Cross Country Flight
 

Hello fellow flyers

I currently doing my PPL at PIK and the time has come for me to plan the cross country flight and I have also wanted to fly into Barra as its quite unique with the sand runway.

My question is could I fly to this airport as part of my cross country flight or is there restrictions at this airport because of the sand runway?

Many Thanks

Craig

Happy Landings! :)

There is no legal limitation to which airfield or aeroport you are allowed to fly during your Cross Country solo flights. But CFI at your flight school would be reluctant to let you fly to anywhere without solid long and wide runway! You are still learning to fly and as such you have to follow "orders" from your FI and CFI.

Then again, your first solo cross country will probably duplicate a cross country route that you have flown dual before.

So if you can convince your instructor to do a dual cross country to Barra, and you show him that you can find Barra properly, and properly handle the sand runway and possibly some odd procedures they have in place, then who knows... He or she might just sign you out for a solo cross country there.

I'm not a flight instructor, but if I were, I would like to see a very solid and well-thought-out plan before even doing that flight dual.

there isn't a chance in hell of any sane FI authorising that one.

The beach landing wouldn't worry me if you had done one before its the mountain flying and water crossing which would I wouldn't be able to justify as acceptable risk to send a solo student on. Especially as there are so many safer options available.

What the student decides to do post PPL issue is up to them.

Anyway you have some better options as well which won't require all the moons in the solar system to align for favourable weather. They will also teach you more having to cross various bits of airspace and talk to different ATC.

To barra you will just be on Scottish Info once outside PIK zone.

Yes i don't think anywhere near water is a good idea for a student not just because of changeable weather conditions but also lack of reference over water and other factors.
That is not even looking at landing on a beach.
We wouldn't want you heading off in the direction of Iceland :E

Pace

MJ and Pace are correct for all the reasons listed. Not to mention the scheduling issues you are bringing into the mix by having to ensure the tide is out and there is a runway to land on when you arrive there!

Save Barra for post PPL adventures and hour building.

I & one or two others have been waiting two years for the WX to be acceptable for the flight from London & return some days later for the beach landing at Barra. You are a lot closer so have more opportunity to achieve what would be quite a feather in your cap. BUT I have some reservations about the flight when it finally happens (more nervous excitement) even with over 36 yrs flying, and agree that to try this one as a student is not a good idea.

It's a fantastic trip.

But really, not a good idea for a QXC. Somehow I just can't see any school CFI authorising it, nor until a pilot had a few hours post PPL.

Something to look forward to, but for a little while longer I'd venture.

G

Thank You
 

Thanks for all your replies. Yea it probably will be best to wait after I got my wings and built the hours up. Anyway Barra will always be there! :)

Craig_B757

"Anyway Barra will always be there!"

Maybe?

To Barra or not to Barra, that is the question!
 

MJ, Pace et all seem to be very set against a student flying to Barra or "anywhere near the water" Now, I'm not saying that I'd send a minimum hours PPL student there on his solo cross country but, is that really what the OP asked? I don't think so, he just wants to see the place and develop his experience.

Why not be a bit more positive and encourage the OPs enthusiasm and sense of adventure? How about doing it dual to demonstrate the unique features of this airport? How about running it in the classroom as a planning exercise? How about using his question as a vehicle to discuss flight planning and weather near mountainous coastal regions?

If he was in my flying school I'd suggest that he hold that thought till after we have done the initial dual and solo nav exercises (on a simpler route) and then plan it together as a classroom exercise. Depending on his individual competence and the strength of his desire I might then try to plan a dual flight up there and back to put his plan into practice and demonstrate the strengths and weaknesses of the plan he has developed. Valuable lessons learned and confidence developed!

Bit scared by MJs comment (and I know I'm paraphrasing here) "hell no, not as a PPL student", then "sort it out for yourself" after qualification! I hope you didn't mean it quite like that but that's how it reads:eek: Backpacker's thinking along the right lines.

Fundamental question (and I'm sure I know which side MJ is on here so I'm playing devil's advocate); are we, as instructors, here just to get students through their test and that's all, or are we responsible for developing their skills and knowledge as far as possible so that they are set off on the road to becoming responsible, reliable and professional aviators? NB, I don't necessarily mean "professional" in the sense that they earn their living off it.

Standing by for incoming!

3 Point

I dont think any of the advice given thus far is "tosh", (as stated on previous post now removed) on the contrary, the OP did state he wanted to plan his CC flight as a student to Barra. Not having flown into Bara myself yet, but am very aware of the reqirements for a flight to Barra, plus the added factor of tide tables which do not usually form part of flying training for SEP Land pilots the added flight planning is IMHO not needed nor practical in this case.

I have flown there quite a few times and per say i don`t have problem with water crossings. I used to send mine up to kirkwall. But they have wick, landholm and kirkwall and loads of fields to play with so plenty of escape options.

I might also add i worked on the islands for years and the wx forcast isn`t the best in the world. So to be honest never mind post ppl more like post instrument training be it imc or ir would be sensible.

The standard QXC from PIK, is CBN - DUNDEE - FIFE, Perth, or whatever mixture you want. Barra, would be a slight challenge for a QXC, for all the pertinent reasons given above, also I assume that you would be chugging along at 100kts, so PIK, Barra would take you, roughly two hours, of sitting staring at the coast, or your plog. Far better, and more challenging, to plan your route where airspace, CTZ, and boundaries, have to planned correctly, plus the challenge of R/T, and comms changes, with level restrictions. Bit more exciting also.

Practically speaking, Inverness do beach landing courses but as I recall like students to have a few hours post-PPL first.

There is nothing to stop him from
Renting an aircraft and instructor familiar with the airfield and flying an experience flight there ! But solo / student ? No way :mad:

Pace

How does the view on final compare with the runways you've used in your training so far?

Not to mention the need to wash down the aircraft on return to remove the salt/sand and possibly re lubricate some hinges and linkages,

Schools should have set routes for QXCs. Mine was Leeds – Tees – Humberside and back to Leeds. All a mix class with hard runways.