Vacancy for tug pilot - unpaid.
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I 'm sure there is plenty of money in the system at Lasham, it's just a case of the people running it taking advantage of others.
If ever the old adage 'If you want to make a small fortune in aviation, you best start with a big one' was true then it must have been in gliding.
There is NO money to be made in gliding.
99% of the work is done by volunteers with only the bigger gliding clubs able to afford a manager and CFI on the pay roll.
Maybe the main reason why gliding clubs want tuggies to be glider pilots is that the latter understand what happens in the gliding scene that they avoid the sort of uninformed chaff that is available in this thread in abundance.
No quite sure that I understand the outcry that people contribute to their training. Is not the whole aviation training model based on self funding? Why would gliding be any different?
172, thanks for trying to get in touch, nothing received so far. Feel free to send me a PM rather than email if that works better.
In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with the original posting.
If I was in the UK this summer with nothing better to do (i.e retired), with 400 gliding hours and 900 tows to date, I would leap at the opportunity.
Flying a tow plane efficiently is immensely rewarding and with six landings or so an hour, it sharpens up your stick and rudder skills, not to mention airmanship and lookout.
There is nothing more satisfying than flying through a thermal on the cross wind leg after takeoff, making an orbit and releasing the glider back into the core at 2000' and then being back on the ground three minutes later.
In some cases, with light-weight single-seaters flown by pilots I know well, I have thermalled up to release height.
If I was in the UK this summer with nothing better to do (i.e retired), with 400 gliding hours and 900 tows to date, I would leap at the opportunity.
Flying a tow plane efficiently is immensely rewarding and with six landings or so an hour, it sharpens up your stick and rudder skills, not to mention airmanship and lookout.
There is nothing more satisfying than flying through a thermal on the cross wind leg after takeoff, making an orbit and releasing the glider back into the core at 2000' and then being back on the ground three minutes later.
In some cases, with light-weight single-seaters flown by pilots I know well, I have thermalled up to release height.
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"If you wanted to build up hours for a CPL I couldn't think of a bigger waste to time, it's hardly the type of flying you are going to need to be proficient at, either during or after professional flight training"
Maybe not Stercus, but it saved me about 15K in hours building when I did my cpl!
I just cant believe people try and knock or poo poo a tuggies job, beats me!
Maybe not Stercus, but it saved me about 15K in hours building when I did my cpl!
I just cant believe people try and knock or poo poo a tuggies job, beats me!
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If you wanted to build up hours for a CPL I couldn't think of a bigger waste to time, it's hardly the type of flying you are going to need to be proficient at, either during or after professional flight training.
I suppose flying around in circles in a 172 for hours on end is the kind of flying you do need to be proficient at during or after professional fight training?
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Will88:
I suppose flying around in circles in a 172 for hours on end is the kind of flying you do need to be proficient at during or after professional fight training?
I suppose flying around in circles in a 172 for hours on end is the kind of flying you do need to be proficient at during or after professional fight training?
Personally, given the option, I would do the job (if paid) for a while, then move onto something more interesting.
Asking guys to work for free in this field is just the same as when flying instructors had to instruct on low or no pay during the early 90's:
Shameful!
Originally Posted by stercus-accidit
If you wanted to build up hours for a CPL I couldn't think of a bigger waste to time, it's hardly the type of flying you are going to need to be proficient at, either during or after professional flight training.
I have found my towing experience to be a big benefit as I work toward the instrument rating. Instrument flying is a lot different. But what I bring to the cockpit with my 700 hours, about 300 of that with a rope on the back, is a sureness in my ability to handle the aircraft.
As I've been working through the challenge of interpreting and cross-checking the instruments, the part of flying the aircraft to put it where it needs to be is easy. Super-easy when it's smooth, well within my abilities when it's ugly and windy. And the landing is always the easiest part, I stopped logging landings a long time ago.
One of my buddies just left his day job, is now flying charters in a recip twin and a turbine single. He started towing with less hours than I did, he racked up a lot of hours in the pawnee/cub, which in turn opened the doors to him at the local museum, and now flying for a living. Most instructors can size you up by the time the wheels leave the ground, the rest of the checkout is to confirm their first impression. You can bet that when my buddy had the check flight with the people he is flying for now, there was no doubt that he could fly the airplane. That is what towing did for him.
But I'm not going to be a professional pilot. Why do I do it? To quote Owen Money, "cos it's FUN."
-- IFMU
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This whole thread shows the ignorance of many people on here.
This practice has been going on for many many years and is very symbiotic. It certainly doesn't take advantage of the pilot who by law cannot be payed unless a CPL is held. Owen Money's post shows what it's all about.
I applied (and was usuccessful) for a season of tugging at Saltby in 1990. I applied, having not quite completed my PPL, so it's not surprising they took someone who already had the qualifications. I was young free and single at the time, and I'd have loved to have done it. I'd hazzard a guess, that if I had, with the 400-600 hours I'd have gained so early on, that I'd have gone on to get a CPL. As it was, being an agricultural student at the time, I went on to get a job on a local farm. I then married and had kids ect (as you do). My flying ambitions never took flight so to speak, and I've had to be content with infrequent and ill afforded flying ever since. I'm in a better position now as I own my own aircraft and can fly a lot more than I used to, but I'm still a long way from my original dream.
Glider tugging, parachute dropping, (and in the past instructing) as a PPL were the ways to build hours quickly for free. It was, and is, a stepping stone to a career. As such it's priceless to a young pilot! Why oh why, in this age, is everything measured by money? And why are any unpaid jobs always considered as exploitation? No wonder there are so many dead enders around who won't get off their ar$es unless they get well over their benefit payments! grrrrrrrrrr,
SS
This practice has been going on for many many years and is very symbiotic. It certainly doesn't take advantage of the pilot who by law cannot be payed unless a CPL is held. Owen Money's post shows what it's all about.
I applied (and was usuccessful) for a season of tugging at Saltby in 1990. I applied, having not quite completed my PPL, so it's not surprising they took someone who already had the qualifications. I was young free and single at the time, and I'd have loved to have done it. I'd hazzard a guess, that if I had, with the 400-600 hours I'd have gained so early on, that I'd have gone on to get a CPL. As it was, being an agricultural student at the time, I went on to get a job on a local farm. I then married and had kids ect (as you do). My flying ambitions never took flight so to speak, and I've had to be content with infrequent and ill afforded flying ever since. I'm in a better position now as I own my own aircraft and can fly a lot more than I used to, but I'm still a long way from my original dream.
Glider tugging, parachute dropping, (and in the past instructing) as a PPL were the ways to build hours quickly for free. It was, and is, a stepping stone to a career. As such it's priceless to a young pilot! Why oh why, in this age, is everything measured by money? And why are any unpaid jobs always considered as exploitation? No wonder there are so many dead enders around who won't get off their ar$es unless they get well over their benefit payments! grrrrrrrrrr,
SS
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Gods alive and streuth blimey mate...whats the world coming to...?
Well said shortstripper.
Wake up and smell the commercial coffee - the world owes you nowt
If potential tuggies who are looking to get a job in aviation bemoan the tug wages/conditions they might be paid then I advise them to let someone else keener and hungrier for a commercial job do the tugging for them.
Well done to those who have the sense of reality to keep hold of that tug job until they need to move on - I'll see you on the flight deck guys.
Wake up and smell the commercial coffee - the world owes you nowt
If potential tuggies who are looking to get a job in aviation bemoan the tug wages/conditions they might be paid then I advise them to let someone else keener and hungrier for a commercial job do the tugging for them.
Well done to those who have the sense of reality to keep hold of that tug job until they need to move on - I'll see you on the flight deck guys.
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So have badger baiting, child molesting and bank robbery - that still doesn't make them right!
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great stuff!
Well I applied for the lasham job, no reply unfortunately. However didn't realise Bidford were looking and have managed to land myself a job there for the summer! Can't wait! Living on an airfield for the whole summer, flying every day weath permitting, bbqs and beer, can't think of anything better than that! Well excited! So dont give up people if you get knocked back eventually there'll be something, whether its for the first jet job or for the first PPL "job" like mine!
here's to a load of good weather this summer!
pheeel
here's to a load of good weather this summer!
pheeel
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So let me get this right, the thought of living in a caravan at a muddy airfield during the usually shocking british summer working from dawn to dusk excites you?
I would rather have electrodes attached to my nipples .
I would rather have electrodes attached to my nipples .
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Bose, im concerned now after reading some of your comments in the 'gay' forum!!
Pheel, you'll have great fun. I did a months ful time stint once and it was all round a good experience. Lots of flying, a beer at the bar every night and outdours in the fresh air every day. Didnt have a care in the world for 4 weeks!
Pheel, you'll have great fun. I did a months ful time stint once and it was all round a good experience. Lots of flying, a beer at the bar every night and outdours in the fresh air every day. Didnt have a care in the world for 4 weeks!
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Well whatever does it for you Bosey 
Bidford's a nice site, friendly people, no sign of mud last time I saw it and I sincerely hope Pheel enjoys it and gets lots of flying. Good luck to him.
Bidford's a nice site, friendly people, no sign of mud last time I saw it and I sincerely hope Pheel enjoys it and gets lots of flying. Good luck to him.
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About
95% of gliding instructors do it for free
95% of winch drivers ditto
95% of ground equipment maintenance ditto
95% of glider airfield maintenance ditto
95% gliding club building maintenance ditto
probably 75% or more of club gliders are maintained by club members and signed off by in-house glider inspectors - for free
and 95% of tug pilots do it without payment either!
Why? Because they enjoy being part of a group effort and part of a community. This particular community likes to fly gliders
This notion that everyone should be paid to do anything beyond scratching their own *rse gets a bit annoying at times.
95% of gliding instructors do it for free
95% of winch drivers ditto
95% of ground equipment maintenance ditto
95% of glider airfield maintenance ditto
95% gliding club building maintenance ditto
probably 75% or more of club gliders are maintained by club members and signed off by in-house glider inspectors - for free
and 95% of tug pilots do it without payment either!
Why? Because they enjoy being part of a group effort and part of a community. This particular community likes to fly gliders
This notion that everyone should be paid to do anything beyond scratching their own *rse gets a bit annoying at times.
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Well said lol. Ive got one of the full time tug posts at Booker this season and I am 100% looking forwards to it. Im hoping that I will get a lot of experience in different situations and meet some interesting people. Then straight onto CPL before Christmas.
niknak
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One should also remember that nearly 100% of the customers pay nearly 100% of the time.
Gliding clubs should take a good look at the way major charities are run, they pay the people who make the organisation tick a decent living and persuade the rest to volunteer.
In gliding terms, that should equate to paying pilots the going rate, someone to run the club properly and then everyone else gives their time for nothing.
It's rather a shame we see these patronising appeals every year for those on the desperate edge of CPl/ATPL wanabees to go and waste their lives at their own considerable cost to fly for nothing, meanwhile, as has been readily admitted, many gliding clubs make a good living.
.
Gliding clubs should take a good look at the way major charities are run, they pay the people who make the organisation tick a decent living and persuade the rest to volunteer.
In gliding terms, that should equate to paying pilots the going rate, someone to run the club properly and then everyone else gives their time for nothing.
It's rather a shame we see these patronising appeals every year for those on the desperate edge of CPl/ATPL wanabees to go and waste their lives at their own considerable cost to fly for nothing, meanwhile, as has been readily admitted, many gliding clubs make a good living.
.
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Well seeing as it is not legally possible to make an income from a PPL, I really dont see what the problem is with giving your free time to get a lot of experience and doing something which you love to do for free for six whole months ??
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Nik
slight error there, most of the "customers" are club members who would be paying a lot more without all the voluntary inputs - to the extent that gliding would be strictly for the rich.
And the "paying" transient customers on courses etc would also be paying a lot more too!
There are no capitalist gliding clubs out there running to make a "good living" for the owners!
slight error there, most of the "customers" are club members who would be paying a lot more without all the voluntary inputs - to the extent that gliding would be strictly for the rich.
And the "paying" transient customers on courses etc would also be paying a lot more too!
There are no capitalist gliding clubs out there running to make a "good living" for the owners!