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Convert FAA night rating to EASA

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Convert FAA night rating to EASA

Old 4th Jan 2021, 13:53
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Convert FAA night rating to EASA

I have recently completed all of the training with an FAA approved FTO in the US. This was done on an EASA PPL (I went through the process of obtaining a USA PPL license via accreditation of my EASA to leagally fly in the USA).

I wondered if anyone could tell me how to go about "converting" this to my EASA license proper?

With thanks for any help
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Old 4th Jan 2021, 17:24
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You must ensure that you have the following, it is likely you have not in my personal experience because the FAA syllabus is different. The 5 hours training is the same but the elements are not;

(i) theoretical knowledge instruction;
(ii) at least 5 hours of flight time in the appropriate aircraft category at night, including
at least 3 hours of dual instruction at night, including at least
1 hour of cross-country navigation with at least one dual cross-country flight of at least 50 km (27 NM) and
5 solo take-offs and 5 solo full-stop landings

Should you fall short of any part of the above then attend a UK ATO / DTO to complete. They will sign the required course completion certificate for your application.
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Old 5th Jan 2021, 16:00
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You get no credit for having night privileges as part fo your FAA certificate against an EASA night rating. You will have to complete the 5hrs flying in accordance with the EASA syllabus. The FAA certificate does not state night privileges as its a built in privilege with the FAA but an added one under EASA.

We encounter this all the time in the school with FAA to EASA conversions. The number of CPL applications we have seen rejected because of it..........
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Old 5th Jan 2021, 19:26
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So if you have logged the experience shown, flying on an FAA license, then what do you need to do for the EASA PPL night rating other than present this information? It would be impossible to get an FAA CPL without this experience (well, improbably anyway).
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Old 5th Jan 2021, 21:20
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Originally Posted by n5296s View Post
So if you have logged the experience shown, flying on an FAA license, then what do you need to do for the EASA PPL night rating other than present this information? It would be impossible to get an FAA CPL without this experience (well, improbably anyway).
You donít match the EASA requirements when doing FAA night training. Thatís always been the problem. The faa certificate does not have a night rating entry. Trust me, I have been dealing with this issue for years......
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 01:52
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Well yes, there's no such thing as a "night rating" in FAA land. You can't get a PPL without night training (except in Alaska). But I'm sure I have all of the things mentioned under (ii), so my question is, what else would I need?
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 08:56
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Originally Posted by n5296s View Post
Well yes, there's no such thing as a "night rating" in FAA land. You can't get a PPL without night training (except in Alaska). But I'm sure I have all of the things mentioned under (ii), so my question is, what else would I need?
Go to an ATO/DTO, get the theoretical acquaintance approval, fly the nights hours with an instructor, do your EASA night solo including three landings and get their signature under the rating. Your FAA night will give you nothing, no credits. The time you spend here may exceed the time needed to just do it.
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 10:53
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FCL 810
Applicants shall have completed a training course within a period of up to 6 months at a DTO or at an ATO to exercise the privileges of an LAPL or a PPL for aeroplanes, .....


And there lies the problem. EASA's anxiety in being anti-American and anywhere else in the world, they are specific in requiring that the whole training is conducted at a EASA ATO/DTO. Night doesn't exist outside of the EU., the rest of the world is bathed continuously in sunlight of course.

The UK CAA is no longer bound by such nonsense. However, it will be some time before these things will be resolved. You could try asking the CAA in writing (email) for current liberated clarity. At the speed they deal with these matters you could be well into the summer before a decision is given. You are not looking to "convert" a USA 'Night Rating' (as you state in your question) because you do not have one. You would be asking for your US training to be credited in whole or in part.
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 11:33
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Originally Posted by Fl1ingfrog View Post
FCL 810
Applicants shall have completed a training course within a period of up to 6 months at a DTO or at an ATO to exercise the privileges of an LAPL or a PPL for aeroplanes, .....


And there lies the problem. EASA's anxiety in being anti-American and anywhere else in the world, they are specific in requiring that the whole training is conducted at a EASA ATO/DTO. Night doesn't exist outside of the EU., the rest of the world is bathed continuously in sunlight of course.

The UK CAA is no longer bound by such nonsense. However, it will be some time before these things will be resolved. You could try asking the CAA in writing (email) for current liberated clarity. At the speed they deal with these matters you could be well into the summer before a decision is given. You are not looking to "convert" a USA 'Night Rating' (as you state in your question) because you do not have one. You would be asking for your US training to be credited in whole or in part.
Why the assumption that the OP is trapped on fragile rock and subject to the UKs slide into the dark ages....... His question was specifically around an EASA licence unless I missed something?



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Old 6th Jan 2021, 11:35
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Originally Posted by n5296s View Post
Well yes, there's no such thing as a "night rating" in FAA land. You can't get a PPL without night training (except in Alaska). But I'm sure I have all of the things mentioned under (ii), so my question is, what else would I need?
Exactly what Chicken house and I have both told you. Take it from me as Head of Training of a ATO I have not found a way around it yet.....
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 12:00
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Why the assumption that the OP is trapped on fragile rock and subject to the UKs slide into the dark ages....... His question was specifically around an EASA licence unless I missed something?
S-Works, yes you have missed something, your quotation is not mine. I have suggested differently that we have entered eternal sunlight (sic). I've also responded on the basis that the originator baleares has a UK issued 'EASA' licence which, if so, is no longer because it is now a wholly UK licence. On this basis it is within independence that the UK CAA may decide differently from the EU. Of course it might not.

Last edited by Fl1ingfrog; 6th Jan 2021 at 12:13.
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 12:06
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Originally Posted by Fl1ingfrog View Post
S-Works, yes you have missed something, your quotation is not mine. I have suggested differently that we have entered eternal sunlight. I've responded on the basis that the originator baleares has a UK issued 'EASA' licence which is no longer because it is now a UK licence if so.
I assume you are party to a private conversation on that as non of there posts say UK licence?
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Old 6th Jan 2021, 16:24
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Assuming you want a night rating as part of a path to a CPL - When you apply for the CPL (the way the question was phrased) you only need to show that you satisfy the 5 hours requirement for a night rating, you don't actually have to have one.


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Old 6th Jan 2021, 21:25
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Originally Posted by rudestuff View Post
Assuming you want a night rating as part of a path to a CPL - When you apply for the CPL (the way the question was phrased) you only need to show that you satisfy the 5 hours requirement for a night rating, you don't actually have to have one.
incorrect....... itís the number one reason we have ICAO conversion for CPL refused. You have to hold a night rating. Your licence has to say night rating or equivalent on it or your application will be rejected. .
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Old 7th Jan 2021, 08:45
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That's not my experience of how the system works. If an FAA CPL with several hundred hours night flying logged (but no night rating obviously) wants to convert to EASA, are they going to make him/her fly 5 hours at night? 🤔

Also, I thought you could include night training as part of the CPL course - in which case having a night rating as a prerequisite would be pointless.
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Old 7th Jan 2021, 11:17
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There is no provision in the Aircrew Regulation for the 'conversion' of a night rating, which may be issued only on the basis of training received at an EASA approved ATO or DTO. The holder of an EASA PPL (which the OP is) seeking issue of a CPL must hold a night rating or have received the appropriate training as part of the approved CPL course (Appendix 3E to Part-FCL, para 10(b)). 'Conversion' of a 3rd country CPL is an entirely different matter and not relevant to the OP's question.
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Old 7th Jan 2021, 11:43
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Also, I thought you could include night training as part of the CPL course - in which case having a night rating as a prerequisite would be pointless.
According to Appendix 3, Part-FCL, you can do it within a CPL course but only as additional 5 hours.


Last edited by maximus610; 7th Jan 2021 at 11:45. Reason: Spelling
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Old 7th Jan 2021, 11:52
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Originally Posted by rudestuff View Post
That's not my experience of how the system works. If an FAA CPL with several hundred hours night flying logged (but no night rating obviously) wants to convert to EASA, are they going to make him/her fly 5 hours at night? 🤔

Also, I thought you could include night training as part of the CPL course - in which case having a night rating as a prerequisite would be pointless.

Correct. Its crazy but its the way it is. And yes you can do night training as part of the CPL course. Its an extra 5hrs.....

Every single ICAO CPL conversion we submitted without the candidate doing the night rating was rejected. We do the night rating now as part of the CPL package.
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Old 7th Jan 2021, 13:34
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The OP has not suggested an aspiration to become a CPL. We do not know which state issued his "EASA PPL", he hasn't told us. It will be helpful Baleares if you will tell us.

We know that EASA regulations can be interpreted in each state differently. We do not know how the UK will see things yet. S-works I do not doubt a word that you have stated regarding your professional experiences with all this. But is this one particular state such as Spain that you refer or have others responded the same.

That's not my experience of how the system works. If an FAA CPL with several hundred hours night flying logged (but no night rating obviously) wants to convert to EASA, are they going to make him/her fly 5 hours at night?
EASA do not have to abide with ICAO but each state does. The above doesn't necessarily mean that this person has complied with the full EASA syllabus. They will be able to demonstrate that they have completed a syllabus. As with the PPL through ATPL making up these unflown/theoretical elements is all that is required followed by a test. There is no test for the Night Rating. The non EASA PPL/CPL/ATPL and IR holder is not required to complete a whole new course, are they?
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Old 7th Jan 2021, 14:19
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Originally Posted by Fl1ingfrog View Post
The OP has not suggested an aspiration to become a CPL. We do not know which state issued his "EASA PPL", he hasn't told us. It will be helpful Baleares if you will tell us.

We know that EASA regulations can be interpreted in each state differently. We do not know how the UK will see things yet. S-works I do not doubt a word that you have stated regarding your professional experiences with all this. But is this one particular state such as Spain that you refer or have others responded the same.



EASA do not have to abide with ICAO but each state does. The above doesn't necessarily mean that this person has complied with the full EASA syllabus. They will be able to demonstrate that they have completed a syllabus. As with the PPL through ATPL making up these unflown/theoretical elements is all that is required followed by a test. There is no test for the Night Rating. The non EASA PPL/CPL/ATPL and IR holder is not required to complete a whole new course, are they?
We train pilots from all over the EU with all the flavours of NAA that incurs. Ironically we rarely ever train for Spanish licences as they are a monumental pain in the ass to deal with as they will only communicate in Spanish.

I have yet to have a single NAA accept the training from an FAA PPL to be acceptable for the issue of an EASA night rating.

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