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How high do you fly

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How high do you fly

Old 5th Jan 2012, 23:33
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East always FL110, west always FL100. I'd go higher if I had oxygen.

Generally I fly these heights for...

1. Safety (longer gliding distance in case of engine trouble, ability to see much further & divert around weather if necessary; terrain is not a major issue, but there are a few 1-2km mountains around, so it's a safety buffer there as well)

2. Comfort (in this part of the world it's 30 degs celsius on the ground; also the air is often completely calm at these altitudes, whereas you get thermals up to ~3000 feet)

3. Fuel economy

4. The view
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Old 5th Jan 2012, 23:46
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Top Down CItation usually FL380 or FL390. Seneca twins FL110 or FL120 but sometimes oxy on and up to FL220 if weather, freezing levels or winds dictate.
Normally aspirated FL80 or FL70! OCAS FL55 or 65 or 50 60.

For fun i would never admit but over sea down to 30 feet

I can remember an amazing trip in a twin via WAL past the IOM to prestwick and then up over the islands to the head of Loch Ness and all the way to inverness.
Had the prettiest training female co pilot and it was a hot day Not sure which views were best.
Again would never admit the height or anything else but try it sometime? Amazing!
Go low go slow go high and really fly.

Pace

Last edited by Pace; 6th Jan 2012 at 00:06.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 02:27
  #23 (permalink)  
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Well, it depends...

A to B over "nice" territory, 1000 to 2000 AGL, airspace considered.

A to B over territory I would not want to land into, much higher, ceiling and airspace considered.

Over water in a wheel plane, so I can glide to shore and a bit, unless I'm wearing a floater suit, and there is a reason to be low. I fly fire department searches over the local lakes from time to time, and have to fly much lower doing that.

When I'm flying a handling test, as high as I can practically get. I got "told" once for passing through 13,000 feet once, doing a power on stall evaluation in a Navajo. Light weight, aft C of G, a Navajo climbs pretty well at 75% power and slowing to stall speed - I had not planned on that!

When I flew an MD 500 helicopter back through British Columbia, every time I got higher than a few hundred feet, the other pilot with me got squeamish. I asked why. He told me that he did not like to fly very far from the ground, in case something went wrong. Being that low made me nervous....

My most fun, is flying the amphibian flying boat, as low as possible over a calm lake. I like to fly for miles just touching the keel onto the water occasionally. One day, while flying home into a 10 knot wind, I found the perfect power setting, at which is was possible to remain airborne in ground [water] effect , touch down onto the step, run along on the step for a while, and lift off again, all without adjusting the power at all. The plane would maintain level flight just off the water, but if I were to climb up 20 feet, I could not maintain level flight with that power setting, and slowly settled back into ground effect. You have to watch out for dumb seagulls though!
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 02:35
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Silvaire - interesting theory. Could be the case. Can't remember having it in the Seneca or Duchess, but then again I was busy with my training and didn't have much time to get vertigo! I used to get the same feeling whe I trained in helicopters as well - down low was fine, but anything above 1000ft would start to feel very bad. It was much worse in helicopters for some reason. I've subsequently found a thread in Rotorheads about this and apparently it's a pretty common thing.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 07:24
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I know of a few pilots who suffer "Breakaway" which is a vertigo or un- easy feeling whilst above say 1000-2000ft agl. Interestingly enough these pilots have jobs which keep them very low to the ground for 99% of their jobs.

Some people have surmised its lack of visual stimulus that brings on these feelings.

I have been a bit queasy while being PIC and had to cut a flight short, but that was in my earlier days with head firmly inside the cockpit... it hasn't happened for a while, nothing to do with alt!
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 08:24
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Generally 500-1500 ft rotary and 2000-3000 fw. I too get uncomfortable over about 3500 ft.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 08:55
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... For years had never gone above 3000' however on one trip that involved flying over mountain areas en route from UK to Frejus
(Cannes) - on the stretch from Marseilles it was necessary to climb
to over 9000' and although mid summer we soon after noticed what appeared to be either a light coating of dust - or otherwise the initial stages of icing beginning to form on the wing surfaces of our Cessna 172J. Any clues as to which it could have been ?


Incidentally when we landed at Frejus - that night our a/c was one of several that were lifted up. thrown around and severely damaged - as were several others - resulting from a sudden very high wind and storm that left the airfield with rainwater almost up to knee level - resulting in 4 weeks grounded and returning to the UK by train.

.....
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 09:10
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I'm still in the early stages of my PPL, but we seem to average around 5000ft.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 09:15
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When transitting in a Slingsby T61, (cruising airspeed 60kts on a good day) as low as safe and legal into wind, and 3,000ft plus (airspace permitting) downwind modifying track to use thermal cloudstreets, but staying at least 500ft below cloud to see 'pure' gliders doing the same.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 09:59
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to over 9000' and although mid summer we soon after noticed what appeared to be either a light coating of dust - or otherwise the initial stages of icing beginning to form on the wing surfaces of our Cessna 172J. Any clues as to which it could have been ?
Pasir

You should keep an eye on the temp guage? were you in cloud during the climb or clear air? Midsummer in that region its unusual to get the freezing level at 8-9 K usually higher.
Dust wont stick in the air only as a coating on the ground.
Was it still there when you landed? Again if it was frozen water it would have melted midsummer in the south of France on your way down.

Pace
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 10:15
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Interesting thread!

I am still training, however I too get a bit unconfortable when flying high during my lessons, but then again I don't fly regularly so this might be one of the problems in terms of my body/mind adjusting to flying at high altitudes. When flying as a passenger in an airline environment (I know it is not the same thing) I feel fine.

And by coincidence my next exam is Human Performance and Pilot Limitations.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 10:46
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As high as possible taking into account airspace, lack of oxygen, and combination of cloud base and medical (when flying on an NPPL declaration I don't fly through clouds, honest).

Three reasons for choosing high rather than low:

- you can see further so visual navigation is easier
- if the fan stops you've got several more minutes to work out what to do and a wider choice of places to go
- there's nobody else up there so reduced collision risk
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 11:48
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I'm still in the early stages of my PPL, but we seem to average around 5000ft.
You're unlikely to go above 6000' during training.

The lessons you end up high are:

1. learning to climb - you'll only end up very high if you just don't get it. I once ended up at 9000' with a student who took longer than normal to get the level off properly.

2. Stalling/Spinning - 6000' is plenty to stall or spin most aircraft safely

3. Nav over high terrain - unless you've got some very high ground in your area, you won't end up above 6000.

On a lot of club aircraft the heaters aren't great, so the instructor may not want to be going any higher than this anyway.

It takes a long time to climb well above this in most club aircraft, but it's certainly something to experiment with once you've got your licence. It's one thing reading about a service or absolute ceiling in a book, it's quite another flying up to it and seeing how the aircraft behaves.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 13:37
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During my training, I never got above 3500, and now normally fly, subject to CAS at about 2300, 2800 or 3200. To much military stuff below 2000

Did manage 4200 the other week in a C172 - my flying buddy seems to like climbing!

Was a bit unsettled leaving Wickenby when asked to remain not above 500 feet, due to aeros
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 14:34
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When touring, typically in the 7500 - 9500 band, obviously at hemispheric levels. Both the normally aspirated engine of the a/c I mostly fly (C172RGs) as well as - importantly! - Mrs. 172driver are happy at these altitudes. An added advantage is that it usually gets you above the 'bimblers', there's not much traffic up there, but still plenty to look at on the ground. That said, I think the highest I've been in this type was around 13k for a short while.

In other a/c and if O2 available, then higher, the low teens are a nice place to be (well, at least in aviation ).

If on a bimble, well, anything goes (within legal limits, of course!) although I have to say I prefer to be up high(ish) in general.

Interesting observation by Englishal (Adam, I guess you refer to his post and not Silvair's). Never had that problem, but can see how a low wing might give some idea of a 'floor' that a high wing doesn't.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 15:26
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Regarding getting the wimbles if you are up high, it apparently works the other way in parachute training. The squaddies are made to jump from a tethered balloon, which is all of 200 feet or so, and absolutely terrifying. I jumped (wan't pushed) out of a perfectly servicable airplane at 2,000, all by myself: the chute ripcord was attached to the aircraft, so any sack of potatoes could have done it. For some reason, it seemed like a reasonable thing to do, but I am very very scared of cliffs, ladders, roofs, edges in general.....
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 19:29
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About 7-8000 in the UK

10-12000 in the US.
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Old 6th Jan 2012, 19:51
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500 feet is fun. Less is even better.

I returned from the South West today (to Newbury) at 500 feet all the way home. It was lovely.
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Old 7th Jan 2012, 04:33
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Not having flown too much above 3000', does VFR navigation not get a bit tricky the higher you go? I would imagine 5000'+ ground features start to become harder to spot?
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Old 7th Jan 2012, 05:13
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Completely the opposite. The higher you are, the easier it is to navigate.
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