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-   -   Tracey Curtis-Taylor (Merged threads) (https://www.pprune.org/private-flying/579030-tracey-curtis-taylor-merged-threads.html)

Mike Flynn 5th Sep 2016 19:50

Reading between the lines of Brian Hopes statement on the LAA forum it appears
he is suggesting an LAA member puts forward a motion to retract the award based on new evidence that her flights in Africa were not solo and there was an airline pilot in the front seat.

The door is now open for someone to put forward that motion as per the LAA rules.

Motions must be submitted by 11th September.

Stanwell 5th Sep 2016 20:18

Re the LAA:
As I understand it, the Association's award of the Bill Woodhams Trophy to TCT was
in recognition of 'An Outstanding Feat of Navigation'.

Now, while her amended claim is now just that of being "sole pilot at all times", (yes, dear, of course),
I wonder who it could have been that actually did do the navigating... Hmm?

Anyway, on at least two of only four short solo legs (out of a total of 44), that she flew on the whole of the Africa jaunt,
she had to ask the chase-plane to lead her.


megan 6th Sep 2016 02:09

Congratulations Jay for such a degree of success thus far, despite some naysayers here. Congratulations too to Pprune for allowing its vehicle to spread the word and in keeping us informed.

India Four Two 6th Sep 2016 08:49

Well done Jay for continuing to spread the word.

A very good editorial in Pilot. It will be interesting to see the consequences.

For some reason, my comment on TCT's FB page is still alive and well. Maybe the PR juggernaut has not seen it yet!

Mike Flynn 6th Sep 2016 11:07

If the LAA need convincing she had assistance from Ewald Gritsch in the front seat here is his panel.
And you can see Ewald in the front seat as they left Port Elizabeth Airport,Eastern Cape,South Africa
on November 3 2013


Here they are arriving at the next stop Virginia.


deefer dog 7th Sep 2016 14:58

I read today that at least one member of the LAA plans to raise the matter at their AGM. Good for him, and fingers crossed. I wonder if anyone at HCAP will be brave enough to do the same?

XV666 7th Sep 2016 18:35

Originally Posted by deefer dog (Post 9500005)
I wonder if anyone at HCAP will be brave enough to do the same?

What makes you think that there have not been concerns raised already?

Mike Flynn 7th Sep 2016 19:41

The Light Aircraft Association AGM/ Bill Woodham award
This whole saga is now getting so complicated that I will now bring you the latest news in a series of updates.

From the LAA forum Sussex member Chris Martyr has posted this...

Most of my posts on here are pretty light-hearted and tongue in cheek. But this one's serious .

I do not for a second , believe that the LAA awards guys are anything other than well meaning, good hearted souls. I know for a fact that Brian works tirelessly for our Association and I'm sure that sometimes he probably wonders why the bloody hell he bothers . But please believe me , the efforts of all you good blokes IS appreciated .
I do also wonder, and this is nothing more than a hunch and I have nothing whatsoever to substantiate it. But ,is it possible that our awards guys may have been "encouraged" from further up the food-chain in nominating the person in question ? Because if that was the case , then it is perfectly understandable that some people now find themselves between a hard place and an even harder place now that it's all coming apart.

For me , the TC-T issue had been nothing more than a little light-hearted joshing about some dopey bird fantasist until quite recently, but it wasn't until ChampChump pointed out that I had unwittingly achieved 'notoriety' on PPrune [a forum I never ever go to] that I realised what a serious ticking time-bomb this now is .
It appears that Pilot magazine have led in their October editorial with a rather critical bit about the woman and also ex CAA guy Barry Tempest has voiced criticism publicly about her as well.
A certain other flying magazine's forum just keeps locking off anything about TC-T which has put one hell of a lot of focus on PPrune and our little old forum , with members , myself included being quoted chapter and verse on Prune.
I find it very difficult to stand by and watch our Association being hauled through this rather embarrassing mire of lies and deceit and feel that it is now time to try and extinguish these flames that are now coming at us from several angles.
I certainly never envisaged having to do this , but I am now going to take it through the motions to have it brought up at the AGM , as Brian suggested earlier. I am sure that a fair few others will support this and I am sorry that it has to be done . But if it appears to others on the outside that the matter may now be addressed correctly , then it may just go some way to cooling this whole sorry situation off .
I admire your integrity Chris especially given the fact that the LAA patron is Prince Michael of Kent who is a big fan and supporter of TCT. It must be very difficult for the chief exec of the LAA to support any motion to question her 'solo' awards?

However a picture speaks a thousand words as they say and I understand a few tabloid journalists are sitting on these plus more informal pictures.

clareprop 7th Sep 2016 20:58

One feels that at last, the touchpaper has lit....

9 lives 7th Sep 2016 21:07

'Interesting reading, thanks contributors. Having no affiliation with the associations nor personalities, from this side of the Atlantic, this is mostly entertainment for me, rather than serious.

But, for some people, this is pretty serious. Obviously, very well established, long standing organizations have their reputations on the line now, and rather publicly so. This topic has seems to have passed the point from which it might have quietly faded away un noticed.

From my entirely uninvolved point of view, the choice to be made by at least one organization would be to either reverse an original plan, in the face of considerable new information coming to light, and disappoint TCT and her supporters, with explanation, or to jeopardize a much bigger reputation of the entire organization so a few people can smile over a rather tainted award.

As a parent, I've had to sit my kids down from time to time, and highlight the bigger picture - it's not all about you, it's not going to go your way. I've even had to do it as an adult to another adult. It seems to me time that TCT and her supporters get sat down for a difficult chat: "Do you really want to receive an award under these circumstances?". "Oh, you still do?! Well, sorry, you're not.".

In the mean time, it's interesting reading.....

Mike Flynn 7th Sep 2016 21:36

Pprune is a global website so good to have you reading this in Canada Stepturn.

John-Michael Schneider at the Toronto based National Post did a good job reporting this saga.

After Arizona desert crash, critics of British pilot say they want the truth behind famous flights | National Post

The next episode will be how the Australian Women Pilots Association react to being conned in to giving Tracy Curtis Taylor a Honorary membership as a solo pilot.

I can imagine now the comments in the Australian, Sydney Morning Herald and the Melbourne Age.

Jonzarno 7th Sep 2016 21:57

The above mentioned article restates many of the points already made in this thread and elsewhere. What is really telling about it is the final couple of lines:

Tracey Curtis-Taylor and Ewald Gritsch did not initially reply to requests for interviews. They have since declined to go on the record to address criticisms.
I would have thought Ms Curtis-Taylor would be only too pleased to have the chance to set the record straight and gain the additional favourable publicity that would result from a successful refutation of the allegations against her.

Apparently not........

Planemike 7th Sep 2016 22:38

One feels that at last, the touchpaper has been lit....
Yes, to mix metaphors, one feels the dam maybe close to bursting.....

maxred 8th Sep 2016 06:01

Unfortunately, there are a lot of people today who are quite shameless. TCT will not come forward, and do the correct thing. If she were, it would have happened by now. Enough has been brought out. No. The organisations themselves, are the ones who have to stand up, come out and state confusion is abound, and that awards are to be recinded, held back. A compromise for these outfits, would be to award a slightly watered down award. Call it an award for long endeavours in a Stearman, or something, and everyone can lie down. The TCT camp have gone to ground, and will ride out the storm. That is what the shameless do. Truth is an inconvenient element, which can get in the way of great exploits, great stories, but in this case, certain groups jumped hysterically. Forgive them, they not know what they do.

clareprop 8th Sep 2016 06:18

Old Links Don't Die
Despite everything that is being said, I notice that on her webpage, if you go to the bottom and click on the 'operations' link, it brings up a page which still blatantly states she flew 'solo across Africa.'

mary meagher 8th Sep 2016 06:31

Can't really blame Tracey for entries that refuse to disappear from your webpage! I have just taken my Mondeo to a garage recommended by my family....lingering on their webpage despite their best efforts is a very unkind remark from a single disgruntled customer from the year 2010....unkind and untrue. That's six years ago already.
When you press the send button instead of the delete it will be public forever!

clareprop 8th Sep 2016 07:37

Can't really blame Tracey for entries that refuse to disappear from your webpage!
That wasn't quite the point I was making. I was referring to her current statement that she only ever intended to suggest she flew 'sole'. The page in question clearly states she was going to fly solo which I think, is the crux of the whole matter.

Lind1795 8th Sep 2016 08:20

This as recently as 21st August 2016 which I have just found on her Facebook page.
One Pilot Explains Our Deep Desire To Fly - Video

ADVENTURE Aug 21, 2016 02:00 AM ET
One Pilot Explains Our Deep Desire To Fly

In order to respect the power and ingenuity of modern day aircraft, you have to look to the past.
When female pilot Tracey Curtis-Taylor landed in Sydney, Australia after a 14,600-mile journey flying solo from the U.K. in a vintage open-cockpit biplane earlier this year, the first thing she said was "I need a drink!"

And who could blame her? The treacherous journey was far from easy. It took about three months in total and Curtis-Taylor encountered countless obstacles along the way. Not only did she fly through thick fog in Romania and dust storms in Saudi Arabia, but at one point she found herself surrounded by birds of prey over Pakistan. Eagles, buzzards and vultures swarmed around her. She knew that if one got into the engine it would prove fatal for both her and the bird.

Luckily Curtis-Taylor survived and made it to her destination safely. Her bravery is truly astounding. Trace Dominguez got a chance to catch up with her at this year's Farnborough International Airshow in Hampshire, England where she told him all about her vintage plane, a Boeing-Stearman named Spirit of Artemis.

A plane like this is "probably the best flying adventure in the world," Curtis-Taylor told Trace. She explained that they're almost like art more than they are machine -- an art that should be preserved because it's starting to die out.

Curtis-Taylor said she often encounters aviation students that don't know how to fly planes like these and she thinks it's quite a shame. "I think this generation needs to be reminded ya know, that civil aviation was based really on people like me getting into wooden-fabric airplanes," she told Trace.

That's the important thing to remember: aviation as we know it today wouldn't have been possible without people like Tracy Curtis-Taylor, her piloting skills, her passion, and her incredible bravery.

-- Molly Fosco
Apparently she flew solo to Australia (even though we all know she did not and anyone who does the most basic research also would discover that) and according to the article: 'Aviation as we know it today wouldn't have been possible without people like Tracy Curtis-Taylor, her piloting skills, her passion, and her incredible bravery.'

Well done Jay for your persistence in this - I imagine it has not been easy for you at times... The article in Pilot is excellent, Barry Tempest's remarks are spot on and I do now HOPE some integrity emerges out of all this.

squashbug 8th Sep 2016 09:12

I think there is a lot of jealousy here
1. Tracey is female
2. she is attractive
3. she is successful
4. she is personable
Why don't you all just get on with life and stop knocking others?

Stanwell 8th Sep 2016 09:54

Thank you for your post, squashbug.
Let's have a look at those points, if we may...

1. Tracey is female... Very good. Thank you, we'd been wondering about that. One mark to you.
2. she is attractive... Erm, well .. as the old saying goes, "beauty is in the eye of the beholder".
3. she is successful... Oh yes? .. At what?
4. she is personable... Of course - most snake-oil salesmen are.

We look forward to further enlightened contributions from you.

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