Many thanks for you response
I was wondering especially after today and even now the rain is just pouring and when I went there earlier today there were no planes flying but I did see instructors and others walking around their plane as if they were doing their external checks but in clacton the weather was similar and I saw a few planes takeoff so I didn't know what was happening
So thanks for your response I appreciate your help

Kind regards Adam

Perhaps, as in some schools, that's how they check for metal fatigue? They wander around the aircraft until they see water pouring through towards the ground from the underside of the wing which will in logical turn indicate to them where the holes are on the upper surface of the wing. In Africa we do this to check for the lethal Piperus Cesnexis, a really evil metal eating bug which is much favoured by the convicts in the chain gangs for it will easily chomp its merry way through the padlock system on ankle gyves.

Now I understand what they did because it seemed they just wanted to get soaked for the fun of it.learn things everyday
Thank you for response
Adam

Light rain is always a tricky one. I have an IMC Rating or IR(R) as it is called now, and light rain is fine if as described earlier. If you can see through it, or you can go around it, then you have options. What I would personally consider is the weather around me and associated with it.

For example does the forecast show light rain and low visibility, or does it have a PROB TSRA and or CB's somewhere in the area. Does one of the nice websites / apps show lightning strikes or other serious activity.

The other thing is that landing in rain is harder as you have no windscreen wipers, and only a quick flick of the throttle might clear the water off your screen. It might require you look more out of the side of the window to judge your height to flare as the rain could distort the vision. And of course no one really wants to get soaked doing pre-checks or tying the plane down. So, you can fly in rain, but there are some additional things to think about.

Ah, have we trained at Stapleford and never read the Flying Order Book? What do you mean by there isn't one? :=



/h88

Thanks, your advice has been helpful but hopefully I won't be in a situation where I will have to fly in rain and my instructor is very experienced. However one of you said that there are no wipers, and the windscreen would be blocked from the precipitation what would happen of you tried coming in a cross wind formation and maybe one side would slightly clear but if the rain was severe how would you find yourself to the runway since cessna's are not equipped with the capability of using a glide slope or localizer.

Adam

If you were in a Cessna 150/152 Aerobat you'd fly the approach inverted. That's the same as being upside down. You'd then execute a snap roll at fifty foot above the ground flicking any residual rain drops from the windscreen and land. This is a little advanced technique and would usually only be demonstrated by the instructor just before you went solo for the first time, in case you got caught out by a squall line while doing your first flight on your own.

:eek:

Fifty feet is far too low to be performing snap rolls on final approach to disperse the residual rain drops.

May I suggest a quick loop before turning base. Much safer at 1000ft. :)

..........and DO NOT even attempt this manoeuvre unless you have purchased a
pair of 4 gold epaulette's. The aircraft will first need to detect that you are a true sky god.

Guilty to a degree!

I was given friendly advice to sign it and told to read it after.. In my defence I read the important parts of it..

Officially as per the "Book"... I believe it is

1200' - Circuits.
3000+ - Stalls etc
2000+ - Navigation

So I shall rephrase...

"The minimum height/altitude may be dependent upon the exercise being flown as long as it meets the Rules of the Air..

If it is General Handling [which I suspect the OP is on around Hanningfield] then I would suspect it will be above 1800 feet + for his purposes... or as the Instructor feels appropriate!

Correct me if I am wrong?

Still only a humble new PPL and learning! :E

Scoobster

Yea 80% of the flight in and out of EGSG is flown at 1800ft however very rarely we fly at around 2500ft and when we enter the circuit it is 1200ft but how do you know if you are in the circuit do you follow the ground such as roads, landmarks etc

Kind regards
Adam

Jetblu? I would appreciate your advice on this one, too. I have bought my épaulettes but only three bars for the moment. Will the cub understand, do you think?

Adam, I know this is all very exciting, you feel both proud and important, but do not get carried away with it and try "dressing up".
The most important thing to consider(and you should already know, if you have studied the forums enough-use the search function for newbie advice- DO NOT WEAR MAN-MADE TEXTILES.
Even a Poly-Cotton shirt can melt and stick to your skin.....read about high-vis jackets and you'll know that not only will they melt onto you, but they are a static-generator....AFAIK. there has never been a refuelling fire caused by one, but the possibility is there....that's why the aircraft is bonded to ground for refuelling....the fuel flowing and splashing can cause static.....no, I've never seen any grounding in petrol-stations, either, but I know road-vehicle tyres are conductive!:8

Pure cotton and real wool will both smoulder...they both absorb and dissipate sweat better than synthetics.
Jeans (Cotton) are fine but get stiff and heavy in a drizzly walk-out / round...cotton trousers are better.
NO! don't even consider a flying-suit! do not try to "look the part" you will just look a total pratt.
I think it was on this forum, Genghis the Engineer, or another respected Member, advised new students to buy an ordinary clipboard from a supermarket, the same with set-square, ruler,pens etc. you can get perfectly adequate gear at a massive saving to the stuff sold "specially for Pilots"...don't get suckered and conned. there are lots who consider flying is for the rich and spendthrift types, so they do their best to grab as muchof that cash as they are able.

You should be able to fly evenings when the days lengthen again, School finishes ~3.30? 15 minutes to Airfield(you said) book for 4.30!
it should be doable!.

Flying as the preserve of the rich and the spendthrifts?
Not since the days of BOAC and Hamble!

@Piper Classique My advice would be is to go and ask your AME for a more
detailed response.

BTW well done on the 3 bar progression. :ok:

Ah, thank you Jetblu. Yes, I probably should do that. I do wonder why I bang my head on the strut so often. I suspect it is only when I am asked for the toll at the stone bridge that it gets serious.
The cub does not approve of the three bars. The radio was hissing and sputtering all the time I was flying. Would it be okay to turn it off, do you think? It would be a pity, now that we have finished painting the corner markers for the circuit. Now we can call at each letter, A to D, instead of those silly downwind and final calls.

I really wish I could do that but unfortunately when I finish at 3.05 it takes me 15 minutes to get home and then if I left at that time, well I would be stuck in traffic for a very long time:)

That's why I usually fly in the mornings when sfc opens at 9.00, no traffic and also it's much nicer to fly in the morning especially for me because I wake up every week day at 7.00 am:ugh: so I am used to waking up early especially when I am going to fly. Also it's nice to see the sun rising and less turbulence so it's more easier to fly but I like it when there is turbulence just makes the flight mkre fun;)

Kind regards
Adam

Well, 80% of some flights... I normally go direct Billericay and climb 3300 as soon as I get there, even if going to south coast.

On a weekend at Stapleford you may tell you're in the circuit by not being told off on the radio.

More seriously, yes, there are landmarks; your instructor will point them out for you. On 22 you climb tracking the runway, then at 300ft you track 200°, then at 800ft you turn towards the white water tower at Havering. When you have a patch of trees at your 9 o'clock, you turn downwind (and call downwind). You overfly the woods, M25 and the pylons. On your left you see the A113 road. When abeam a funny house half-black and half-white, you turn base. Where to turn final should be relatively obvious.

On 04 your turning points are: 1000ft on climbout, then "somewhere near but this side of" the M25/M11 junction, then abeam a roundabout south of Abridge and again the final turn as and when. Just don't clip the London Ambulance Service mast.

All that goes out of the window on a sunny Sunday when there are 7 aircraft in the circuit and 3 descending on deadside and everybody extends downwind or makes S-turns on final.

Fly safe,



/h88

That's why, even for a casual circuit, it's a very good idea to have a Z flight plan filed and duck into EGMC for a refreshing pot of crab salad.

That mast on final for 04 is for the London Ambulance Service? Didn't know that.. "I still hear the words.. You need to be 700ft at the mast.. hollered by a number of instructors"..

Also I must be sleeping because I haven't seen the "White Water Tower at Havering" - Might google earth it..

Incidently, anyone know the name of the Mast in Kent, just past Brands Hatch...?? 1305 AMSL.

Scoobster

Scoobs...
 

I'm sure you'll see the tower next time you take off from 22L, it's not massive but it's very white. Quite far ahead as well.

Not sure if the mast in Kent has a name. I don't normally register seeing it in flight (probably as I escape from under the 2500+ bit of LTMA to fly higher) but when driving on the M20 towards the Continent, the red light on top I see every time.

I wonder how steep the instrument approaches would have been if Stapleford had them - with the mast on one side and the pylons on the other.


/h88

Unpublished procedure 22/04
 

The unpublished procedures work very well. I have used both when needed.

The white tower at Havering is a very useful landmark. Steer 330 from this landmark and Stapleford will be camouflaged on the nose. Alternatively, dial in 115.60 on Nav 1 ;)

This mast? Wrotham transmitting station - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Precisely.

That's the one! Spent a lot of time in Kent doing Navigation and pottered past that mast often!

Thanks.

Scoobs

Question: since I am 14 and I am starting my ppl in a few months what would be the syllabus ie the order of things that I will be taught for example ground school, navigation etc

Many thanks
Adam

I hadn't realised that you were that young.

I see that your problem is going to be when you get to solo stage and still only being 15. Remember that your written exams also have a relatively short shelf life.

Generally, exams are taken through the syllabus when subjects become much clearer. Obviously, the first exam to concentrate on would be air law.

What you should be doing now is chasing after girls. Leave the occupational therapy stuff until you're one hundred and eighty nine months old and then go like smoke.
Anything else is likely to involve some quite serious random wastage.
Schoolboy pilots helicopter solo - Telegraph

He'll be much better off chasing after girls with a PPL in his pocket.


/h88

All the world loves a poor pilot?

Thanks for the reply's but what I was looking for was something like what oaa does where they tell you the order of things like ground school and they separate what you do by weeks I know you need 45 hours on flying but does that include ground school and the first things I would do when I first start keeping in mind that I already flew 6 times.

Kind regards
Adam

Adam, might I suggest you try reading the textbooks reccomended by your instructor. Try your public library first before you buy them.
What you are looking for is called a syllabus.

Adam, I think it's great that any 14yo is interested in learning to fly, and I can say that it is easily the most engaging and fascinating thing I did with my life. (You can hear the 'but' comming, I'm sure.)

I'm a little dismayed that you have done six flying lessons and you don't already know these things. This is not your fault. You need to have a serious chat with your Instructor about what is involved in learning to fly, and what books you should be reading to go with it. There are several series of books associated with flight training, and Vol. 1 of any of these is the one you need right now. This contains the syllabus and all the flying exercises. I reccomend the AFE series.

As has already been mentioned, the most frustrating problem you will have, is that you will be ready to fly solo way before you are old enough. (You have to be 16 to fly solo, and 17 to apply for a Licence.) This will involve either an excrutiating delay in your training at the worst possible time, or it will be suggested that the order of the syllabus doesn't really matter, and that you can continue with the rest of the exercises, and do all the solo flights at the end instead. This disrupts the logic and flow of the process, and is very confusing.

I know that this isn't what you want to hear, but I would strongly reccomend that you postpone any formal training until you are 16.


MJ:ok:

What MJ says is very good advice, meanwhile, you have the internet at your disposal. Why not do a bit of research on Paragliding, Microlighting (both flexwing and 3-axis), Gliding.....
There are many ways of getting airborne...at your age, there was no way I could dream of anything more than a "trip round the bay" in an elderly 4-seat taildragger Auster.- But I was a keen aeromodeller and could read all the books and latest magazines for free at the Public Library (It was warmer than home, in the winter, as well!) I learned a lot about the theory and practice of flight from models.
You may well find that some disciplines have lower age-limits for gaining a licence. To follow this path will give you a much better understanding and make the PPL training far easier, far more enjoyable and make you a better, safer pilot.

(It would also look damned good on your C.V. to a prospective employer.)

Thanks to all I will keep this in mind, so now I am on my way to the library to get a card I already have vol 1 from trevor thom but I don't know if it is still good today since it was published around 20 years ago.

The next time I am flying is this Tuesday 28 oct is there anything I need to tell my instructor

Many thanks
Adam

ATC?
 

Hi Adam,

Forgive me if I am repeating something from earlier in this thread; I haven't been following this thread too closely so I may be repeating someone else's comment.

As a young person, have you considered joining the Air Training Corps? I believe there is quite a bit of free flying to be had with them in both powered aircraft and gliders; (gliding courses and 'flying scholarships').

You asked whether the 45 hour requirement includes ground school. No it does not. And the 45 hours is only a legal minimum training you must receive to reach the standard to pass the skill test and cross country. Most people take more like 70 hours of flying to reach PPL standard.

Also, why not start off on weight-shift and/or three axis microlights, which are much cheaper to hire and I believe the BMAA training requirements may be less demanding than the PPL; (I'm not speaking from personal knowledge on this: anybody here know about this?).

You could also join a civilian gliding club.

Good luck!

BP.

Thanks for your reply
I would consider micro gliding but the thing is dont know any flight schools that do that within the area but definitely worth a research I always considerd joining the air training corps even the days before I joined stapleford but a friend of mine said that they hardly do any flying and you need to cut your hair very short so that sort of freaked me out but maybe he was talking about something else but I will look into what you said so thanks.

Kind regards
Adam

Microlighting and gliding
 

Hi Adam,

I've never heard of micro-gliding! Microlights are all powered aircraft.

Weight-shift microlighting is not done from ordinary flying clubs. There are separate clubs for that purpose generally operating from unlicensed fields and pasture; (although the microlighters do fly into aerodromes for a visit quite routinely).

Some flying clubs do have a certain amount of three axis micro-light flying, but mostly this too is done from the separate microlighting clubs.

You can find the whereabouts of all the micro clubs from the BMAA (British Microlight Aircraft Association). Look 'em up on the web.

If you want to have a look at a typical three axis microlight, take a look at the Ikarus or the Eurostar online. That will give you an idea of what sort of aircraft we are talking about.

You can find out about gliding clubs from the BGA (British Gliding Association).

Regards,

BP.

Sorry that's what I meant when I wrote microgliding I just typed it in wrong
I researched some microlight flight schools but they are a bit far still EGSG is much closer. And also it's more easier to get there from my location but when I go this Tuesday I will ask wether they have any microlight aircraft for training

Kind regards
Adam

Well I went there today and they don't have microlight aircraft only pa-28 and c152's is there anything else I should try doing?

Kind regards
Adam

Hi Adam, from your posts it would seem that the financial side of all this "experience flying" that you are doing is not a problem. If so, then that is an excellent situation to be in.
As others have suggested, if by now you have had about half a dozen flights, then your instructor should really be taking you further along the learning curve, especially as your ambition is a PPL and then on to a CPL. The problem remains that at your current age, you are not going to be able to take advantage of the skills that the syllabus will give you. By all means enjoy the fact that you are in the air, but for me, In your situation, I would wait a while longer, I am sure that SFC are not going to discourage you spending money with them, but from some of the questions that you have been asking on this forum, the knowlege that should be coming from your flights, is not being imparted to you.
Best wishes and good luck to you anyway.
Meldrew.