Are Shoreham flying schools so busy.........

[fa2fi]

I don't think your experience is atypical. It's UK GA. I'm well glad I'm out of it. GA can suffer from the small town mentality as it were. I'd often pitch up and be treated more like a trespasser than a paying customer at some airfields. And as for flights schools they're very unpredictable - keep looking until you find a good one. If they don't treat you well when you come to them as potential business then they're not going to treat you well once you've signed up and they have your membership fee or fee or worse you pay up front for their block rates.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by piperboy84

He offered to go upstairs and print out the latest weather then spent a fair bit of time interpreting and discussing what conditions I could expect along my intended route. The net result I delayed the flight till the next day.

Can't remember the guys name but he appeared to be in his late 50's and he offered me his professional advice, use of his computers and his time all without the request or expectation of remuneration and knowing there would be no future business or selling to a guy who was just passing through.

Cue one of those discussions about the duty people do or don't owe to other pilots whom they think might be about to go off and do something potentially risky?

[Jonzarno]

I politely asked reception if they would be kind enough to phone my home airfield and ask if all was now well and offering to pay for the call. I got a blank refusal from an extremely stroppy receptionist.

[Rant]Not just in this context, but generally: I'm simply amazed that anyone could refuse such a simple, and effectively costless, courtesy. I know that people do, but can't understand why.

Reading some of the earlier posts in this thread, I'm also struck by the attitude of some of the experiences and comments that I would summarise as: "if there's no immediate benefit to me, why should I behave kindly to you?"

Perhaps if those subscribing to such a view were to have a flat tyre on a rainy Friday evening at the side of a busy motorway, they might wish heartily to meet someone who doesn't agree with it...... [\Rant]

Ah, that feels better!

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by Jonzarno

[Rant]Not just in this context, but generally: I'm simply amazed that anyone could refuse such a simple, and effectively costless, courtesy.

Ah, but, what if it isn't costless?


Suppose a handling service had been available, a bargain at £30, including unlimited free use of the phone, and the punter had refused to buy the handling service, but then asked for the free phone calls anyway?


In that case the cost to the phone owner is the £30 fee they haven't taken. Let everybody have free phone calls and an entire income stream bites the dust !!!

[Jonzarno]

I didn't read that as being the context but, even if it was, £30 for a phone call does seem a trifle steep.......

Cue mandatory handling thread creep.....

[rnzoli]

Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat

In that case the cost to the phone owner is the £30 fee they haven't taken.

You probably mean opportunity cost. i.e., the imaginary loss of revenue. The real cost would have been the cost charged by the landline phone company, not the 30 GPB.

Let everybody have free phone calls and an entire income stream bites the dust !!!

Alternatively, set unreasonably high prices, with no granularity between zero calls and infinite number of calls, and 99% of the revenue stream opportunity bites the dust in the very same way! So not only generousity but greed also kills revenue streams. The chap offered to cover the cost of the call, but it was not accepted. So they waited until someone brought a mobile phone and made their call over that. So in economical terms, the opportunity cost to the owner wasn't his imaginary 30 GPB, but the much lower cost of 1 mobile call. Economically speaking, both the pilots and the owner lost the opportunity to make a deal and help each other (and the mobile phone company won ) This is why it makes sense to be moderately nice and flexible in business - not too generous, not too greedy....

[nkt2000]

I think the main problem is that we don't understand the concept of "service" in the UK any more. I am not encouraged by some of the replies on this thread and I certainly wouldn't put any business in the way of one or two respondents.

[Lukesdad]

I think that when I first considered learning to fly, I did think that the flight school was getting a significant proportion of my hourly rate as profit. Twenty odd years a PPL and several hundred hours later, I understand that not many people in the training world appear to have made their millions and retired.

I can only defend the Shoreham operation by stating that their ATC is one of the busiest and most professional I have come across and as far as flight schools are concerned, I booked a trial lesson with Advance Helicopters last year in their Schweizer before deciding whether or not to turn to the 'dark side' of rotary flight, and found them friendly, welcoming and efficient.

Mind you, I spoke to them a week earlier, booked in during the week rather than a weekend, turned up on time and had researched the aircraft I was to fly.

Perhaps Jonazarno and the flight school he chose just combined to have their bad day on the same day.

[Binners93]

Hi The Great Cornholio
Sorry to hear about what happened with Omega, as I understand they were becoming quieter as the months went on over the last couple of years. Have you considered FTA on the airfield for training? I know they train PPL students both full and part time on Warrior IIs and DA40s?

[Capt Kremmen]

nkt2000

You are so right ! What frightens me is that we, as a nation, are supposed to be running a service economy.


rrizoli

The true and correct cost to Compton Abbas is partly quantifiable. If I went there three or four times a year as was my habit - with passengers, the landing fee plus our cafeteria spending x two years is now lost.

With no attempt to explain their policy, no attempt at even a grudging apology, I felt justified in spreading the word about Compton's lack of elementary politeness and good manners. So, I did just that. That bit can't be quantified with any accuracy.

Some of the people who run these places shouldn't be running a newspaper round - with apologies to the boys and girls who do such a good job. Might I suggest, that if our visiting experience is not a good one then we would be doing all our fellow aviators a huge favour in listing and publishing our personal experiences.

Such action might result in an improvement. We can live in hope !

[sprng cicken]

Oh I feel so sorry for the poor chap it would seem that no matter which flying school he goes to, he is not going to be happy. No doubt there is a school which rolls out the red carpet and gives a golden service, but then I don't suppose he would be happy with the cost, so would moan about that. It would also be of benefit for him to learn of the enormous amount of work done at a flying school in the morning. If he expects to sit down and chat, there would be no flying done, as nothing would be ready for the day.

[Arw82]

+1 for the Real Flying Company. I was one of their first PPLs 13 years ago! Great club friendly, well maintained / looked after aircraft and lots of professional pilot instructors. Husband and wife team, very friendly atmosphere. Don't let Omega going bust put you off, I started with Southern and they went the same way!

[rnzoli]

Originally Posted by Capt Kremmen

Such action might result in an improvement. We can live in hope !

Always! And I don't think it's a UK-specific thing. With the "wrong" conditions in an economy, the verb "to serve" can lose its meaning quite quickly.

In my past 4 years in GA PPL training and flying, I am going through my 4th base/school by now. But I am NOT bitter about any of them! They all had certain ideas and logic in their setup, and I took the advantage of the prioritized benefits I was after, and for this, I put up with the disadvantages for a limited time. There were mutual advantages, but as needs/circumstances changed, we parted in peace. I was quite open to all of the school owners / club managers on what made me go away, and I accepted that they had a different view on the same things. While I was quite open to tell anyone my personal experience with them, I didn't go about bitching and bad-mouthing them. I always give a balanced view on these schools / clubs, including the upsides and downsides. I noticed that the club / school owners accept critiscism better this way, and I can also confirm that with enough pressure from the clients, they change. So there is a reason to hope, but one must be realistic and should not expect immediate miracles.

[Jonzarno]

Perhaps Jonazarno and the flight school he chose just combined to have their bad day on the same day.

You misunderstand: the problem that the OP and subsequent posters had were nothing to do with me; I was just reacting to a report about what I thought was a particularly bad example of bad customer service. It was not my own experience. The school where I trained (Northamptonshire School of Flying) was exemplary and I'd recommend them to anyone.

[Capt Kremmen]

There seem to be a few who continue to defend poor service. Permit me to remind them that in any context, cash and customers are king !

[xrayalpha]

If the customer is always right.... they'd know what to do and we wouldn't need flying instructors or schools!

[Capt Kremmen]

That comment gets full marks for idiocy! Being right and 'knowing what to do' are about as far removed as one could get. Don't muddy the waters, we're discussing elementary standards of good service.

[Jonzarno]

Well, IMHO the customer isn't always right. But how you tell them, and how you persuade them to buy what is genuinely right for them, is what professional and ethical selling is all about. It's also the start of good customer service.

[The Ancient Geek]

Yebbut it helps if the customer walks in with a smile and a nice word for the poor underpaid woman who has to sit at a reception desk all day taking crap from the world and his dog.

[Jonzarno]

I agree. Courtesy is a two way street: perhaps one of the most valuable, yet most inexpensive and easily acquired personal attributes. It's a shame that not everyone sees it that way.