Flying Suits, a question of....
 

Hi, I'm reasonably new to this, so if it has been asked before please tell me to naff off.…

I have recently acquired some ex RAF flying kit from a mate who has had a clear out in his loft. The said suits fit me very well and are all in very good condition.

My question is: What is the general opinion of using flying suits and other kit in private flying?

I'm not wanting to pose around in it at all but do get slightly fed up with kneeling under aircraft doing the usual checks only to find that I often get grass stains on a good pair of jeans or covered in mud/grease on other occasions.

Apart from the value from the fire safety point of view, are they shunned or if you have them should you use them?

Any replies would be welcome particularly from the ex-services guys, what do you think?...

There is a long running thread on this very issue here enjoy reading it and make up your mind.

I think most folks thinks that this sort of stuff is OK to wear if you fly something which was not very ergonomically designed and with 'normal' clothing you may get stuck behind levers etc.

For flying most GA stuff they seem a bit over the top, although the fire retardant properties can not be shunned if it is the proper Nomex stuff.

FD

First off, I held on to mine and would wear it (minus badges......) if I felt the need to (primarily if I felt there might be a fire risk). I certainly still wear the calf skin gloves all the time, as they are both practical and fire resistant.

On the very odd occasion that I have worn the old flying suit I've been the subject of a bit of critical comment, so I've decided to get one made up to the same pattern, in the same Proban material, as the ex-mil one, but in black instead of olive drab.

There's no doubt that a flying suit can be very practical, but I guess the real issue is one of style and image. I personally think that those who wear ex-mil kit when flying light civil A/C, complete with badges etc look complete t*ss*rs, but that's just my opinion. If I was going for a whizz in an old warbird, then I'd feel quite comfy wearing my old suit (although it is a little tight around the midriff now........). Climbing into a Cessna in the same attire somehow seems innappriate.

Old jeans are great for flying - save the nice ones for going out (or take them in a bag if needed at the next destination!)

My flying suit is black, badgeless and, as some rude person said, "fits where it touches" . It's too hot to wear it at the moment, but I'm not getting a white one, as what with my big hair and all, I might get mistaken for Patty Wagstaff.

http://www.pattywagstaff.com/gallery1.html#

Out of interest FNG, where did you get it (if you don't mind me asking)?

I was thinking of getting someone os a tailoring persuasion to just copy my old ex-mil one (with a modest increase in girth), but if there is a source of ready made black ones then I'd be interested in taking a look see.

It was a gift from a friend in the Army Air Corps, who wore it during his season on the display team. He also gave me his gloves, and his Breitling holdall (in which my parachute now lives), but not, alas, the free Breitling watch (well, he did actually, swapping it for my Tag Heuer whilst we were pished up in the Bar at Wattisham, but our wives made us swap them back).

I have seen black flying suits in the Pooleys shop at Elstree (also orange ones, yuck). Also, you might check where the police get theirs, as they are black or very dark blue.

VP959, if you go to www.silvermans.co.uk they do copy Luftwaffe suits in grey, green, black, or Warton Orange for £45 a throw.

If they are anything like the original Luftwaffe suits, buy them a size too big - they shrink in the wash !

G

Dodgy Website, Mr G !

Scayreee!

Thanks for your answers and the links to the previous threads, (must get the hang of this search thing) well I think I have found my answer.

Maybe there is a badge that could be worn on the suit, maybe I should market one, The inscription could read something like

"Its a flying suit whats the problem?!" or "This suit is here for my protection" or similar.

My flying club instructors are all for it and think that more people should wear some form of protective clothing when flying. So for now it will have to be the ex RAF ones but will try the other companies mentioned when these need to be replaced.

Thanks again.

FNG, you've lived a sheltered life :cool:

G

Just one point - if you're wearing a flying suit for fire protection (as opposed to clothing protection) remember to wear suitable (ie fire retardant or natural fibres) under it too.

There's no point in wearing a flame retardant suit then becoming incapacitated because your socks (or worse, underpants) melted on to you because of the heat.

P

Ta for the info FNG, I might try and tap one of my AAC chaps up for a suitable "scrounging contact" at MW.

Cheers for the link G, I agree with FNG and wonder who exactly are the major customers for a company like this.

I agree about synthetic fibres. One thing that always puzzled me was why my standard issue grey watch strap was obviously made of meltable synthetic material, as was the horrid knitted replacement for the old wooly bear undersuit. Not doubt cost came into the equation somewhere...........

who buys from there?
 

VP959

Unfortunately most of the uk military, as opposed to free issue.

PB

I suspect that the main customers are servicemen who have been issued with substandard kit and can't get the system to give them something better.

After that, no doubt a fair proportion of war correspondents, soldier wanabees, stalkers (deer, not people), re-enactors, kit collectors, paintballers - and I'm sure one or two people who shouldn't be allowed out in public unsupervised, I can think of a mutual acquaintance with a penchant for pointy hats who would probably happily shop there far more than would be healthy.

Plus of-course, pilots looking for a cheap, non-green, flying coverall.

Noticeable if you browse the site that most of the "sharper" items they'll only deliver to a military address - which is fair enough.

G

Av18tor,

Wear a flying suit if and when you like ... and if other people don't like it, that's their problem.

In my experience, the biggest problem with flying suits is that they are uncomfortable in hot weather (I recall seeing a bunch of US navy pilots wearing them at Sun 'n' Fun last year: boy did they look hot and bothered!); but for actual flying, rather than on the ground, they are usually just fine.

MLS-12D

If worried about the sartorial statement, leave it in the aeroplane - put in on before you untie, and take it off after tieing down. The safety benefit rarely counts in the clubhouse.

And if it's too hot, don't wear anything under it.

G

Yes, in our club house, we have three designated areas: smokers, non smokers, and nekkid people.

FNG, which club is that? Any good looking women members? ;)

Doesn't it chafe?

I wear one on the rare occasions I can afford to fly the chipmunk - not least because it gives me somewhere to put my pens etc! I also wear one in my new toy as it helps keep the grass cuttings out of my underwear. :O

Was at the club last weekend and was chatting to an old bloke in jeans and T shirt. Went to bog and came out wearing the full olive green flight suit. Laughed... I nearly passed out!! He seemed to take on a different persona too, strutting round like a fast jet jock on the way to his Tomohawk!!

Hi silverknapper,

If I may presume to offer some unsolicited advice: try your best not to laugh at or make fun of other people's attire. Their appearance doesn't do you any harm, and goodness knows we all don't have the same tastes; e.g., recent immigrants who persist in wearing traditional gear from their home countries, or young people (and some not so young) with body piercing and/or tattoos. Just because people may look different ('weird') on the outside doesn't mean that they aren't wonderful on the inside (which, of course, is what counts).

Re the strutting-around part: at the risk of appearing unspeakably sanctimonious (and with the frank admission that I am not always personally successful in practicing what I preach), here's a more-or-less apt quotation from Halberstam's Everyday Ethics:

Best wishes,

MLS-12D

silverknapper,

I hope that was not me you are talking about.

I only wear mine to work at the things. :cool:

I saw the Tomohawk, parked behind our TB20 but did not see the pilot

Tony

Whats wrong with shorts and t-shirt?! Or a pair of old jeans just for flying LOL

Advertised in a current edition of a well known GA magazine: flying suits made out of, derrr, polyester. That's a good choice: Be an object of ridicule AND burn to death.

Gentlemen,

Having recently retired from the Military world, I am now embarking on 'keeping my hand in' flying civilian machines from my local club.
I am of the personal opinion that flying suits should be worn, and whilst this will upset a few I'm sure, may I just explain my reasoning......
In a past life, I flew the mighty Sea King Flying Egg Whisk on SAR.
Now I'm not for a minute suggesting, that you chaps will ever need pulling out of the sea at 20W, but mishaps DO happen to us all, even civilian weekend flyers, and it is worth considering your own well-being. I have sadly seen quite a few air accidents, where the crew have died both from their injuries on impact, but sadly also from burns.
The flying suit will certainly afford you a greater level of fire protection than your jeans or shorts will. The flying suit will NOT melt, as will many man-made fibre garments. Flying gloves are an absolute MUST in my opinion as their fire-resistance is quite fantastic, as I can vouch for during BBQ's!!
The only other item I would question would be a helmet.
Yes, I can hear the moans and screams from you now, but think about it.....
If you break a leg, an arm whatwever, it will almost certainly NOT kill you. A damned good whack on the head almost certainly WILL kill you, and if not, it might well leave you a cabbage. Maybe consider it for T/O and landing only??
I simply ask you to consider the pros and cons... if you are certain that you will not crash and/or burn, then fly in shirts sleeves and shorts but, if there is any doubt, is it worthy taking the chance?

Kind regards to all, and I for one, will never take the mickey out of any weekend flyer wearing a flying suit (unless he or she is dressed up to the eyeballs in TOP GUN badges etc!!

Kind regards
The Swinging Monkey

Sensible stuff. There's no logic in this, but if I go flying in a Bulldog, I wear my badgeless flying suit. In the Cap 10, I have started wearing the flying suit unless it's a really, really hot day. In a Beagley Pup, I usually wear weekend flying bloke clothing (but no artificial fibres or shorts). Parachute and gloves always, helmet on order from the States. I think today I'm going to wear the suit in the Pup and care not for comments.

Incredibly Stupid Flying Suit

Flew Mustangs in Japan post WW2.

The squadron pilots looked superb in their tailor made white flying suits. Thiis was before development of nomex and serious considerations of fire protection

Suddenly we went off to war in Korea. Yes in our white flying suits. Before the second mission we had all decided that to bail out in a white flying suit would not be very healthy.

Found some greenish brown dye and my suit was soon the colour of the rice paddys.

Saw the results of our amateurish attempt at camouflage when the ground fire became more accurate and a few had to earn their caterpillers. No doubt saved a few lives.

Whenever I wear a flying suit I look like a tellytubby but there really is no counterargument to the protection they afford, though as stated they are part of an ensemble designed to keep the flames at bay. How many people fly in boots?

There is a real problem with peoples perception and no matter how ofter you say "to hell with them" it does have an effect on people. Remember, this is not just from our peers but from the public too. Are these suited types the down-to-earth normal people they appeared to be to begin with, or is there a gung-ho figher ace fighing to get out? :)

Supposing I wore a flight suit in my C172: my civilian pax would give me funny looks for starters and I would feel embarrased as I explained about the fire protection etc. and how I didn't bring enough for everybody.

If I wore a bone dome I would take out the window or brain the person in the right-hand seat ;)

A more sensible and socially acceptable option is surely to have clothes of natural fibre (with long sleeves) to be worn in the aircraft. OK, so you can't write on your knees but it is a small price to pay for a little peace :)

If worried about the sartorial statement, leave it in the aeroplane - put in on before you untie, and take it off after tieing down. The safety benefit rarely counts in the clubhouse.

And if it's too hot, don't wear anything under it.



I really hope all those middle age guys at my club don't follow this hot day advice. It would really put me off my club house bacon sarnie;)

SSD

Fair point, probably better to do one of the other, not both.

G:uhoh:

Just washed and ironed my Nomex flying suit (sad I know, but going to be the wrong side of the fence at a static display). If nomex is so great at fire resistance, why must it be cool ironed only?:\

PS I wear a helmet and whist it was strange to start with, I would feel naked without it now. Best bit is that you no longer have to clamp the arms of sunglasses between the head and head set.

Don't let Shaggy put you off, Genghis. You go commando if you want to.