Ordered a Garmin eTrex Vista HCx for aviation use
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Ordered a Garmin eTrex Vista HCx for aviation use
I finally made a decision on an inexpensive, simple hand-help GPS to take with me to get me out of a possible jam: the Garmin eTrex Vista HCx. For a little handheld, it actually has some nice features. The main reason I chose this model over the other eTrex models is the 25 hour battery life as opposed to an 18 or 14 hour battery life of the other models, and this is 25 hours with a color screen.
Are there any tips or tricks on how to set this unit up a little better for aviation? Is there a way for me to put any kind of sectional chart on it, or anything aviation-related at all?
This unit has a high-sensitivity antenna so I am hoping reception in the cockpit of a high-wing Cessna will be OK...anybody have any experience here? Will I need to hold it near a window the whole time? Sure hope not.
Are there any tips or tricks on how to set this unit up a little better for aviation? Is there a way for me to put any kind of sectional chart on it, or anything aviation-related at all?
This unit has a high-sensitivity antenna so I am hoping reception in the cockpit of a high-wing Cessna will be OK...anybody have any experience here? Will I need to hold it near a window the whole time? Sure hope not.
I've used a very similar eTrex model, mounted to the cockpit, in a 1950s high-wing taildragger. Display was okay, reception was excellent - I can't imagine it being any less good in your Cessna.
If you can, mount it on the panel or yoke - handheld is a pain and will just distract from your flying task.
For flying with any non-aviation GPS, I'd recommend looking at how many waypoints are available to you, and use them for any given flight appropriately. For local flying, use the airport centre or appropriate threshold(s), and the local join/departure points. For longer trips, pre-program your route waypoints. Have these points, which are likely to have short names, marked on your chart (preferably) or kneeboard (if you can't get them on the chart).
I think on this model you have 1000 waypoints and 50 routes, so that's pretty powerful.
No idea about charts, but hopefully somebody else does.
And having done that, sell it on eBay and buy a proper basic aviation GPS for the same money. The Garmin 96 would be the obvious one in the USA, although in the UK probably an AWARE. Buy the right tool for the job and stop mucking about with walking GPSs, it's totally unnecessary.
G
If you can, mount it on the panel or yoke - handheld is a pain and will just distract from your flying task.
For flying with any non-aviation GPS, I'd recommend looking at how many waypoints are available to you, and use them for any given flight appropriately. For local flying, use the airport centre or appropriate threshold(s), and the local join/departure points. For longer trips, pre-program your route waypoints. Have these points, which are likely to have short names, marked on your chart (preferably) or kneeboard (if you can't get them on the chart).
I think on this model you have 1000 waypoints and 50 routes, so that's pretty powerful.
No idea about charts, but hopefully somebody else does.
And having done that, sell it on eBay and buy a proper basic aviation GPS for the same money. The Garmin 96 would be the obvious one in the USA, although in the UK probably an AWARE. Buy the right tool for the job and stop mucking about with walking GPSs, it's totally unnecessary.
G
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I strongly suspect you could have had a full moving map aviation gps system working on a car nav unit, in the USA, for significantly less money.
Care to tell us how much you spent on it?
Care to tell us how much you spent on it?
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Thanks Genghis. I have 1000 waypoints and 50 routes available to me with that unit. I can enter waypoints manually, and it's easy enough to get lat/long data for airports, VOR's, intersections, cities and towns. I can also mark no-go areas with waypoints as a make-shift way of avoidance.
I am not planning on actually "flying" this GPS but rather just having it by my side in case I need it on a cross country. If I rely on it too much, or at all really, during my PPL training, I will be basically cheating the system and thus cheating myself.
It was around $210.
This unit is killing two birds with one stone for me though, currently I do not own a trail/hiking GPS and plan to use it for that as well.
I am not planning on actually "flying" this GPS but rather just having it by my side in case I need it on a cross country. If I rely on it too much, or at all really, during my PPL training, I will be basically cheating the system and thus cheating myself.
It was around $210.
This unit is killing two birds with one stone for me though, currently I do not own a trail/hiking GPS and plan to use it for that as well.
If you're still doing your PPL, turn it on, put it in a pocket well out of your own reach, and leave it alone. After flight, download the track history to see how it compares to your plans - but don't be tempted to use it during training.
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G
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If you're manually entering Lat/Lon, make sure you use something like EasyGPS or GPSBabel to export a GPX file from the unit, then load into Google Earth as kind of visual gross error check. The entry interface is not so good and errors are easy to introduce.
The Etrex unit should have a rose indicator showing ground track and a choice of either course deviation indicator or bearing pointer. Remember to use the CDI for navigation from one point to another along a specific track.
Without the database, it may not have magnetic data so will show True courses. Not a big deal as long as you fully understand what information the unit is providing - Read the Manual!
The Etrex is fine for simple track logging, I used one to check the accuracy of my tracks for both DR navigation and IMC NDB tracking/holds. There's a free site called GoFlying that can take the track logs and convert to 3D profiles in Google Earth.
However, I'd echo the comments above - it's a lot of work programming waypoints when other products are available with a built in database for not a lot more money.
-j34-
The Etrex unit should have a rose indicator showing ground track and a choice of either course deviation indicator or bearing pointer. Remember to use the CDI for navigation from one point to another along a specific track.
Without the database, it may not have magnetic data so will show True courses. Not a big deal as long as you fully understand what information the unit is providing - Read the Manual!
The Etrex is fine for simple track logging, I used one to check the accuracy of my tracks for both DR navigation and IMC NDB tracking/holds. There's a free site called GoFlying that can take the track logs and convert to 3D profiles in Google Earth.
However, I'd echo the comments above - it's a lot of work programming waypoints when other products are available with a built in database for not a lot more money.
-j34-
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It was around $210.
In your earlier thread you were asking about a cheap "get me home in an emergency" GPS solution and I suggested the cheapest eTrex (probably in the $40-$70 range) as something that would work.
But $210 would go a long way towards buying a dedicated aviation GPS such as the Garmin 96C. Which will be infinitely more useful if you start to rely on it (eventually) for post-PPL cross countries.
In any case, as others said, don't go inputting waypoints on the eTrex itself. It's too tedious and too error-prone. Use some sort of computer interface that allows you to input/display them on a map somehow. Personally I use OziExplorer but anything that converts to/from Google Earth would work too.
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SoCal,
This thread is about a specific GPS unit, not about your opinions. I am well aware that it is unwise to rely on a GPS as a student and have already disclaimed this out of the equation to avoid mindless (and endless) opinionated babble (i.e. mental diarrhea) in the replies.
No, GPS did not exist when the majority of today's experiences pilots got their Private ticket. Yes, it does exist today. No, it can't be relied on 100%. Yes, it can be used wisely. A seat belt does not work 100% of the time either, but that doesn't stop you from wearing one just in case, does it?
This thread is about a specific GPS unit, not about your opinions. I am well aware that it is unwise to rely on a GPS as a student and have already disclaimed this out of the equation to avoid mindless (and endless) opinionated babble (i.e. mental diarrhea) in the replies.
No, GPS did not exist when the majority of today's experiences pilots got their Private ticket. Yes, it does exist today. No, it can't be relied on 100%. Yes, it can be used wisely. A seat belt does not work 100% of the time either, but that doesn't stop you from wearing one just in case, does it?
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I have a Vista HCx. I also have a 'proper' aviation GPS.
My only use for the HCx in an aeroplane is for logging my track, which the other GPS doesn't do.
I wouldn't like to try to use it for any form of navigation.
In my experience the battery life is nothing like 25 hours, more like 15-20.
My only use for the HCx in an aeroplane is for logging my track, which the other GPS doesn't do.
I wouldn't like to try to use it for any form of navigation.
In my experience the battery life is nothing like 25 hours, more like 15-20.
Last edited by Alan_D; 19th May 2011 at 19:14.
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Alan_D: I wouldn't like to try to use it for any form of navigation
Why buy a GPS if you're not going to use it for *any* form of navigation?
If the OP is prepared to learn how to use their new GPS properly, then they will be able to navigate safely with it accompanied by a chart with lines drawn on it.
A moving map obviously gives much better situational awareness and would probably have been a better investment, but for following a line on a chart - just about any GPS will do that.
Why buy a GPS if you're not going to use it for *any* form of navigation?
If the OP is prepared to learn how to use their new GPS properly, then they will be able to navigate safely with it accompanied by a chart with lines drawn on it.
A moving map obviously gives much better situational awareness and would probably have been a better investment, but for following a line on a chart - just about any GPS will do that.
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Well as it turns out, I received the unit yesterday and am going to return it. It's just not....anywhere NEAR appropriate for aviation. You guys were right, I have to admit. My apologies for my behavior in this thread at one point (SoCal). It was kind of like I knew ahead of time what many of the responses would be geared towards (not using a GPS as a pupil of aviation). In fact, I think I am going to wait until after I get my PPL to get a full-blown aviation GPS. Thanks for all the solid advice, guys, and once again, my sincere apologies.
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Some of the walking/car units limit the maximum speed and if you fly a reasonably fast aircraft they don't work.
I would suggest looking for something like a Garmin pilot III on ebay. Excellent unit with good battery life on AA's.
You can get a car kit for some of the Garmin aviation units. I tried one and it wasn't very easy to use in a car. Best get a TomTom for the car, you can get one for about the cost of the Garmin car kit.
I would suggest looking for something like a Garmin pilot III on ebay. Excellent unit with good battery life on AA's.
You can get a car kit for some of the Garmin aviation units. I tried one and it wasn't very easy to use in a car. Best get a TomTom for the car, you can get one for about the cost of the Garmin car kit.
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junction34:
Why buy a GPS if you're not going to use it for *any* form of navigation?
Why buy a GPS if you're not going to use it for *any* form of navigation?
I also have a Garmin HCx, which is really a hand-held walker's GPS. The screen is tiny, it doesn't have aviation charts, but can do a direction/distance to a waypoint... if you have any airfields etc in there. It's fiddly to use also.
HOWEVER... the HCx is excellent at recording tracks of where you've been, and for that reason I sometimes carry it in the aeroplane, particularly on IMC flights when it's useful to see how accurate the holds or height-keeping etc were.
I would NOT suggest any of the Garmin eTrex series were purchased primarily for aviation navigation use, hence my previous post.
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The path this thread has followed, reminds me rather clearly of those "what kind of pilot watch/what kind of pilot sunglasses should I buy?" threads. It triggers reactions like:
Which are not at all useful. From my limited understanding of God, he does not need GPS (or watch or sunglasses).
I suppose some of the posters here have the super database laden GPS systems that do away with paper. Yahoo for them. Others of us still use paper [charts]. Any GPS capable of navigating in lat/long mode can be a very useful SUPPLEMENT for paper charts, when understood, and used within it's limitations. Oh, and it can confirm mapping errors in the current database of the Garmin 530 I used to fly with!
The reference to Etrex Vista caught my eye. The one I bought new in 2002, for the large sum at the time of $600 has served me excellently for all these years. It has a better map than the King KLX-135 GPS Comm I installed new in my plane in 1993 (no map, but also still functions perfectly).
I have used the Etrex Vista for a number of cross country flights whose distance exceeded 3000 miles, and always found my way home. I used it last week while test flying a Twin Otter in California. It had no installed GPS (can you imagine in this day and age!?!). Neither of us were familiar with the area, or the bounds of our assigned flight test area, so after buying and marking up a current chart, off we went with the Etrex in hand. We did not really need it....
Yes, the GPS manufacturers will produce all kinds of specialized units, just as watch makers will engrave wings on the face of a watch, and market it to the elitists.
I have lots of gadgets, but many of them are old, and very simple versions of the super gadgets which now seem to distract a few pilots (and drivers and walkers) to the point where their command of directional control and basic navigation is actually imperilled!
So, if you're not impressed with my Etrex Vista (it's not my only GPS), and you're laughing your self silly 'cause I'm defending it, be impressed that like many here, I've been flying since a time when Loran was the next wonder on the horizon (but not far beyond it) and having a gadget tell you where you were to within 5 miles was a magnificent aquisition!
Use what you can afford, and what works for you, take a chart, and never forget how to use it.....
Oh god......
I suppose some of the posters here have the super database laden GPS systems that do away with paper. Yahoo for them. Others of us still use paper [charts]. Any GPS capable of navigating in lat/long mode can be a very useful SUPPLEMENT for paper charts, when understood, and used within it's limitations. Oh, and it can confirm mapping errors in the current database of the Garmin 530 I used to fly with!
The reference to Etrex Vista caught my eye. The one I bought new in 2002, for the large sum at the time of $600 has served me excellently for all these years. It has a better map than the King KLX-135 GPS Comm I installed new in my plane in 1993 (no map, but also still functions perfectly).
I have used the Etrex Vista for a number of cross country flights whose distance exceeded 3000 miles, and always found my way home. I used it last week while test flying a Twin Otter in California. It had no installed GPS (can you imagine in this day and age!?!). Neither of us were familiar with the area, or the bounds of our assigned flight test area, so after buying and marking up a current chart, off we went with the Etrex in hand. We did not really need it....
Yes, the GPS manufacturers will produce all kinds of specialized units, just as watch makers will engrave wings on the face of a watch, and market it to the elitists.
I have lots of gadgets, but many of them are old, and very simple versions of the super gadgets which now seem to distract a few pilots (and drivers and walkers) to the point where their command of directional control and basic navigation is actually imperilled!
So, if you're not impressed with my Etrex Vista (it's not my only GPS), and you're laughing your self silly 'cause I'm defending it, be impressed that like many here, I've been flying since a time when Loran was the next wonder on the horizon (but not far beyond it) and having a gadget tell you where you were to within 5 miles was a magnificent aquisition!
Use what you can afford, and what works for you, take a chart, and never forget how to use it.....
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Let's say (and I am NOT recommending this) a pilot decides to put all his navigational eggs in the GPS basket. He brings a paper chart with him, but hasn't opened in in a while and doesn't stay current / "bookmarked" with it during his GPS-only cross country. He's not totally crazy though, he brings with him a "nice" aviation GPS (his primary), a box or spare batteries, and not one but two very inexpensive but "will get your butt out of a jam" GPS's in addition to a (for example) SP-400 NAV com radio.
In theory, in order for him to be completely, 100% up a brown colored creek with no paddle he would have to have all three GPS units fail, or have the 24 piece satellite constellation fail pretty much all at once, (or have some sci-fi bizarre radiation coming out of nowhere from space that blocks the GPS signal entirely...or something of the like), have his panel mount COM radio fail, AND have his handheld COM radio fail (no vectors from ATC) AND happen to be truly and completely lost when all this happens.
Again I am NOT saying what I exemplify above is anywhere NEAR a "good idea" but at what point does the chance of dying in a car accident on the way to the airport exceed by a few orders of magnitude the chance of the string of events I outline above happening?
Just some food for thought / constructive argument material
Cheers.
In theory, in order for him to be completely, 100% up a brown colored creek with no paddle he would have to have all three GPS units fail, or have the 24 piece satellite constellation fail pretty much all at once, (or have some sci-fi bizarre radiation coming out of nowhere from space that blocks the GPS signal entirely...or something of the like), have his panel mount COM radio fail, AND have his handheld COM radio fail (no vectors from ATC) AND happen to be truly and completely lost when all this happens.
Again I am NOT saying what I exemplify above is anywhere NEAR a "good idea" but at what point does the chance of dying in a car accident on the way to the airport exceed by a few orders of magnitude the chance of the string of events I outline above happening?
Just some food for thought / constructive argument material
Cheers.
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I am a GPS fan but always back it up and cross reference with the chart. They do do some large areas of Gps Jamming covering a few hundreds miles there was a thread on here recently about it.
So if you left the chart in the car then you could have a plane full of GPS units (never have to many back ups ! ) but could lose them all at once
So if you left the chart in the car then you could have a plane full of GPS units (never have to many back ups ! ) but could lose them all at once
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...or wander into the area where GPS jamming trials are being held.
Yes, these are NOTAMed but do pilots like that check NOTAMs?
Relying on just GPS is putting your eggs in one basket. Even if you have multiple receivers.
Yes, these are NOTAMed but do pilots like that check NOTAMs?
Relying on just GPS is putting your eggs in one basket. Even if you have multiple receivers.