Cirrus SR20 deploys ballistic parachute near Banbury
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I submit that the money spent on gadgets might be better invested in training for the full Instrument Rating.
Years ago, I was flying a rented 172 with only the basic IFR panel, with two very brave passengers, from Florida to Baltimore. Over Virginia, we flew through a very lively front, with heavy noisy rain and gusts. The en route controller told us we would soon be through the nasty bit, and Norfolk was clear, so we decided to stop there and sooth our ruffled nerves with coffee etc.
Of course the front followed us up from Virginia, and sat on our proposed track to Baltimore. We did attempt to proceed, but when we saw the big black wall of cloud in front, and learned that the Baltimore approach was getting more and more dodgy, going back to Norfolk seemed a jolly good idea. We booked a motel.
Next day, we were monitoring the weather and the NFL Thanksgiving day game in the Pilots lounge, when a family took off in a fancy twin to fly to Long Island, for dinner with Granny. Four hours later they were back, having tried to approach five or six times and they all looked pretty stressed. Another night in the motel for us, and a Chinese takaway!
Next day finally got to Baltimore/Washington. Could have got there quicker by road, of course. But I don't think any modern gadget could have helped us get there any sooner or safer. My two friends and I will never forget that experience, wouldn't have missed it for anything!
But if you really want to get home safely for Christmas, book on an airline, with the professionals.
Years ago, I was flying a rented 172 with only the basic IFR panel, with two very brave passengers, from Florida to Baltimore. Over Virginia, we flew through a very lively front, with heavy noisy rain and gusts. The en route controller told us we would soon be through the nasty bit, and Norfolk was clear, so we decided to stop there and sooth our ruffled nerves with coffee etc.
Of course the front followed us up from Virginia, and sat on our proposed track to Baltimore. We did attempt to proceed, but when we saw the big black wall of cloud in front, and learned that the Baltimore approach was getting more and more dodgy, going back to Norfolk seemed a jolly good idea. We booked a motel.
Next day, we were monitoring the weather and the NFL Thanksgiving day game in the Pilots lounge, when a family took off in a fancy twin to fly to Long Island, for dinner with Granny. Four hours later they were back, having tried to approach five or six times and they all looked pretty stressed. Another night in the motel for us, and a Chinese takaway!
Next day finally got to Baltimore/Washington. Could have got there quicker by road, of course. But I don't think any modern gadget could have helped us get there any sooner or safer. My two friends and I will never forget that experience, wouldn't have missed it for anything!
But if you really want to get home safely for Christmas, book on an airline, with the professionals.
Mary:
I know you are into gliding. So was I. In my spare time (from my professional career) I was involved for 17 years in running an RAFGSA club and ended up as the CFI.
I would like to tell you about a remarkable instrument flight that I had with a young lady pupil who had not long gone solo and who had absolutely no experience of instrument flying.
She was in the front of a Bocian and I was in the back. We got underneath a promising Cu and off we went. We did not have an artificial horizon but just a turn and slip.
I promise you, I never once touched the controls but managed to teach her how to instrument fly on very basic instruments such that she (not me) came out the top of said Cu at 9,200 ft (I still have the trace).
By the way, she went on to get the Alex Orde Award from the BGA for getting all three silver legs in one year.
I wonder how many pilots nowadays would be happy with just a turn and slip?
Furthermore; how many pilots nowadays would know how to recover from a spin in cloud using just a turn and slip?
I had to.
The Piston Provost was relatively easy but the Vampire required a great deal of concentration on the turn needle because if you didn't spot (or anticipate the needle coming off the stops) then it was too late and you were going the other way.
Mind you, when the aeroplane is losing 6,500 ft per turn, you don't have a lot of time to bu**er about.
I seem to remember that if you had not got the Vampire out of the spin by 18,000 ft then you got rid of the canopy. If it was still spinning at 10,00 ft then you made a Martin Baker let down.
I know you are into gliding. So was I. In my spare time (from my professional career) I was involved for 17 years in running an RAFGSA club and ended up as the CFI.
I would like to tell you about a remarkable instrument flight that I had with a young lady pupil who had not long gone solo and who had absolutely no experience of instrument flying.
She was in the front of a Bocian and I was in the back. We got underneath a promising Cu and off we went. We did not have an artificial horizon but just a turn and slip.
I promise you, I never once touched the controls but managed to teach her how to instrument fly on very basic instruments such that she (not me) came out the top of said Cu at 9,200 ft (I still have the trace).
By the way, she went on to get the Alex Orde Award from the BGA for getting all three silver legs in one year.
I wonder how many pilots nowadays would be happy with just a turn and slip?
Furthermore; how many pilots nowadays would know how to recover from a spin in cloud using just a turn and slip?
I had to.
The Piston Provost was relatively easy but the Vampire required a great deal of concentration on the turn needle because if you didn't spot (or anticipate the needle coming off the stops) then it was too late and you were going the other way.
Mind you, when the aeroplane is losing 6,500 ft per turn, you don't have a lot of time to bu**er about.
I seem to remember that if you had not got the Vampire out of the spin by 18,000 ft then you got rid of the canopy. If it was still spinning at 10,00 ft then you made a Martin Baker let down.
Last edited by JW411; 20th Jul 2011 at 18:33.
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Seriously, I can only hope that you don't one day find yourself flying along and uttering one of the Airbus pilot phrases e.g.
"what is it doing now?"
"what is it doing now?"
Well, you have just wasted a whole pile of your money.
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That is one big insult!
I submit that the money spent on gadgets might be better invested in training for the full Instrument Rating.
Firstly the JAA IR is not doable under about £15k and that assumes you do it in Spain or Greece. Just the 50hrs at current FTO rates (sim, or SEP) comes to best part of 15k.
Secondly an IR is barely usable in some old heap. The Eurocontrol routings barely work below FL100 (depending on where in Europe you go; France is OK down to FL070) and you do need an autopilot to bring the cockpit workload to a level where the flight is enjoyable and to fly with the consistency and accuracy expected by ATC.
The FAA IR is a lot cheaper - especially if like most who have it you have built time and expertise on the back of IMCR flying, but (a) you still need the hardware and (b) EASA is threatening to require Euro papers on top anyway so this won't save any money. I think a lot of FAA IR holders will throw in the towel in 2014.
Most "gadgets" are essential for IFR, or VFR pushed to the limit on long trips:
IFR GPS (mandatory for IFR anyway)
Autopilot
Accurate fuel totaliser
Multicylinder engine monitor
Slaved HSI
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IO540 - a lot of FAA IR holders will throw in the towel in 2014? dear me, do you mean that American Pilots are going to quit using their instrument ratings in order to conform with EASA? You cannot be serious!
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Looking at the Cirrus chute pulls, most of them were in basically dumb circumstances,...
Most of them saved people who were in difficult circumstances: disorientation, engine oil on the windscreen, pilot incapacitation, avoiding an off-airport landing into terrain or trees, mechanical difficulties. If I encountered similar circumstances, then I would be very happy to have the Cirrus parachute option to save my passengers and me!
The one where he pulled the chute because his aileron fell off was plain dumb because AFAIK the plane was fully flyable.
Cheers
Rick
(Cirrus owner and safety zealot!)
Last edited by sdbeach; 20th Jul 2011 at 21:40.
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The chute pulls have reflected in high insurance premiums.
I know one UK insurer has whacked up the deductible from £3500 to £15000, following one well publicised UK chute pull a year ago.
Cheers
Rick
(Cirrus safety zealot)
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I submit that the money spent on gadgets might be better invested in training for the full Instrument Rating.
) and a 15 year old or so single with a decent enough IFR fit then you would probably have enough money left over for the JAA Instrument rating.
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A relevent article on the "CAPS" system appears in the most recent Transport Canada Aviation Safety Letter, and can be found here:
Pre-Flight - Transport Canada
Pre-Flight - Transport Canada
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A relevent article on the "CAPS" system appears in the most recent Transport Canada Aviation Safety Letter, and can be found here:
Mind you, if the whole plane is engulfed in fire, and by the time a fire crew could possibly arrive, there won't be anybody inside worth salvaging IMHO.
There is a video out there showing an SR20 or 22 crashing into what looks like a car park, and it is a fireball within something like 1 video frame (that's 40 milliseconds max) of a wing making contact with the ground.
it lowers the aircraft to the ground doing just enough damage to make a repair job a good project.
I do wonder what they did with the avionics........................ I bet most of the kit worked just fine, but would you want to fly with it? And scrapping a complete SR22 panel is going to cost of the order of $100k. I know that my TB20 panel, year 2002, at list prices (which nobody in the trade actually pays but an insurance company will 100% most definitely end up paying those, just like any "insurance job"
) would have come to about £120k.I thus think that the avionics probably get, ahem, sent to an avionics repair shop which, ahem, powers them up and, ahem, find them working IAW the MM and, ahem, writes out a Serviceable tag and, ahem, they get put back.
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So if a Cirrus crashes with EFAT, the best advice for the fire and rescue service is to stand well away and watch it burn?
This unfortunate advice may well extend to other types of aircraft, the fire and rescue people are not always going to be sure whether or not the wreckage hoping for their attention is equipped with a significantly dangerous explosive rocket on board, waiting to blast off just as they cut the occupants free....
This unfortunate advice may well extend to other types of aircraft, the fire and rescue people are not always going to be sure whether or not the wreckage hoping for their attention is equipped with a significantly dangerous explosive rocket on board, waiting to blast off just as they cut the occupants free....
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and made history as the first production aircraft to deploy an airframe parachute.
The BRS on my first 3 ultralights (1985/1995) was deployed by black powder. None of this fancy solid rocket fuel they have today.
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Coming back to the subject ofcomplexity and trainings, I seem to remember that after a couple of years of operation the insurance companies refused to cover Malibu owners unless they did a full conversion, and the early Malibu cockpits were all clocks, the aircraft took the pilots into a very unfamiliar environment.
Maybe the insurers will go the same way with the newer glass set ups in Cirrus at al.
VH
Maybe the insurers will go the same way with the newer glass set ups in Cirrus at al.
VH
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Originally Posted by patowalker
Originally Posted by sdbeach
... and made history as the first production aircraft to deploy an airframe parachute.
Better to have said "first certified production airplane with the airframe parachute as standard equipment."
Cheers
Rick
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Originally Posted by IO540
it lowers the aircraft to the ground doing just enough damage to make a repair job a good project.
Cheers
Rick
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Originally Posted by IO540
I do wonder what they did with the avionics...
Cheers
Rick