'Flight Information Service' radio call
 

Morning chaps,

Was off on a solo navigation flight yesterday afternoon, and once I had passed West of Stratford-upon-Avon I changed frequency to Birmingham Radar to ask for a Flight Information Service. I made the radio call 'Birmingham Radar, G-XXXX, Requesting Flight Infomation Service' and expected to be told to 'Stand By' or 'Pass your message' or something to the affect. Instead, the controller replies 'G-XXXX Flight Information Service you have, 1024'. :confused:

Isn't he supposed to ask me to pass my details i.e. TRPACER before he gives me the Flight Information Service? Or could it be that he is familiar with my flying school's aircraft as they pass by on the same route most days and so already knows where i'm going?

If someone could clarify this it would be much appreciated

Cheers,


Ox

I stand to be corrected (or savaged as the case may be) but when making a first call all I ever give is my callsign. This prompts the controller to ask for my full details. A FIS is not a lot really, all they really have to do (correct me if I am wrong) is provide an alerting service and deal with any flight safety issues you might have, for instance "is such and such a MATZ active?" Therefore if you ask for a FIS on the initial call then they will give it you and little else. That's why I only give the callsign, it forces some of the not so helpful controllers to actually ask for all the info.

It could well be because he knows the schools aircraft.
I usualy put a basic call in before i request FIS...usually

XXXX G-AVFU

Then i get told to pass my message. That is when i go through "TRPACER" and request FIS.

The main thing is you contacted brimingham and got what you want without causing an issue.

Thanks for your replies,
I guess everyone has their own way of initiating a conversation with an ATSU; I have just been taught to pass registration and request i.e. Flight Information Service so that the controller knows what to expect next

Cheers,


Ox

I always make initial call with just my callsign. Reasoning behind this is you dont know what the controller is in the middle of so no point giving your life story until he is ready for it.

J.

I follow the same theory.

Mind you in the US i find it very common just to call ATC give the life story rather than wait to be told to pass message.

Oxeagle's initial call is the correct one per cap 413

You are supposed to state what you are looking for in your initial call....this change a few years ago from the old situation where you just gave your call sign.

Why do people say what they do, rather than what is correct? Oxeagle is makeing the correct call....let's not try and change that!


As for why the controller didn't ask for any additional information, could you have gotten a handover from a previous unit? If the previous controller told you to "Contact Birmingham Radar on xxx.xx" then you got a handover. That means that he has given all your details to Birmingham Radar by phone to make it easier to you.

If on the other hand you were told to "Freecall Birmingham Radar on xxx.xx" then he has not passed your details on, and you would expect to have to be asked to pass your message after your initial call.

dp

dublinpilot,

Thanks for clearing that up. I had just taken off from Wellesbourne Mountford, and as they are an AFIS I notified them that I was changing frequency to Birmingham Radar.

Ox

Almost sounds like it was Yoda on the other end...:8

Nice to see that Oxeagle is doing it correctly, Well Done. Don't be deflected by those who seem to know better than the controllers who wrote the books.

The books:

The RTF Procedure is in CAP413 Chapter 10 Page 20.
FIS is nicely summarised in AIC 48/2004 (Pink 65).

ATC unit can forward your details on to your next POC you know.... :} Hence why they didn't ask for any, saves taking up room with passing masses of info when in a busy bit of airspace.

I spoke to an Edinburgh controller recently who said that the reason they like getting "Edinburgh Approach G-**** request flight information service" as the initial call is so that they can get the appropriate plate out for a FIS to write the details onto it. Apparently they have different colours for different types of service.

Amazingly useless trivia, but apparently that's the logic behind mentioning what you want initially THEN passing full details when they are ready.

ATC unit can forward your details on to your next POC you know.... :} Hence why they didn't ask for any, saves taking up room with passing masses of info when in a busy bit of airspace.
That's all good and well Flik Roll, apart from the fact that Wellesbourne Information had no idea I intended to change frequency to Birmingham Radar until I informed them I was doing so ;) Unless there's some kind of common psychic link between ATCOs that i'm not aware of...

Cheers Whopity, it's down to having exceptionally good instructors :)

I know what you mean Ox. I had something similar on my PPL skills test, it did phase me a bit as you tend to have an expectation, and are therefore prepared with what to say/do next! :bored:

As whopity said tho, as long as you do your bit right, that's what counts!! :)

This is a good point. Advise that many instructors give (which I am not saying is wrong) is to try and anticipate yuor radio calls and their responses. So it is no surprise when a curve gets thrown at you, you have to think twice.

Gcolyer

Sorry if I missed it, but I am interested if you think you received a hand over, or were give a transponder squawk or how ATC new where or what you were.

It would also be interesting to know what you expected to receive from the service. There doesnt seem any point asking for a service if you think that in theory having been given it, the service in fact is not being provided.

Fuji...

What I meant was sometimes we expect to hear certain responses, and get a little surprised when we dont hear what we expect.

Example..

XXXX G-AVFU request FIS

G-AVFU FIS you Have

I would have expected something like

G-AVFU state positoin and type (and maybe even ask for origin and dest)

PA32 sle of man to Newtonards 2000ft mid channel G-AVFU

G-AVFU FIS you have


If I have been told I have FIS then I beleive I have FIS, I would just be puzzled why i was not asked for full details (unless I had been handed over)

Gcolyer

I understood that part, I was just interested given the other posts, whether you now think you were handed over or were given a squawk. How do you think ATC knew where you were and what did you expect them to provide you with once they said you had a FIS? In other words if you knew there was no possibility of your having been handed over and ATC in response to your request said you had a FIS is it within your expectations that they could provide you with the service proposed?

Fuji,

I think you're asking the wrong person the question :O

It was Oxeagle who had the flight and r/t conversation in question, not gcolyer :p

dp