school ?

Hi,

I am a student, and I intend to enroll for a Bachelor of Aviation at UNSW.
I know that there are 2 kind of Bachelor of Aviation (management stream and flying stream).
I don't know if it's more preferable to make a Bachelor of aviation Management stream and then to make a CPL in a flight training school like Basair. This makes I have a degree in management from UNSW and a CPL but from another school. With this option I can save about 30k.

Or it's better to make directly a Bachelor of Aviation flying stream ?

Because I made some research and some people said that the Bachelor of Aviation flying stream of UNSW not give more qualification than a private flight school .. Just a MCIR and CPL and that I have to pay 90k more than a private flight school.

It is right or make a degree (flying stream) at UNSW is better ?

Regards, and thanks in advance for your reply.

[Seabreeze]

Pathways??

You don't have to make the decision upfront.

If unsure, simply enrol in the UNSW Aviation Management degree to start with, then spend some time visiting both Basair and the UNSW flying School in your first semester.

Then you can either stay in the Management Stream and fly with Basair, or transfer to the Flying Stream.

Just because the apparent upfront cost of flying training as published appears less does not mean that you will end up by paying less in total. In some cases fees are 'hidden" or the fees mentioned only cover the very minimum of training hours, and exclude many other costs. In addition, the effectiveness and consistency of instructors can make a big difference to the quality of your training, the flight hours you spend to meet standards and your capabilities on completing your training. Perhaps this is not a good analogy, but a Lada and a BMW are both licensed to drive on roads, but....

[kyle941]

Thanks for your reply.

I think I'll enroll for the UNSW management stream and then I'll make some visit at both school.

But is it a university like UNSW give a better quality of training than a private school like basair ? Or finally it is the same thing ? Because some people say that make a degree at a uni is useless to be a pilot and others say that a private school is only after your money and don't care about the quality of their students ..

Is it some big compagny like Qantas care about wich school I'm from? (Like Basair or Uni like UNSW) ? Or just my number of fly hours ?

Cheers,

[wasathangi]

UNI

GET A DEGREE OTHER THAN A FLYING AVIATION STREAM DEGREE.

A management degree in aviation as a bare minimum, why? At least you can streamline it into an MBA or gain credits towards a degree that you can walk into a job after graduation....A paid job!

Study hard, have fun, enjoy the brotherhood and what Uni has to offer!! Way better than a flying school riddled with smoke and mirrors! (Not all)

Once degree completed, start flying...You will only be 21 with 40 years of flying/aviation in front of you. Enjoy the path to become a pilot, if you are in the UK head down to Africa for fun(don't whine and carry on, it's great for the soul). In OZ, we have the outback. Gain your hours camp out meet other pilots (network)...

Just my 2 cents worth....

[JSFerrier]

Any advice an help please?

Hi people,
I have recently received my gcse results, (7as: maths, additional maths, all 3 sciences english language and pe, 3bs: history, geography an English literature, 2cs German and ethics and a merit in IT), and am off to college next week.

My interview for enrolment is Monday, and currently I am taking maths, further maths, physics and geography, however I am debating if not to change geography for electronics as it fits in better with physics. So my first question is what should I take??

Secondly I have been scouting around the flight schools and have noticed that the majority of English based airlines sponsorship schemes are currently closed and open yearly, but and this is a big one, i have come to understand that the aviation industry does not tend to be that regular and therefore my second question is how does employment look over the next 3 to 4 years?

Third is basically should I go to university as I know that no airline requires it however it does stand out in comparison to others but I will be four years older at the end of it.

Thank you for taking your time to read this I will
Become an airline pilot it is just a matte of when and how but all advice is appreciated.

[FlightPilot]

A degree isn't any added weight when it comes to flying for a living. It however, provides security and stability. The choice that many young aspiring pilots face today is to pick one up or not. It all depends on the funding and how you can afford between the two (University & Flight School), your location. Agreed that there's a bit more life experience at college but then again it depends on the one you choose and what you part take in. When it comes to HR, an airline pilot is not differentiated on the basis of his degree certificate but the amount of experience and skill in flying. You could either get a degree (better if it would be a B.Sc or B.E 4yr) followed by a job and save up for flying OR invest all you have in a flying school (get a good cadet selection would be better), work hard and all the way up, build your hours and then leave a choice for a degree OR if you've got into a college that offer's flying by the side at a reasonable rate (PPL) pick that. Again, a degree is of no value in aviation flying and will remain to be a degree but there are many other reasons why having one in hand will keep you safe as well. If there's an opportunity open by the AirForce for you, the better!

It's all about making that right decision and factors that favor in. Not saying it's a disadvantage but simply a degree, isn't a requirement. Cheers and Good luck

[Seabreeze]

as FlightPilot Says

If you have no degree and you lose your pilot's medical, you then have no qualifications! Go back to square 1 and start again with a new career.

If you have a degree and you lose your pilot's medical, you keep your degree, and are qualified to get a job as a graduate. But you will then be best placed for a job if your degree is from a good university, and has relevant subject material. Some aviation flying degrees have little management content, others quite a bit. Jobs in flight despatch, scheduling etc remain options.

[aeroalexGR]

I have just started Year 12... I've got around 23 hours in a C172 and I've began my PPL and managed to even do my first solo 1 month ago...

Unfortunately, I didn't do as well as I wanted in Maths GCSE, and got a B; even though I was predicted and was expecting an A or above. As a result, couldn't do AS Maths at school, and now I find myself in a bit of trouble... However in my rest of my subjects I got the rest As and A*s.

This is because that without Maths I cannot get into Uni entry requirements in London for something like Air Transport Operations or something like that. Which leads me to my next question... is uni worth all the money (taking into account the huge tuition fees)? (career opportunities-wise, not partying, social etc.) What courses would you recommend? Is there no way to get into City for example without the B in A2 maths?

The The Air Transport Operations with ATPL course looks good, however I found out that it has been discontinued. Anything like this to come in the future?

What would you advise me to do ?

Thanks!