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artschool 26th May 2017 16:13

hondajet
 
I was just wondering how long it might take to learn to fly one of these?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_HA-420_HondaJet

this would be for someone with no training but it would not be for commercial use.

piperboy84 27th May 2017 11:02


Originally Posted by artschool (Post 9783510)
I was just wondering how long it might take to learn to fly one of these?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_HA-420_HondaJet

this would be for someone with no training but it would not be for commercial use.

The syllabus and hours needed to attain a PPL and IR certificate/ratings etc. have been covered on many other threads on this forum and vary greatly depending on the individual, but I would imagine your insurer would have the whip hand on deciding the timeframes from showing up at the airfield to commence PPL training to zipping about skies as PIC in a Honda Jet.

If you have the dough I'd buy one now, but would hire a corporate pilot to sit left seat with me sitting in the back with a large glass of champers and a smoking hot surgically enhanced nymphomaniac. You could even get dropped off out front of the flight school for your lessons, now that would impress the shit out of your fellow PPLers and instructor.

9 lives 27th May 2017 12:12

I know a few pilots who have the means to own their own jet. They each pay a highly qualified pilot to fly with them. To meet the needs for skill and experience, and requirements of regulation and insurance to fly a light jet from a standing start would be many hundreds of hours of training, and then hundreds more of mentored experience building.

rudestuff 27th May 2017 13:58

I'd start with one of these:http://s1.ibtimes.com/sites/www.ibti...co50-plane.png

Piltdown Man 27th May 2017 19:45

There are countless high net worth individuals (doctors, dentists, lovely lawyers etc.) spread across the face of the earth. Each of which was used to giving orders and not following them; because nobody tells these people what to do. Their favoured mount for their last flight was normally a high performance singles with turbine singles now becoming more commonplace. Flying high performance aircraft is not difficult per se, it's just that you have to be trained to do so. And if your main job is making money, how can you invest sufficient time to be trained and gain experience to avoid killing yourself? A proper custom built package will start you off at about two years, extending to four or five if you are not sufficiently committed. And then you have your next problem, who will ensure your licence, IR and Type Rating/endorsement is not just a bunch of paperwork to enable you to kill yourself? Who will be your mentor? There was some good advice above.

PM

The Old Fat One 28th May 2017 23:05

^^

Top post. As an RAF Sqn exec and flight authoriser, I attended the old 3 week Bentley Priory authoriser's course, which was probably one of the best human factors short courses in aviation history. We got presentations from the top aviation shrinks in the business and I always remember one of them telling us...

"Never accept an invitation to fly in a rich businessmen's aircraft, if he is doing the flying, and if he happens to own/fly a helicopter, run like ****."

If you have the dough I'd buy one now, but would hire a corporate pilot to sit left seat with me sitting in the back with a large glass of champers and smoking hot surgically enhanced nymphomaniac
carry your bag sir?

piperboy84 29th May 2017 00:30

The following 3 examples are a small sampling of similar type reports that seem to be repeated ad nauseam in the NTSB accident databases having a common theme behind them. All 3 linked below were highly educated, extremely accomplished and wealthy entrepreneurs in their respective full time businesses or professions unrelated to aviation. All were flying as sole pilot PIC in high performance Cessna 525 jets with family members as passengers. All lost control due to spatial disorientation or while focusing on manageable equipment failures on take off or soon thereafter.

If you've got a spare $5m or $10m lying around for reasonably nice exec jet then drop a buck and a quarter annually for a full time professional pilot and sit in the right seat when the mood takes you.

https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.a...11X00172&key=1

https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.a...18X53003&key=1

https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.a...30X91745&key=1

homonculus 29th May 2017 20:15

An interesting and sensible thread.

But which of the above was the NHS doctor with a spare $10m pray?

DirtyProp 29th May 2017 20:35


An interesting and sensible thread.
I trust your judgement, I got lost at nymphomaniac.
Does Honda provide those? I think we should be told.

AdamFrisch 29th May 2017 21:18

BS. There are tons of owner operators who fly a lot more and are more current and better equipped than many professional crews. And their insurance requires them to meet ATP standards yearly in training. I know quite a few who fly over 400hrs per year SP, so this is not a blanket statement that's valid. Professional 2 man crews screw up all the time and I'd like to see any statistics proving that a 2 man crew is twice as safe as a 1 man crew in turbines.

Just look at last weeks augering in a TEB in a Lear 35. This professional crew filed FL270 from a short repositioning from Philly (there's no way NYC control gonna get them up there for that short hop), then apparently do a skidding turn stall whilst they circle to land. This is with two experienced people at the controls.

noflynomore 30th May 2017 11:25


Originally Posted by homonculus (Post 9786602)
An interesting and sensible thread.

Well, not entirely...


Each of which was used to giving orders and not following them; because nobody tells these people what to do.
Strewth!

Astra SPx 30th May 2017 13:47

Wouldn't they need ATPL theory in EASA land to fly a jet?

what next 30th May 2017 14:04


Originally Posted by Astra SPx (Post 9787248)
Wouldn't they need ATPL theory in EASA land to fly a jet?

No. For a part 23 jet you only need an HPA (high performance aircraft) rating.

Niner Lima Charlie 30th May 2017 15:45

The only problem with owning a Hondajet is the money.....

$5 million to buy one.
438 gallons of jet fuel to fill it up every three hours.
$40,000 a year for insurance.
$2,000 a month for hangar rent.

And the insurance policy will require that you do annual recurrent training, another $12,000 per pilot.

Depending upon how many hours you fly per year, it will cost you between $2000 to $3000 per flight hour.

what next 30th May 2017 15:57


Originally Posted by Niner Lima Charlie (Post 9787367)
The only problem with owning a Hondajet is the money.....

...

Depending upon how many hours you fly per year, it will cost you between $2000 to $3000 per flight hour.

Just like owning every other type of light jet. Low utilisation of business jets always comes along with a crazy hourly cost. If buyers would make their calculations themselves before buying (instead of believing the brochure and the sales representative) they would charter a Citation Excel or simiar sized thing for their trips, travel in comfort, get free food and drink on their trips and still save enough money to buy themselves a new Porsche every year.

9 lives 31st May 2017 03:12


There are tons of owner operators who fly a lot more and are more current and better equipped than many professional crews.
Yeah, but, in the context of the original question, there will be a huge gap between ^^ that, and an entry level pilot wanting to fly light jets. The owner operators described above are not where they are now being described as "better equipped" with a few hundred hours of piloting time.


Low utilisation of business jets always comes along with a crazy hourly cost. If buyers would make their calculations themselves before buying (instead of believing the brochure and the sales representative) they would charter a Citation Excel or simiar sized thing for their trips, travel in comfort, get free food and drink on their trips and still save enough money to buy themselves a new Porsche every year.
Yup. 'Applies to more aircraft than just light jets....

artschool 31st May 2017 18:04

Thank you for the comments! Some of them are pretty funny.

This was a semi serious question but there have been a lot of sensible comments so lots of thought needed.

Piltdown Man 2nd Jun 2017 10:30

AF - I take the point you are making but at 400 hours a year that's what part time airline pilots do. And given proper initial and recurrent training I can see no reason why a private pilot doing 400 hours a year will have standards that are any less than an airline pilot. And like private pilots, professional pilots also screw up. But well managed ones with proper operating practices screw up less. When they do get it wrong, they also accept input from the person sitting next to them to prevent a minor error getting out of control. And this is where the one man band is found lacking. If he gets it wrong, he finds out the hard way because there is nobody else to point out his misdemeanours. And this could be after a long day at work. Flying two crew on any aircraft is more than twice as safe as flying single crew, as proven by hull loss numbers in any year you would like to mention.

PM

AdamFrisch 3rd Jun 2017 06:17

But it's not fair to compare brand new PPL's to 2 man professional crews - of course the statistics will prove that a professional crew is safer. What we need to compare is flying done to professional levels, either 1 man or 2 man. Not sure any statistics for that exists, but a good minimal criteria would be turbines (as the insurance req's prob requires to ATP standards).

abgd 4th Jun 2017 01:50

Artschool - nobody's actually asked you what you wanted to do in terms of your flying? I see you were talking about a PPL back in 2013. How far did you get?

I don't know much about very light jets, but do note that the Cirrus jet seems on paper to be perhaps more suited to someone with modest experience (lower stall speed, single engine etc...).


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