Tracey Curtis-Taylor (Merged threads)
Thread Starter
Did she really put any thought in to wearing the RAF brevet or wings while carrying the Royal Navy name on the Spirit of Artifice?
To make matters worse the guy on the right of the picture in this post appears to be a genuine Royal Navy pilot.
The caption is;
Tracey Curtis-Taylor receives a letter written from the First Sea Lord Admiral Sir George Zambellas
Maybe advice such don't let anyone see Ewald and have a nice three months in top hotels?
To make matters worse the guy on the right of the picture in this post appears to be a genuine Royal Navy pilot.
The caption is;
Tracey Curtis-Taylor receives a letter written from the First Sea Lord Admiral Sir George Zambellas
Maybe advice such don't let anyone see Ewald and have a nice three months in top hotels?
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Pilots could not regard the badge as truly theirs until six months productive flying service on a squadron had been achieved (combat ready, in general terms)
I wonder if T-C-T will get similar recognition to this in 80 or so years time.
Typhoon terror: How Jean Batten beat the odds and flew into history
Somehow I think not.
Typhoon terror: How Jean Batten beat the odds and flew into history
Somehow I think not.
Beagle, you never fail to amaze me; the new phrase of the day is Beagle-eyed. 
Cows Getting Bigger: spot on fella.
Brevet; I was devastated when I found out I would not get mine, although they would have been the RN "squashed moth" variety, I felt a large rug had been pulled from beneath me. The effort to get to where I did was immense and I take my hat off to those that made it further down that particular pipeline.
As for TCT wings, I can think of no excuse/reason for her to wear any form of military brevet irrespective of the era they are from. You can get away with wearing a uniform,medal or badge as part of a costume a la Cheryl Cole/Fernandez/latest hubbies name as there is no attempt to deceive. With TCT we all know EXACTLY why she wears them, she wants to be something which she clearly is not.
If the wings had anything to do with Amy Johnson then I believe they should be Air Transport Auxiliary ones; even so, these too would be an affront to all ATA pilots if worn by a walt.
Cows Getting Bigger: spot on fella.
Brevet; I was devastated when I found out I would not get mine, although they would have been the RN "squashed moth" variety, I felt a large rug had been pulled from beneath me. The effort to get to where I did was immense and I take my hat off to those that made it further down that particular pipeline.
As for TCT wings, I can think of no excuse/reason for her to wear any form of military brevet irrespective of the era they are from. You can get away with wearing a uniform,medal or badge as part of a costume a la Cheryl Cole/Fernandez/latest hubbies name as there is no attempt to deceive. With TCT we all know EXACTLY why she wears them, she wants to be something which she clearly is not.
If the wings had anything to do with Amy Johnson then I believe they should be Air Transport Auxiliary ones; even so, these too would be an affront to all ATA pilots if worn by a walt.
An interesting point! There was an attempt to get a stolen valour act on the books in the UK - it was rejected by the government. ..
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/111414
So it's not illegal, just arguably in very poor taste.
G
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/111414
So it's not illegal, just arguably in very poor taste.
G
Thanks Genghis, the government response is vague (to me at least) as it is unclear if the "...pretence of being awarded an official medal" is fraudulent only if it is associated with making, or attempting to make, financial reward.
There must be something unlawful with wearing decorations that one is not entitled to wear otherwise Roger Day could not have been charged and sentenced.
BBC News - Is it illegal to wear medals you weren't awarded?
There must be something unlawful with wearing decorations that one is not entitled to wear otherwise Roger Day could not have been charged and sentenced.
BBC News - Is it illegal to wear medals you weren't awarded?
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I'm not a lawyer and may have this wrong; but I think there may be a subtle distinction between "medals", and "insignia / badges of rank"
My interpretation is that falsely claiming a medal is claiming to have done something that you haven't done (sort of rings a bell, doesn't it!); whereas falsely wearing insignia such as a badge of rank or a pilot's brevet is claiming a qualification and, effectively, an identity to which you are not entitled. It is the latter case that the article I quoted earlier makes me believe to be an offence.
Is there a lawyer on here that can confirm or refute this?
My interpretation is that falsely claiming a medal is claiming to have done something that you haven't done (sort of rings a bell, doesn't it!); whereas falsely wearing insignia such as a badge of rank or a pilot's brevet is claiming a qualification and, effectively, an identity to which you are not entitled. It is the latter case that the article I quoted earlier makes me believe to be an offence.
Is there a lawyer on here that can confirm or refute this?
Last edited by Jonzarno; 1st Oct 2016 at 10:58. Reason: Clarification
I also note that the RAF Flying Badge which That Woman is wearing is surmounted by a king's crown, rather than a queen's crown. - BEagle
"Wondered when you'd spot that, Pike!"
No big deal, but I believe that we should actually refer to a Tudor crown and a St Edward's crown respectively, rather than a king's or queen's, since I understand that the St Edward's crown was also adopted by several Hanoverian kings, and that only a symbolic image of the Tudor crown was used for official purposes by 20th century kings, so may not necessarily be regarded as setting a precedent for the future.
I only (as in "solo"
) learned during a visit to the House of Lords this week that the original Tudor crown was apparently broken up after the execution of King Charles I, and that a replica was recreated in recent years.
Either way, TCT now appears to have succeeded in upsetting the two-winged master race of not one, but two Services, but at least we can be pretty sure that those wings are not Danny's.....
Jack
"Wondered when you'd spot that, Pike!"
No big deal, but I believe that we should actually refer to a Tudor crown and a St Edward's crown respectively, rather than a king's or queen's, since I understand that the St Edward's crown was also adopted by several Hanoverian kings, and that only a symbolic image of the Tudor crown was used for official purposes by 20th century kings, so may not necessarily be regarded as setting a precedent for the future.
I only (as in "solo"
) learned during a visit to the House of Lords this week that the original Tudor crown was apparently broken up after the execution of King Charles I, and that a replica was recreated in recent years.Either way, TCT now appears to have succeeded in upsetting the two-winged master race of not one, but two Services, but at least we can be pretty sure that those wings are not Danny's.....
Jack
Thread Starter
I never knew brevets or pilot wings meant so much.
I found an old picture tonight of a flying sweater given to me by the Mona Flying Club in 1983. It clearly shows wings plus MFC for Mona Flying Club.
Lots of flying clubs have pilot wings on sale but it appears there is a big distinction in what they represent.
Clearly TCT had the flying suit made with sponsors patches plus the RAF Brevet but the question remains why she chose a historic one? Why wear it on board the Spirit of Artemis bearing the Royal Navy emblem plus Royal Navy and Royal Marines Charity logo?
I have today replied to Robert Robson at the RNRM charity asking the above question.
I found an old picture tonight of a flying sweater given to me by the Mona Flying Club in 1983. It clearly shows wings plus MFC for Mona Flying Club.
Lots of flying clubs have pilot wings on sale but it appears there is a big distinction in what they represent.
Clearly TCT had the flying suit made with sponsors patches plus the RAF Brevet but the question remains why she chose a historic one? Why wear it on board the Spirit of Artemis bearing the Royal Navy emblem plus Royal Navy and Royal Marines Charity logo?
I have today replied to Robert Robson at the RNRM charity asking the above question.
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Lots of flying clubs have pilot wings on sale but it appears there is a big distinction in what they represent.
Apologies for the drift.
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JS
Ref #1655 and AWPA's reply which stated
" At no time did TCT suggest to me, nor did any of her statements state the fact that she was doing the flight solo."
It's sad indeed that neither did TCT point out that the Honorary award certificate was inaccurate as it had attributed the flight as a SOLO when it was clearly not. Maybe TCT did not read the certificate
(afterall it was pointing away from her ) or if she had, did not wish to embarass her hosts...though one would have wondered why this clarification could not have been done in private or later by her PR team?
In this day and age, it is easy to reach out to ALL media ( to correct any wrong impression) by simply putting out an early statement on one's Facebook page,the moment an inaccuracy is reported.One need not write to every media making an inaccurate report. Any reasonable person would have been expected to have done so.
Cheers
Ref #1655 and AWPA's reply which stated
" At no time did TCT suggest to me, nor did any of her statements state the fact that she was doing the flight solo."
It's sad indeed that neither did TCT point out that the Honorary award certificate was inaccurate as it had attributed the flight as a SOLO when it was clearly not. Maybe TCT did not read the certificate
(afterall it was pointing away from her ) or if she had, did not wish to embarass her hosts...though one would have wondered why this clarification could not have been done in private or later by her PR team?In this day and age, it is easy to reach out to ALL media ( to correct any wrong impression) by simply putting out an early statement on one's Facebook page,the moment an inaccuracy is reported.One need not write to every media making an inaccurate report. Any reasonable person would have been expected to have done so.
Cheers
Let us not forget the image of her standing in front of the screen that had the word ALONE on it. At any point in the presentation did she say she was not alone? I recall there were many uses of the word "I".
The presentation was 30 April 2016 at the Museum of Flight, long after any clarification should have been made. Image is at 5:30 in the linked video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xw4ca2CoVc4
Had this been filmed prior to the flight(s) then it could be argued that there was a plan to fly alone/solo/sole, but to openly continue the charade long after the flights had ended and the awards given is blatantly wrong.
The presentation was 30 April 2016 at the Museum of Flight, long after any clarification should have been made. Image is at 5:30 in the linked video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xw4ca2CoVc4
Had this been filmed prior to the flight(s) then it could be argued that there was a plan to fly alone/solo/sole, but to openly continue the charade long after the flights had ended and the awards given is blatantly wrong.
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Jay Sata,
I assume that letter you posted above was from Carol Dehn of the AWPA.
A lovely person and a very competent aviator in her own right.
I can identify with her unease and request for clarification over TCT's earlier use of the word "solo" in the widely disseminated media releases
and on the 'Bird in a Biplane' website.
Of course, things seem to have largely been 'cleaned up' now - even if Boeing themselves were still spruiking the "solo" claim as recently as a few weeks ago.
However..
I think I recall, earlier on this thread, a contributor had posted some revealing TCT publicity excerpts sourced from the "Wayback Machine - Internet Archive".
It's strange, though, isn't it, that well-respected media outlets everywhere, from the Telegraph and Guardian in the UK to Australia's ABC
all seem to have made identical 'mistakes'?
Seems everybody's stupid except TCT and her PR/Media Manager, Tim Kelly.
.
I assume that letter you posted above was from Carol Dehn of the AWPA.
A lovely person and a very competent aviator in her own right.
I can identify with her unease and request for clarification over TCT's earlier use of the word "solo" in the widely disseminated media releases
and on the 'Bird in a Biplane' website.
Of course, things seem to have largely been 'cleaned up' now - even if Boeing themselves were still spruiking the "solo" claim as recently as a few weeks ago.
However..
I think I recall, earlier on this thread, a contributor had posted some revealing TCT publicity excerpts sourced from the "Wayback Machine - Internet Archive".
It's strange, though, isn't it, that well-respected media outlets everywhere, from the Telegraph and Guardian in the UK to Australia's ABC
all seem to have made identical 'mistakes'?
Seems everybody's stupid except TCT and her PR/Media Manager, Tim Kelly.
.
Last edited by Stanwell; 2nd Oct 2016 at 09:41.
Stanwell - from Feb 4 2015. This is her website so one presumes she takes responsibility for what is placed on it.
Tracey Curtis Taylor Aviator, Adventurer, Inspirational Speaker
Tracey Curtis Taylor Aviator, Adventurer, Inspirational Speaker
Tracey is an amazing storyteller…and will spellbind any audience.
Her solo open-cockpit biplane flight from Cape Town to Goodwood was the realisation of
something beyond a dream. It encompassed great adventure and daring in some of the most
spectacularly beautiful and dangerous parts of the world today.
Her solo open-cockpit biplane flight from Cape Town to Goodwood was the realisation of
something beyond a dream. It encompassed great adventure and daring in some of the most
spectacularly beautiful and dangerous parts of the world today.
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I'm not 100% sure which of her "achievements" was recognised by that AWPA award but is this picture part of the proof they seek?
From an on line dictionary definition of the word "alone":
Note the quoted synonym: "Solo"
From an on line dictionary definition of the word "alone":
having no one else present; on one's own.
"she was alone that evening"
synonyms: by oneself, on one's own, all alone, solo, lone, solitary, single, singly
"she was alone that evening"
synonyms: by oneself, on one's own, all alone, solo, lone, solitary, single, singly
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Ah yes, Jonzarno.
I think that image was captured in Seattle earlier this year, prior to Tracey embarking upon the final leg of her "Circumnavigation of the World".
Earlier, she'd been interviewed by a Seattle newspaper, during which she referred to Ewald, while he was assembling the Stearman, as "my mechanic", whom
she'd graciously permitted to "tag along" on her adventure.
I seem to recall that the intended USA gig had been reported as being "solo", as well. .. Just another stupid journalist who can't get things right, I presume.
Just by way of a p.s. .. Had TCT, as planned, triumphally lobbed into Oshkosh during the EAA convention, I wonder just what kind of reception she was
expecting from the International Organisation of Women Pilots, the 'Ninety-Nines', who have a presence there every year.
That organisation was set up in 1929 by, among others, Amelia Earhart and Nancy Bird-Walton.
A Canadian member had confided in me that they were aware of TCT's reputation and that questions were likely to be asked.
.
I think that image was captured in Seattle earlier this year, prior to Tracey embarking upon the final leg of her "Circumnavigation of the World".
Earlier, she'd been interviewed by a Seattle newspaper, during which she referred to Ewald, while he was assembling the Stearman, as "my mechanic", whom
she'd graciously permitted to "tag along" on her adventure.
I seem to recall that the intended USA gig had been reported as being "solo", as well. .. Just another stupid journalist who can't get things right, I presume.
Just by way of a p.s. .. Had TCT, as planned, triumphally lobbed into Oshkosh during the EAA convention, I wonder just what kind of reception she was
expecting from the International Organisation of Women Pilots, the 'Ninety-Nines', who have a presence there every year.
That organisation was set up in 1929 by, among others, Amelia Earhart and Nancy Bird-Walton.
A Canadian member had confided in me that they were aware of TCT's reputation and that questions were likely to be asked.
.
Last edited by Stanwell; 2nd Oct 2016 at 11:45.
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Ref #1661
I believe the AWPA's Honorary membership was for a perceived SOLO flight to Australia. They have not found any reference directly attributable to TCT claiming that it was a SOLO flight, only media reports from those who had believed/assumed the flight was SOLO.
The picture unfortunately is of her publicising her AFRICAN adventure,as being "alone in the cockpit". This is of no relevance to AWPA's award , but to LAA.
Has a similar claim come out in any talks that TCT may have been given on that London-Sydney flight? If so, a similar slide may satisfy the AWPA.
Cheers
I believe the AWPA's Honorary membership was for a perceived SOLO flight to Australia. They have not found any reference directly attributable to TCT claiming that it was a SOLO flight, only media reports from those who had believed/assumed the flight was SOLO.
The picture unfortunately is of her publicising her AFRICAN adventure,as being "alone in the cockpit". This is of no relevance to AWPA's award , but to LAA.
Has a similar claim come out in any talks that TCT may have been given on that London-Sydney flight? If so, a similar slide may satisfy the AWPA.
Cheers