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-   -   Crosswind landing query (https://www.pprune.org/private-flying/516193-crosswind-landing-query.html)

foxmoth 8th Oct 2013 18:58


I teach both techniques
Ditto, I find most tend to prefer wing down, but leave it to personal preference and there are a few that like the crab.

Desert185 8th Oct 2013 21:08

Exactly. Find what works best for you and use that technique. Just be aware of the differing possibilities in different aircraft and when using any automation that may exist.

Let's not get into what controls airspeed and what controls profile on final, which is another :mad::ugh:

:)

scotbill 8th Oct 2013 22:02


I thought this was the private flying bit of the forum, not the airliner bit? http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...lies/smile.gif
As Sapco 2 said the crossed controls technique works on every aeroplane I have ever flown from Tiger Moth/Chipmunk to the Boeings.

Are you suggesting that private flyers have nothing to learn from those that fly the heavy metal?


My Boeing/Douglas autopilot doesn't slip,
I presume it's a Douglas autopilot rather than a Boeing one?


have always been told that you must crab in the big jets
I was also led to believe one such reason was if you use a wing down approach you might drag an wing mounted engine pod on the ground at the bottom.
It's not a wing down approach. You are picking the wing up with opposite rudder so that the residual bank is less than 2 degrees. You are more likely to dent a pod in a kick-off-drift scenario that goes wrong.

abgd 8th Oct 2013 23:26

Managed to get the video to work by clicking on the 'watch in youtube' button.

I have to admit that as I don't fly nearly as frequently as I would like, crosswind landings are high on my list of things I'm not as comfortable with as I might wish. I can practice a forced landing whenever I choose, but rarely get the chance to fly in a significant crosswind. Being based in a valley probably doesn't help - any wind's much more likely to be funneled one way or another.

Desert185 9th Oct 2013 04:04

Scotbill:

I currently fly a 747SP and a DC-8-72. Both have the factory installed autopilot, and neither will slip on final when coupled. Been kicking it into a slip in the flare for decades, which is the advertised technique for those aircraft. Have never caught a pod (or an outer flap on a 727).

I do the same in my 185, BTW. I live and fly in the mountains. With mechanical turbulence and gusty wind, the slip method doesn't work well, so I prefer and use the crab method on final. Many slip, and that is OK if it works for them.

What we do in the jet doesn't always adapt well to the spam cans, but flying is flying so much of it can transfer aided by specific knowledge of the aircraft you fly.

RatherBeFlying 9th Oct 2013 06:00

In gliders, you like to keep the wingtips off the ground; so, it's crab down to the flare and straighten with rudder with a bit of aileron into the wind to compensate for the rudder lifting the wing.

The wingtips in the 2-seaters are higher off the ground than most single seaters. Some single seater wings are really close to the ground.

The secret advantage in landing a glider in a crosswind is that the wings are so low, the crosswind is less;)

Crash one 9th Oct 2013 10:38

In a recent crosswind landing 25G35 at 40deg to runway (grass) in a 600kg taildragger I cannot recall whether I used crab or wing down, & I challenge anyone to say it was definitely one or the other, the thing was bouncing up & down so much I actually used the "stick & rudder" method.Am I missing something in the precision control department? Some posts on here make it sound as though a crosswind landing should be performed as if the a/c is on rails.

scotbill 9th Oct 2013 12:35


I currently fly a 747SP and a DC-8-72. Both have the factory installed autopilot, and neither will slip on final when coupled.
Haven't flown either so don't know whether they are autoland equipped. The 757/67 etc are and the autopilot does an incredible job in a xwind - smoothly crossing the controls from about 500' down to land as though it were on rails. Have always trained humans to follow its example but perhaps leave the correction till about 100' in case of windshear on short finals.
The experienced pilot will cope with Xwinds but it is my firm belief that many a learner has had his confidence destroyed by the fine judgement required in the kick-off-drift-at-at-the-last-minute school. Particularly with taildraggers.
Much of it came from airforce training. Finesse is not as important in a fighter as it is with hundreds of nervous passengers down the back.

Desert185 9th Oct 2013 15:13

The Classic 747 is autoland capable with a crosswind limit considerably less than the 30 Kt limit in the flight manual. It will touchdown in a crab and then the event will really become interesting when the nosewheel touches down, hence the crosswind limit. The pilot must kick it straight before nosewheel contact and control centerline manually during the rollout. The wing and body gear combo does not like touching down in a crab.

The DC-8 has no autoland capability, and is even a bigger handful during a gusty crosswind. Landing in a slight crab, especially on a wet or icy runway to avoid pod contact is a normal occurrence for those with some experience in a DC-8, particularly with the larger CFM engines. The 8 is a rugged airplane.


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