Economy Seat Survey
 

Hi Everyone,

I added this little survey in another post but thought I'd post it separately too.

The results from here, facebook, and a few other places I've posted it are quite interesting already and suggest I'm barking up the right tree with my seat design.

10 questions only -



Long Haul Economy Survey (long haul = more than 6 hours)



I'll post the results here in a few days. :ok:

So far the most surprising result for me is that ticket prices are only considered a fraction more important than legroom and seat comfort, suggesting that the airline's common line (that passengers are overwhelmingly concerned with ticket price only) is not completely true.

Legroom is pretty well irrelevant to short suckers like me (164cm). If I was 170 or more I'd probably have more of an issue.

I've paid more for economy plus, but have been disappointed with the value for money. Probably wouldn't do it again, unless I saw some real difference.

The issue with ticket price is how much more someone is willing to pay to get what they want. For example, my flight tomorrow, SFO-FRA, is booked on United, not my favorite airline. I'd much rather fly Lufthansa becuase not only are the seats more comfortable, but the service and other amenities are much better. But, in the case of this flight (on leg of a longer journey), the price differential was about $300, more than I want to pay to go LH. If it had been, say, $50, I'd jump at the chance to change. And so price, while important, may or may not be the determining factor, depending on how much more one has to pay to get what they really want versus what they will settle for.

Also, in your survey you have three items that really all related to seat comfort.

I've taken to flying less in recent years and upgrading to Premium Economy (and even Club) so my answers may not have been either typical or even valid!

(e.g.I will use PE for daylight flights and Club for overnight).

The seat comfort-leaning questions are due to my economy seat design, which is currently evolving.

thanks to all who have taken it.

I can't post any pics of the seat design itself, but here is the recline angle that it achieves. This is still a 33 inch seat pitch

http://i39.tinypic.com/1z5ofnd.jpg

Thanks mommus, the image is interesting. If that can be achieved - it would be remarkable. I suspect your problem will be to get everyone to recline at the same time and stay reclined. To do that would mean taking the recline control away. But am happy to wait and see.

I have filled in your survey but I am an atypical customer and my answers will not fit any pattern.

If replies are indicating that price is not the key factor, my guess is that is due to the respondents being (like me) interested in flying. over the last 25 years, pax have made it very clear where price is on their list. just ask MoL!

I'll book first class instead

http://fromtheflightdeck.com/MEL/PPRune/seats-1.jpg

PAXboy - thanks for filling out the survey, as far as I'm concerned atypical customers are just as important to hear from as 'typical' ones.

I would intend to allow every passenger individual control over their own seat. The main concept driving the design is that each person will have their own space that cannot be intruded upon by others and is controllable only by that passenger.

I've found that the responses have remained pretty much the same after I posted links to the survey on aviation-centric websites. The only difference seems to be that when asked for their favorite airline, lots more people used the airline code rather than its name!

Another surprising result to the "would you fly more if seats were more comfortable" question - yes 31.58% no 42.11% (maybe 26.32%)

lomapaseo - thanks for the response. I have already considered the points you illustrate. This was the starting point of my design. The concept as it stands avoids 90% of the issue shown in your picture.

Ignoring the two b*gg*rs who have declined to recline, the proportions on Lompaseo's diagram look pretty accurate.

In which case, frankly, I'm having trouble believing that a seat structure can be made both strong enough to support the average US male leaning back at around 45° while simultaneously being sufficiently low-profile to provide the required clearance at the proposed pitch.

mommus
thanks for the feedback and I hope your project goes well.

I'd suggest the reason is money. Certainly that is the reason I do not travel more. Pure and simple. The cost of flights, hotel, ground transport, etc. If I had more money, I'd take early retirement and travel.

Ah yes, friends and family complain that I use IATA carrier and airport codes in correspondence, emails and SMS! :8

My experience is that non-reclining seats aid comfort because the person in front cannot invade your space, especially when you are trying to eat the meal.

Extra legroom on those seats however only makes life easier if you want to get to the aisle so the ideal compromise is sufficient pitch that a reclined seat in front of you does not impede your enjoyment of the flight.

I think, mommus, that if you could get your survey more widely seen, you would get a better representation of what main stream Pax think, rather than us lot.

For example, I choose primarily by carrier and then often by aircraft type, whereas most folks have zero idea of what a/c they are on and no reason why they should.

At 6'4", seat pitch is important to me. I'm poor, so can't afford to consider E+.

For a while, I almost exclusively crossed the pond with AA while they had their "More Room in Coach" deal, but these days I will pay a little above the lowest price for a trip involving an equipment type, airport or route that I like. UA's Channel 9 was also something I steered myself towards.

I hope your survey yields better accomodation for those of us at the unfashionable end of the bird!!

at 5 ft nothing , I really don't care too much about seat pitch, its width that gets me.

I'm considerably smaller than I used to be ( by about 40 lbs) so I can now quite happily fit my butt in between the arm rests without touching them but there still isn't much in the way of elbow room.
4 across ought to be banned as far as I'm concerned. I would take less pitch in favour of 2 or 3 seats only in a row

The image posted by lomapaseo scares me to death. If the 185 cm guy in the row in front reclines I've got his head in my face. Even if he's my height I lose all ability to work, to read, to eat, to drink.

Kudos to the lCCs whose seats don't recline. Everyone has got their own non-flexible space. You stay out of mine, I stay out of yours.

Short haul and long haul.

I'm all in favour of no or minimal recline in Y class. I have also always felt that seat pitch should be restricted to an absolute minimum of 34' by international legistlation.

EXxb - the image posted by lomapaseo is not a reflection of how my seat design would work. In fact, it illustrates quite well the space and positioning challenges that have had to be overcome.

I cant believe anyone is seriously considering flying long-haul in seats that don't recline at all, even if the cost is someone's head in your chest. Would you really be happy sitting bolt-upright for 12 hours?

Well, no seat is bolt upright. Yes I'd be happier with seats that didn't recline, but with wings in the headrest giving me somewhere to park my head. Give me 'my' space, not a movable space where my only option when someone inconveniences me is to inconvenience the person behind me.

I hate having no control over the person in front, hoping that s/he is considerate to my needs during meal times etc, and these days knowing it's not about me it's about them.

Totally agree ExXB. If there is the foldable headrest I find that much more comfortable than reclining the seat. I prefer window seats when flying, but do find it a pain in the backside to get out to the toilet if the person in front has their seat fully reclined.

N779UAThe AA experiment proved very neatly that lower cost is what works best for the Pax and filling your a/c with the max number of seats was what works best of the carrier.

N779UA welcome aboard. Do use the search function for topics before posting, as there may well be a 'thread' already in place possibly even with answers you seek. Do keep your seat belt fastened at all times as the cabin [aka Forum] can experience unexpected turbulence ... :}]

survey still running if anyone fancies it who hasn't done so already :ok:

Long Haul Economy Survey (long haul = more than 6 hours)

Tax
 

If you use this flight from the UK, what tax do you pay. Short or long haul.

Give me width!
 

I'm short (4' 18") so legroom isn't an issue for me. But I've got wide shoulders, so I end up hanging over the armrests on either side. Or getting an aisle seat and leaning out in the path of meal carts and passengers trying to get to the loo.

I'm afraid that seat width, like pitch, can only be determined by the airlines. My objective is to maximise the passenger comfort within the constraints of current airline seat spacing.

Increasing shoulder width is an issue of how many seats across a carrier crams in.

I've seen a few designs that attempt to increase shoulder width, mainly by staggering adjacent seats, but that has the problem of what you do at the end of each row, or exit rows, since the current aligned design is the most efficient at the ends. With a staggered design you'll lose six to eight seats where economy class is obstructed by a toilet or galley.

You've floated your seat idea over on airliners.net as well.
If you can actually build a practical better mousetrap, good for you and for everyone who flies where most of us fly most of the time when we're paying our own way.
Cost is always a concern when traveling, but so is value.
It's certainly worth some premium to have greater comfort, although how much of a premium will depend upon the length of the flight.
We've bought seats up front for four hour or longer flights where the upgrade cost wasn't too horrible and it makes a world of difference.
It's not always about saving a couple of dollars, or even a couple of hundred.
Good luck with your deign idea.
It does sound promising.

thanks for the support... I've not floated the idea on Airliners.net as you have to pay for membership there.

Plus I'm frightened of becoming a full-blown plane-spotter from exposure to that site.