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Procedures

Old 17th Apr 2019, 02:32
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Procedures

Elsewhere, we have included "procedures" in our discussion. More specifically, procedures applicable to the operation of the aircraft (as opposed to airport or airspace procedures). Procedures for operation of the aircraft may come from several sources; the best of which will be the approved flight manual (POH) for the aircraft. It is sadly common that the flight manual is either not emphasized, or worse, not even available in the cockpit (it is required to be available to the pilot in flight by regulation). It's amazing what the manufacturer of a certified aircraft writes about it! They know a lot! They have both an interest, and a regulatory requirement, to provide the pilot with comprehensive operating information and limitations.

So, as the pilot, you should read the flight manual, really.... cover to cover. That is a really good use for poor weather days at the airport, 'plane is parked, the flight manual is not in use, and, there's probably someone around who can answer a question or two which you may have about what you read. Note that the "flight manual" for an aircraft, includes all of the applicable supplements too! So if the plane has been modified, or equipment added since it left the factory, there may be a flight manual supplement describing that system, and more to the point, there could be changed operating limitations, and you are responsible for being aware of, and flying within those. Included in the limitation section (2) of a modern flight manual (since mid '70's) will be a copy of every limitation placard - in case the one in the plane has fallen off. Example, there's me, left seat in a Piper Navajo (with little time on type), I've read the flight manual, and off I fly, unaware that an AD placard has fallen off, and I'm using full flaps where that plane is now limited to 25 flap - my mistake. If I'd read the AD'd FMS, I might have realized that a limitation placard was missing, and I should fly it differently!

Now eager organizations, and instructors (and even a few private owners) have poor weather days too. Sometimes they spend this time imagining, recounting, applying and writing "other" procedures. Okay, it's all in good faith, I get that, but what's the authority to require that the aircraft be operated that way? When we write flight manuals and FMS's, we follow specific formats, and carefully consider flow, and task saturation. We certainly consider not repeating the same action several times per flight stage! I've seen home made checklists, with the same item three times before takeoff!

So, read the flight manual (they're interesting, people like me, well including me....) write them. Then if you're presented with a procedure or checklist which deviates, educate yourself by asking how that alternate procedure is authoritative/approved. Now if you can see that it's identical to the flight manual checklist, except for the addition of a local procedure, like noise abatement or something, okay, that's wise. Or if it neatly combines a supplemental checklist into the basic checklist, without changing order, meaning, content or quantity, that's probably fine. But when you see a checklist or procedure which obviously deviates from the flight manual checklist or procedure [you have read, and recall at least somewhat], it's worth a discussion as to why that alternate should be considered more authoritative than the manufacturer's checklist or procedure. maybe you'll learn something, though more likely the instructor/club will learn that you bothered to read the flight manual, and recall the theme of it's contents. Note that Cessna, for example, is really good at providing procedures, and then "amplified procedures" in which there will be lots of wise narrative about why you should do it that way!

All that said, some things are basic airmanship, and should not need to be included in a checklist or procedure - like line up, before opening the throttle for takeoff! You're not off the hook for basic good airmanship because a checklist is not ten pages long!
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 08:19
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This should be a Sticky.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 14:08
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A rule I've tried to follow in writing checklists and manuals (I suspect I've written less than my learned friend DAR, but still quite a few) is that if not knowing, or following something can cause damage to an aeroplane, or worse, risk to life. But if poor airmanship or an omission will only embarrass the pilot - that's their problem.

Hence my checklists would never, for example, omit engine checks, but don't include setting the transponder before take-off.

G
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 16:56
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Originally Posted by Genghis the Engineer
A rule I've tried to follow in writing checklists and manuals (I suspect I've written less than my learned friend DAR, but still quite a few) is that if not knowing, or following something can cause damage to an aeroplane, or worse, risk to life. But if poor airmanship or an omission will only embarrass the pilot - that's their problem.

Hence my checklists would never, for example, omit engine checks, but don't include setting the transponder before take-off.

G
I understand where you're coming from but I think the consensus view on transponders has changed in recent years. So if you (for example) leave your transponder on standby when you take off, and you have an airprox or worse with an aircraft descending on top of you because its TCAS hasn't seen you, that's a bit more than pilot embarrassment.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 20:08
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What is the checklist for? Is it to prevent an infrequent pilot having a problem? There's an argument for a rental aircraft checklist to include operational items for that locality.
(To prevent GtE and DAR starting their rented C150 at EG** without asking permission, or calling for taxi at EG@@ without phoning to book out.)
There's also an argument for radio/tx being in the list, along with malfunction checks for them.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 20:35
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With respect to procedures I find as a general rule the knowledge of what is in the POH is abysmally poor even among Instructors. A very real problem is “flight school-isms” .These are procedures that get mindlessly passed down from Chief Instructors to Instructors to Students without any critical thought and are often directly contrary to what is in the POH.

With respect to checklists the test should be. Will omitting or getting this action wrong significantly reduce flight safety. If the answer is no then it should not be on the checklist. I rewrote the checklist for a school I was helping out at. When I was done I removed about 50% of the items that were on the old checklist.
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 08:58
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OK, prepare to shout at me again!

I was shown a list of checklists with sequences that made no sense to me, and which my instructors did not follow in order anyway. So I made and memorised my own. It includes everything in the 'official' school checklist, plus a few extra things that make sense and particularly where it reinforces a link in other checklists (eg whenever I check compass/DI, I always also check QNH is set). It aligns with the POH although the grouping of items into the various checklists seems to vary depending where I look. eg, the POH mixes what I know as separate power checks and pre-take off checks.


eg. My C172 pre takeoff sequence is:

Pre Take-Off
  • Fuel Both
  • Trim Neutral
  • Mixture Set
  • Flaps Set
  • Transponder Alt
  • Radios Set up
  • DI/compass Set
  • QNH Set
  • Suction Green
  • T’s & P’s Green
  • Amps Charging
  • Primer in and locked
  • Mags Both
  • Lights Bcn, Nav, Taxi
  • Hatches & Harness Tight
  • Controls Full, free, sense

I do this after power checks and before calling for the frequency change.

That sequence means that I can sweep my hand around the cockpit touching everything in turn and the next thing falls into place naturally.

I suspect you chaps will have a fit at me making-up my own sequence. My instructors have watched me do it without comment - except when I miss something.
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 12:14
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My suggested addition to the checklist above would be: "Fuel Both & Quantity", otherwise, it's close enough to the Cessna checklist to tick all the boxes.

Though you're getting away with it now,

I was shown a list of checklists with sequences that made no sense to me, and which my instructors did not follow in order anyway. So I made and memorised my own
Is worrisome in the context of flying more advanced aircraft with low experience. I agree, some items on checklists could be perceived to be out of order or place, and I might agree that a few are - based on about 5000 hours flying various Cessna singles. But, a student pilot is not yet qualified, nor experienced enough to assess what sense a manufacturer's checklist makes. I agree that something about it's use might be awkward, but it is more likely that some things are in a certain order for a specific reason. That reason might be beyond your training thus far. Selection of fuel pump operation, particularly on Cessnas with "Hi and Low", would be an example.

It is very worrisome that instructors would be teaching you to "not follow in order" manufacturer's operating procedures. They too, might not have the experience to know better. What else about learning to fly are they making up for you?

When you make up and memorize your own procedures, it shows initiative, and that's good. However doing it your own way, contrary to the manufacturer's procedures means that if you have an incident, you're on thin ice explaining how you got yourself there procedure wise. More to the point, you are teaching and reinforcing for yourself (and it sounds like your instructor is helping) habits which will very certainly have to be unlearned later - possibly just before a flight test, and certainly when you transition to more complex aircraft, and absolutely when you fly as a crew member!

Two crew operations run strictly by approved checklists, so that two pilots not known to each other will work as a team, as they would if they flew together all the time. following procedures and cheklists to the word is the best way to assure common purpose behaviour in the cockpit - no freelancing. A pilot who turned up right seat in a commercial airplane with their personally made checklist in hand would be shown the cockpit door!

So you'd like an example of pilots having to "unlearn" a poor habit: Industry is all about assuring that pilots put the wheels down before landing. Checklists galore, buzzers and lights, and lots of history with wheels up landings to reflect upon. So the mantra drilled in by 98% of instructors (I'm in the other 2%): "Wheels down for landing". So far so good right? We have hundreds of thousands of pilots out there diligently confirming that the wheels are down for landing. "Sounds great - until you're flying an amphibian. Landing wheels down on water in an amphibian is going to wreck the plane every time. So every pilot I train is unlearned then retrained to say out loud, as they visually check ('cause there are no warning systems in most amphibs) either: "Wheels are down for landing on land" or "Wheels are up for landing on water". EVERY amphib pilot I have trained (many) has omitted this, or got it wrong at least twice during training. I'm watching, and I'll catch it. Their first time = equals a reminder. Their second time will be me startlingly calling "Pull up and go around!!!", then exxplaining why later. Usually after that, they're beginning to get the idea. Still though, I had a 7000+ airline pilot try to land his amphibian wheels down on the water again - I caught him again....

So, for my own personal discipline, every RG airplane I fly is checklisted like an amphib; not just "wheels down", but "wheels down for landing on land" spoken out loud prelanding. You may laugh, but using that procedure prevents me having to unlearn later, and, has the added benefit that if I ever have to ditch an RG landplane, I'll already have the procedure correct for checking the gear, and it will be "wheels are up for landing on water" (which is a manuafacturer's procedure!)
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 14:56
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Ahhh, checklists.

Amplifying what has already been said, the first port-of-call must be the manufacturers flight manual, if there is one. Everything else, especially add-ons, requires a bit of cynicism. Of course, our new PPL student hasn't the experience to question such things and that is where the rot sets in.

Secondly, the 'why' and the 'what'. I have the great pleasure of flying with 200hr CPLs who have just finished the training gravy train. They're quite good at procedures until I ask them 'why/what?'. "Why do we switch that switch at that point? What does that switch do? What are you going to do if that switch doesn't work?" Many are lost for words at this point because they haven't read the book. They've learnt their checks and not bothered to get as far as Chapters 7 & 8 of the flight manual. Bearing in mind these chaps are now getting paid to fly, I occasionally go as far as getting them to explain every action before they do it.

Lastly, the lack of appetite to improve or fully understand. Back to my 200hr CPLs. We operate in a MEP (twin) environment and consequently do not have the luxury of aircraft that comply with all the V1, V2, Balanced Field protections that apply to your average Airbus. So, we sit at the holding point and Biggles Jr delivers a comprehensive departure brief, stipulating Vr speeds and actions before/after. The brief almost always includes an ".......engine failure before Vr I will abort the T/O and we will stop on the runway"; I highlight that Vr will appear somewhere about 100m before the end of the runway and there is no way will will ever successfully stop under such circumstances. The important bit is that I then send Biggles Jr away to do a bit of homework but, you guessed it, he regurgitates exactly the same brief next time we fly.

We have become lazy in aviation, something that goes against my particular grain; It is now acceptable to miss the centreline on landing. I was encouraged from the outset to seek constant improvement, understand how things worked and why we did something with an aircraft. We now have a tendency to look upon aviation as a number of hurdles and not a continuous journey. There is little appetite for betterment, and that includes reading the manuals.
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 16:02
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Further to Cows excellent point I have added some things to think about

Pre Take-Off
  • Fuel Both As was pointed out above this ensure fuel gets to the engine but do you have enough
  • Trim Neutral Looking out the back window where should the tab be ?
  • Mixture Set When would this not be full rich ? what about carb heat ?
  • Flaps Set When should you use flap, what is the max allowable ?
  • Transponder Alt
  • Radios Set up What should the last step always be ?
  • DI/compass Set
  • QNH Set
  • Suction Green. If the engine is at idle what will the gauge read ?
  • T’s & P’s Green What is the relationship between oil temp and pressure ?
  • Amps Charging If he engine is at idle what will the gauge read
  • Primer in and locked What would an indication be of an unlocked primer ?
  • Mags Both
  • Lights Bcn, Nav, Taxi
  • Hatches & Harness Tight. What about the seat lock and the seat backs ?
  • Controls Full, free, sense If a control was to be obstructed where in the check would you most likely see it ?
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 16:41
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Thanks, all worth thinking about.....but a few to follow-up on.....
  • Mixture Set When would this not be full rich ?
every time I have taken off so far !!!
  • what about carb heat ?
Yea, oddly (?) that's not a pre-take off item, but its just been used in the power checks
  • Radios Set up What should the last step always be ?
I don't know? On a boat I would wind down the squelch to confirm everything working and back to just silence the squelch. Where I fly the constant chatter makes that redundant.
  • T’s & P’s Green What is the relationship between oil temp and pressure ?
Does P drop as T rises?
  • Controls Full, free, sense If a control was to be obstructed where in the check would you most likely see it ?
I don't know? At the extreme of the movement I guess? Which perhaps raises the question how would I detect an incipient obstruction just before the stop?
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 17:53
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Originally Posted by double_barrel
Thanks, all worth thinking about.....but a few to follow-up on.....
  • Mixture Set When would this not be full rich ?
every time I have taken off so far !!!

Fine at near sea level airports but with a Density Altitude of 5000 ft or higher ( eg 2500 ft ASL airport on a 32 deg C day) you should lean to highest RPM during a full power runup and leave the mixture there for takeoff
  • what about carb heat ?
Yea, oddly (?) that's not a pre-take off item, but its just been used in the power checks

If you had indications of carb ice during the taxi out or runup I would suggest you consider leaving the carb heat on until you are ready to apply full power
  • Radios Set up What should the last step always be ?
I always double check the audio panel selections as the last item on the radio set up. This seems to be the place where you are most likely to miss set something
I don't know? On a boat I would wind down the squelch to confirm everything working and back to just silence the squelch. Where I fly the constant chatter makes that redundant.
  • T’s & P’s Green What is the relationship between oil temp and pressure ?
Does P drop as T rises?

Yes but you should mentally do a gross error check. eg the oil temp is a the bottom of the green and so is the oil pressure. Are you going to takeoff ?
  • Controls Full, free, sense If a control was to be obstructed where in the check would you most likely see it ?
I don't know? At the extreme of the movement I guess? Which perhaps raises the question how would I detect an incipient obstruction just before the stop?
I check the controls by going full aft then full left, full right and then full forward, then full left and right . One day I did this check on a club airplane. When I got to full aft and full right the controls locked solid. Some radio work had been done and a wire bundle was improperly secured. At the full travel the control T bar snagged the wire bundle and locked the controls. The aircraft had done over 50 flights since the work had been done......
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 18:41
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Originally Posted by Big Pistons Forever
  • Mixture Set When would this not be full rich ?
every time I have taken off so far !!!

Fine at near sea level airports but with a Density Altitude of 5000 ft or higher ( eg 2500 ft ASL airport on a 32 deg C day) you should lean to highest RPM during a full power runup and leave the mixture there for takeoff..

I mean I have never taken off with mixture full rich. I fly from an airport at 5,500MSL. The procedure I have been shown is lean to lean until I see RPM drop, then rich a smidge.

Carb heat is another area that I don't feel I have a good grip on. I have been given some procedures, but I am not sure how to interpret what I see. eg, start of descent: carb heat out, flaps, carb heat in. That's just a few seconds of carb heat and I don't know what it can achieve I imagine that I am watching for a rise in RPM as opposed to the expected drop, as a warning of icing?
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 19:44
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Re mixture, what you are doing is correct. I raise the issue because many pilots who are used to just leaving the mixture full rich for everything. Even the sea level pilots should start to lean in the climb above 5000 ft in order to get the best rate of climb.

With respect to carb icing.

1) You can get carb icing almost anytime even in quite warm temps if it is very humid

2) The first symptom of carb icing is a uncommanded reduction in RPM (fixed pitch prop) or MP (constant speed prop). Carb heat should go on immediately if you think you are losing power. The next indicator of carb icing will be the engine will start to run rough due to an excessively rich mixture. Delay getting carb heat in now is serious as the engine could be only seconds from failing completely

3) carb icing will be most prevalent at low power settings because the throttle butterfly will be almost closed causing the maximum pressure differential in the carb. This is why I commented about carb heat before takeoff. For example you get carb ice on the taxi out clear it on the runup but then wait at the hold line at low power before you can takeoff meaning the ice can reform.

4) The runup carb ice check had two components. First that the carb heat is working, you check that by observing an RPM drop after applying carb heat. Second that there is no carb ice. If there is you see the RPM initially drop but then rise again as the ice is melted.

5) if you are inflight and you miss the initial uncommanded power reduction and are now at the rough running engine stage when you apply heat the engine will initially probably run even worse as it eats the melting ice. The temptation is to turn off the carb heat. Don’t do this the engine will clear and pick up power in about 15 seconds.

6) if you have to run with carb heat on you should re lean as carb heat enriches the mixture


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Old 19th Apr 2019, 20:17
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Thanks. THat's really helpful.
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 20:54
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I'm no checklist and procedure design expert although I have been involved at some stage as part of team when we introduced a new to us biz jet into our fractional operation.

Just a couple of thoughts and observations:

The thread is titled "procedures" but many posts discuss checklists. I think the two need to be separated. Unfortunately it has been my experience that many GA aircraft manufacturers don't do that. The normal procedures section from the POH or AFM basically IS the checklist. That's often not practical. A procedure tells you what you have to do, and often how to do it, step by step. A checklist should only cover the critical parts contained in the procedures. It's not practical to run a long checklist as a read and do. Some will initially disagree but it becomes clear to them when I point out that they don't raise or lower the gear when they get to that item in the checklist but instead they do it at the appropriate phase of flight. The same is true for many other items, especially when the aircraft is in motion either on the ground or in the air. The procedures should be carried out as flows, backed up by check lists at an appropriate time. Unfortunately I feel that many GA cockpits have not been designed with flows in mind and there are no published flows and follow up checklists. Cessna is a good example, up to and including their biggest biz jets. Dassault on the other hand has long adopted the "flows, followed by short checklists" philosophy on their Falcon business jets. Of course Airbus and Boeing have been doing it like this for decades. Smaller GA OEMs? Not so much in my experience. But then again, I'm not that involved in light GA types anymore so maybe there has been some change? Would really like to know.
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Old 19th Apr 2019, 21:47
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733driver

An excellent point about flows. The checks double barrel have are a flow. They start at the floor mounted fuel selector and make a counter clockwise circle around the instrument panel to end at the seatbelt

Also you are absolutely correct between SOP and a checklist.For example I teach that the initial climb to 1000 ft AGL is done st 76 kts (Vy). That is not on any Checklist it is s SOP

Also there seems to be a lot of confusion between “checklists” and “do lists”. A checklist is something you do after completion of all items by means of a flow. A do list is something you do item by item. For single pilot operations in small aircraft my checks are do lists for checks when the aircraft is stopped or in cruise flight and checklists for the other in flight checks

do list

prestart, taxi, before takeoff, cruise, descent, shutdown

checklist

line up, prelanding, after landing
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 12:47
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Certainly some airplane's cockpits were designed better than others to promote flow. Using the Cessnas for example, those from the late 50's were horribly scattered, I opine simply because our industry had not yet come to demand commonality. Standardization can be seen evolving into cockpit design as subsequent design standards improved their definition of the relationship of some controls and instruments to each other. When I was being trained in the Cessna Caravan, it was very evident that it was designed to promote flows, as the required actions and checks corresponded well to slowly sweeping one's hand in several logical directions at each phase of flight. Even flight manuals have evolved over the decades to be standardized. In the mid 1970's manufacturer's agreed on a standardized format, which is now a specified format, so the pilot can learned that certain sections will always

My quick review of the earliest and latest FAR Part 23.777 shows that the earliest, is 8 lines of standard, and the latest is 38 lines. Both define the position of flap control (right of engine controls) and gear (left of engine control), though the latest standard goes much further to define things, for example the relative position of engine controls for centerline thrust aircraft.

And important reason for type training, even if your license covers the new type anyway, may be be differences in the new type, which are not intuitive. I remember being trained in the Cessna 340 after flying the Aztec; a difference, if you suspect an engine fire, to confirm before securing the engine, open the cowl flaps and look, as unlike the Aztec, the 340 (as some other Cessna twins) have cowl flaps on top of the nacelle, rather than underneath, where you may not see the fire exiting the cowl flap.

I remember during my design review of the Lycoming 360 powered DA-42 for it's STC approval, I noticed that Diamond had used the control common to the DA-40 alternate air control for emergency landing gear extension on the DA-42-L360. I commented that DA-40 pilots transitioning to the DA-42 might inadvertently lower the DA-42 gear, while thinking that alternate air was needed. I remember a few DHC-6 Twin Otter landplanes having landing gear selectors installed at the request of the operator, as all of the rest of their fleet were retractable, and they wanted common procedures for all of the aircraft.
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Old 24th Apr 2019, 22:54
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Double Barrel, I thought I'd join you in getting yelled at. Here's my checklist for the same part of the pre takeoff phase. Our club uses an exhaustive checklist that covers all our aircraft:

Runup:

Facing into wind
Check surface for loose stones or objects that could blow into your prop or hit someone/something behind you
Check that no people are nearby (especially behind you)
Park brake - set
Power - set at manufacturers recommended setting for runup and pause to let it settle
Confirm aircraft is stationery on park brake. Apply toe brakes as required if the aircraft is moving.
Warning lights - test (if available)
Left and right magneto test (for rpm drop and difference between them are within normal parameters)
Carb heat cycle (if applicable)
Reduce power to minimum and pause to let it settle
Carb heat cycle (if applicable)

Pretakeoff:

Power set to idle
Throttle friction - firm
Trim - set for take off and any electric trim works in the correct sense
Mixture - set for full power as required
Carb heat - cold (if applicable)
Prop pitch - full fine (if applicable)
Fuel - contents (verbal check that we have sufficient fuel and oil for the flight), selector (both/fullest tank), pump (as required), primer (locked), pressure (nominal)
Flaps - set for takeoff
Instruments - QNH set, transponder code set, DI bug set, AH level set, verify GPS function (if available), verify correct radio frequencies set.
Ignition - both, master - both, avionics master - on
Hatches and harnesses - secure
Controls - full and free movement
Lookout turn - check downwind, base and final for any conflicting traffic
Takeoff briefing - "In the event of an engine failure during the takeoff run I shall close the throttle, apply the brakes, keep the aircraft straight and come to a stop on the runway. If we have an engine failure after becoming airborne I shall lower the nose, look for best glide speed, select an open field ahead of the aircraft into wind and land. If we have any other emergency after becoming airborne we shall complete a circuit of the airfield and land. Are there any questions?"

And in case you are wondering, yes I had to memorize it.
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Old 25th Apr 2019, 01:06
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Originally Posted by flyinkiwi
Double Barrel, I thought I'd join you in getting yelled at. Here's my checklist for the same part of the pre takeoff phase. Our club uses an exhaustive checklist that covers all our aircraft:

Runup:

Facing into wind
Check surface for loose stones or objects that could blow into your prop or hit someone/something behind you
Check that no people are nearby (especially behind you)
Park brake - set
Power - set at manufacturers recommended setting for runup and pause to let it settle
Confirm aircraft is stationery on park brake. Apply toe brakes as required if the aircraft is moving.
Warning lights - test (if available)
Left and right magneto test (for rpm drop and difference between them are within normal parameters)
Carb heat cycle (if applicable)
Reduce power to minimum and pause to let it settle
Carb heat cycle (if applicable)

Pretakeoff:

Power set to idle
Throttle friction - firm
Trim - set for take off and any electric trim works in the correct sense
Mixture - set for full power as required
Carb heat - cold (if applicable)
Prop pitch - full fine (if applicable)
Fuel - contents (verbal check that we have sufficient fuel and oil for the flight), selector (both/fullest tank), pump (as required), primer (locked), pressure (nominal)
Flaps - set for takeoff
Instruments - QNH set, transponder code set, DI bug set, AH level set, verify GPS function (if available), verify correct radio frequencies set.
Ignition - both, master - both, avionics master - on
Hatches and harnesses - secure
Controls - full and free movement
Lookout turn - check downwind, base and final for any conflicting traffic
Takeoff briefing - "In the event of an engine failure during the takeoff run I shall close the throttle, apply the brakes, keep the aircraft straight and come to a stop on the runway. If we have an engine failure after becoming airborne I shall lower the nose, look for best glide speed, select an open field ahead of the aircraft into wind and land. If we have any other emergency after becoming airborne we shall complete a circuit of the airfield and land. Are there any questions?"

And in case you are wondering, yes I had to memorize it.
My 02 cents

No liking a lot of what you posted. Managing prop wash and looking out for traffic should be an SOP that you do all the time, not just when you are prompted by a checklist. The same with monitoring brake effectiveness. The carb function and carb ice check should not be optional, you need to know that the carb heat works and there is no ice before every flight. I also note according to your check you can takeoff with both the gyro suction failed and no charging system....
Big Pistons Forever is offline  

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