November 2008 - OBA. Anyone else going?

[VFR Transit]

Hiya Ghost Rider.

I have not got any dates in mind other than i am looking for the start / mid next year, say about april - july.

I live in Bury St edmunds, where in cambridge are you from.

NASA is great and so is the karking .

VFR

[ghost_rider20]

Wicked, well as soon as I have the fund's it will be booked!

I live just to the SE of the 'bridge in a small village close to the A11 called Fulbourn, have you heard of it??

Oh rite, I know Bury St Edmunds fairly well, I know they have an 'exceptional' nightclub called 'Brazillias' lol!
Probably on par with most of the clubs in Cambridge though! Normally go to N.market, Norwich for nights out!

Yeah I think that would be pretty damn cool too

Where did you do your PPL training?

PM for you VFR transit!

L

[robhoworth]

Hey,

Be very wary of OFT I was there last December (2007). Originally I planned to do my PPL in 5 weeks but the aircraft kept going tech and were not brilliant. Also they kept changing my instructor which was not helpful. They are affiliated with Cab Air in Bournmouth and as soon as they send out students everyone else get put to the back.

RE Naples I heard you spend about 25 minutes waiting to take off sat burning fuel which you pay for......

I left OFT after extending my stay to three months leaving due to work commitments having only 30 hours in the bank. Also if you go DO NOT stop in Kissimmee Pines there accomodation its not pleasent.
I finished the training here in the UK and to be honest found the training much better. I had a great well experienced instructor here in Blackpool who I learnt loads off, im sure he wont mind me mentioning his name Robert Murgatroyd www.flybpl.com.

Cost wise doing it in America will probably cost less including costs to get there and living there, perhaps about £6000, Being messed about it cost me £8000 and I finished here in Blackpool. Just be wary.
I would strongly suggest doing your JAA PPL here then going to the USA. If I could turn back the clock id happily have given Robert £8k back in December. I Know I know though the weather is predictably bad in the UK for the aviation enthusiast restricted to VFR.......

by for now choose wisely rob

[camel toe]

If you pay for your kitchen upfront and the wideboy does a gash job, or if you book a holiday and it's "not what it says on the tin" then you have many official channels to get compensation/money back etc. This of course doesn't erase any bad experiences but its not all lost.

Flight training is a completely different can of worms, it’s a "training course" they are not ordering a load of custom fitted units to be made and delivered to your house. I just don't see why you would want to give what is presumably a Limited Liability company a load of YOUR cash up front. Just have a look at other schools around the world, they are perfectly happy with a deposit and then a pay as you go arrangement.

Of course all of you will probably come back with a nice JAA PPL ticket and be "well chuffed", but if and when this school ever gets into difficulty you will be at the bottom of the list of debtors to get your cash back.

I speak from experience in that I was unhappy with my training provider so I moved schools. Piece of pi$$ to do. If the original school had a few thousand quid of my money they would have had me by the plums and I would have had to stick it out and not enjoy it, and if I'm spending thousands of pounds I want to have fun while doing it that’s for sure.

I'm just offering so friendly advice to sit back and chew over, don't let the "super low cost" drive you. As a well known operator say "low cost but not at any cost"

Good luck though and be sure to come back with any feedback for future students, whether that be positive or negative.

Camel Toe
"Over Macho Grande"

[civil aviation]

Confused

ROB - sorry to hear of your bad experiences with OFT but this is about OBA- a completely different FTO although they are both in Florida.
There is obviously a risk in going anywhere but OBA have been around and under the same ownership for (15? 20?) years. They were the originators of the genuine guaranteed price (not the usual training course 'estimate' rip-off common in UK and USA) and, although every system has snags, OBA must have trained thousands at a lower cost than available anywhere else.
I am confident that if anyone wanted to pay-as-you-go, the proprietor would happy to quote and take your money but it would obviously cost you a lot more in total than their package price- the factor is 'commitment'. If you go to Old Farts Flying Club or commercial FTO's in UK and just pay for one lesson, you and they have no commitment so you might find you won't be getting another, or any, lesson when you want it. You will probably discover, also, that your 'course' has lots of nasty financial surprises because it isn't actually a package and they won't let you pass until you've paid them enough. The current OBA PPL package price (£3995) is well under £100 an hour and includes lots of 'extras', e.g. exams, night rating etc. which most FTO's will stuff you for. Also and it is unusual, OBA do not require any deposit (they TRUST you to turn-up) and advertise NO FUEL SURCHARGE (another current rip-off at some FTO's).
For anyone quitting any package, you're fortunate to get any sort of refund. Don't moan because it's you, not them, demonstrating a lack of commitment. Just try quitting a package holiday half-way through and asking for a refund ! BTW You could/should get travel insurance to cover genuine reasons for curtailment such as illness, death of relative etc.
Not my business but I am sure if anyone has genuinely relevant hours and asked OBA for a quote you would get a discount from normal package price.

[captainvampire]

SBF give it a rest !

[ersantemiz]

No No No

Accommodation (if you like sharing it with 3 others) is possibly the only decent return you get for your money. Too many issues to list as to why you should think twice before going

[TicketyBlue]

OBA

Just stick in and focus on the flying. Don't get caught up in the 3 B's - Booze, Birds and Beaches. Flying is TOP priority. If you keep this is mind, you'll be fine at OBA. Their current batch of instructors are excellent. I've been there already and looking forward to returning.

[civil aviation]

Excellent advice which some don't heed.
Idiots always object to anyone saying no or pointing out that they are wrong. Whether it's said nicely or nastily doesn't matter to the brats- they still moan about anybody and anything. So spicejetter- if you were called a c**t it was because you are one -even on the basis of your postings.
It seems OBA cannot win with wannabe wankers and, if they go elsewhere, I am sure OBA and their serious customers would be highly delighted.
OBA offer a straight package price deal but are then accused of including increased fuel costs to 'mask' increased costs ! However no-one has identified any comparable total PPL course price of less than £3995 at OBA.

[matthewB]

I've spoken to a few people now who've been - all of whom have had positive experiences. I'm not going to go for 3B's - I want to go and get my PPL purely and simply. I'm going to work my ass off to get it done in that timeframe.

I have to say thank you for the fresh and honest conversation this thread has generated. I didn't expect it as people had said OBA had been covered to death. I hear Adrian is a bit of a tough cookie, straight talking Yorkshireman but I plan to treat him with respect and be as professional as I can.

I'm still intent on training with OBA and I'll be sure to write a thorough report so that any future students have some more information.

Thanks again everyone.

Matt

[civil aviation]

This is a good example of a question which you should ask of the FTO rather than believe anyone on here. Most would not lie but they could be genuinely mistaken or things might have changed.
OBA had a reasonable and cheap pilot shop for all sorts of goodies and I'd be surprised if they don't still sell a range of headsets. Again ask OBA to quote what they sell and for what prices currently. There is an obvious advantage in buying when you start because, if there is any inherent defect, there is plenty of time for it to appear and be resolved before you leave.

[matthewB]

They no longer loan you a headset you have to buy them. There are prices up on their site. They have a David Clark H10-13.4 which I'm going to get. They also no longer loan maps and all the other stuff - you need to buy it, but the prices are very reasonable. This is all because they've lowered their prices and taken out all the stuff they gave you for free.

[AdamLT]

what does the course (zero to atpl) cost include? i have seen a quote of £28,590 for this, but then have noticed the atpl groundschool, and conversion is conducted at a JAA approved school.

im a little confused!

PS.. this is mentioned at the bottom of their ATPL package PDF.......Module Budget Cost is available at Ormond Beach Aviation - JAA Commerical Pilots Licence and payable directly to the course provider.

[sketchy]

Prices lowered? Are you sure? It's about £1300 more expensive than it was a couple of years ago. And I've never seen prices at OBA higher than they are now.

Yep, the price was up to around £4.5k a few weeks ago but have just noticed it has dropped to under £4k. As has been previoulsy stated, this is because they have done away with certain things that were included in the price orginally but now you have to pay for. So really you are paying the same, but OBA now have a better headline price.

[VFR Transit]

By the time you have included for a headset and charts etc etc, and included your flights and spending, then it does work out a little cheaper staying and doing the PPL in the UK.

The only advantage of doing your PPL in the USA these days, is the weather, and yet depending on when you , you may find that you only get to fly in the monrings or at night.

VFR

[matthewB]

Down south near me the cost of the PPL is about £7.5k without landing fees, headset, fuel surcharges etc.
Even if you have to buy flights out to Florida, a headset, charts etc etc, it still works out approximately £2.5k - £3k cheaper! Yes you're still paying the same price as before at OBA but like sketchy says, it's a great headline for them.

I'm hoping that the weather in November is conducive to all day flying, although if it's early morning and late afternoon I have no issues with that.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

One of the most common, most enduring and biggest mistakes Wannabes make is investing in the cheapest possible PPL.

I used to teach 3 week £2,995 UK PPL courses in 1999 and I also used to do checkouts for those coming back from doing a PPL course abroad so I have some insight into this.

There are some perfectly excellent UK schools offering a realistic PPL course for £6,500 who can also then take you on to the CPL, Multi and IR with the same aircraft, airfields and instructor. Which would put you at a massive advantage compared to some Florida monkey who crammed 3 weeks of instruction into North American skies and then thinks they know how to fly privately in the UK.

The PPL is the foundation of your house. Weak foundations will give rise to cracks and future expense as you continue to build. Every time.

Good luck,


WWW

[matthewB]

Hi WWW,

I know that US skies are completely different to the UK skies and I'm expecting to put a fair few hours in when I get back learning the differences. Price is a consideration for me, I'll make no bones about it. The extra money saved by doing it in the US will allow me to buy some extra tuition in the UK to bring me up to speed. It will give me more hours and cost me the same as a PPL here.

If you still taught 3 week £3000 UK PPLs I would be first to sign up. But the flying clubs in my area, Redhill, Shoreham, perhaps Biggin Hill are just very expensive. I am aware that the transition to the UK is going to be turbulent but I'm determined not to be a crap pilot and will do all I can to stop it from happening.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

Ok - as long as you are aware that it often takes five hours or so to do a US PPL to UK club member checkout. The R/T and the procedures and airspace are somewhat different.

I understand that cost is very important. But money spent wisely at PPL level can reap great cost savings further on at the CPL and Multi IR levels where costs are triple.

WWW

[matthewB]

Hi WWW,

yep, approximately 5 hours is what I had planned as well as RT coaching upon my return. Many thanks for your frank and honest feedback, it really is appreciated.

Cheers
Matt