Dubai - Perth - Safety?
 

Hello all,

Can I ask some expert a question? I'm only a layman :)

I will go on a trip from Dubai to Perth soon. As far as I can see (here: Great Circle Mapper) the route will mostly be over water and far away from land. That means there are no airports within reach? What happens in a case of emergency? Are there any special safety measures for flights over the ocean or flights in such remote areas?

Kind Regards
Kiato

In years gone by piston engined aircraft had unreliable engines, which is part of the reason why long haul aircraft had 4 engines. It was quite usual to see an aircraft with one propellor stopped (not frequent but unremarkable). Rules were crafted to protect people from making errors and one was that if you only had two engines you had stay within 60 minutes of a diversion airfield at single engine speed. That's a gross simplification of history.

Those rules were still in operation when airlines (I think TWA was first) started to think about operating 2 engined jets across the Atlantic. In fact TWA had to stick by those rules for the first flights they made with a 767 across the Atlantic. But everybody recognised that the latest jet engines were much MUCH more reliable than the old piston/propellor engines. After much debate a new set of rules were crafted covering the operation of twin engined jets across oceans. This is ETOPS which Tightslot has already referenced for you.

I can remember being asked to visit TWA on business not long after they had started operating St Louis/London using a 767 and even though I have always enjoyed (and still enjoy) flying when the suggestion of using the route via St Louis was suggested I balked and we went via Chicago on a 747.

Then an acquaintance who was a pilot started flying the 767 on long haul routes. He explained the new ETOPs rules to me and I begun to appreciate that they had been crafted in such a way that it was arguably safer to fly on a twin jet over water than a quad. Surprisingly (it may have changed) he could depart on a flight in a quad knowing his destination airfield was open but that all the possible alternates en route were predicted to be closed. In a twin the alternates had to be available as well as just in existence. And there were other things that had to be on a twin like extra fire protection that didn't have to be on a quad. So, I started to fly on twins as well as quads and now I don't even think about it.

What's interesting is that, slowly, all those little extra requirements that were imposed on twins have slowly made their way on to quads, enhancing and improving the safety of all planes.

So, what happens if an engine stops en route? You divert to somewhere that can fix it. How often does it happen? Rarely; very rarely. What happens if all the engines fail? Well, that's even more rare (although if you've been reading this site you'll know it has happened recently) and, in many cases, crews will restart engines and then you can divert. If they all fail and stay stopped, it doesn't matter whether it's a quad or a twin you glide until you have to land.


Medical emergency? Depends on the nature. Almost all airlines have radio access to a doctor for advice and, if necessary, the aircraft will divert to somewhere with appropriate medical facilities (not always the nearest airport).

And, that's something to remember. When an "emergency" happens on a flight, it's not always appropriate or necessary to divert in a mad dash to the nearest airport. There's little point in landing at an airport where there is no hospital nearby if the emergency is medical. And, even if there is a hospital, it may not have the required facilities so you need to go further to find a hospital to maximise the chances of the patient. And that can be as true over land as over water; the "correct" airfield may not be the nearest.

In the end I always take heart from the fact that the crews on planes are people, just like you and me. They don't board a plane in the expectation of something going wrong. Just like you they want a hazard free journey and they will do everything they can to make sure they (and you) arrive safely. They are, however, trained in how to react should the unexpected happen; trained extremely well.

EK flights to PER on the 777 don't carry Island Reserve fuel. We carry 20mins contingency, the regulatory 30mins Final Reserve, then an alternate (normally Learmonth). The route will normally take us overhead Male then approx 300-500nms west of Cocos Island.

ETOPS diversion time for the 777-300ER is 207mins maximum. ETOPS airports are normally Muscat, Colombo, Jakarta, Learmonth and finally Perth.

Flight time DXB-PER is around 10:45.

Oz

And there is a life vest under your seat with a light and a whistle.

Load Toad, firstly, that might have been a shock, as well as a comfort for the OP! Secondly, it was very funny and I nearly spat tea all over my screen and keyboard. ;)

Load Toad, brilliant. :D

One should always remember to pack a swimming cap. Preferably something with flowers on and in a colour that matches the life vest.

There is no reason not to look smart when bobbing up and down in the middle of the ocean.

And pick a Friday flight as sharks only eat fish on Fridays.

Take plenty of Shark Repellant...travel with your lawyer!

Thread returns from the rough ground alongside the remote taxiway on to which we have strayed ...

Kiato, to be serious about life vests. When you sit down and the CC tell you that there is a life vest under your seat - check that there is. Once in a while, someone has stolen it, or it's fallen out. There is usually a Velcro strap keeping it in place.

Wouldn't the repellent also keep the lawyer away??? :ugh:

Back on topic, please




:)

TightSlot: I hadn't seen that facility with Great Circle mapper to show go/no-go regions for ETOPS. Do you know if the diversion airports shown are only ones that are approved as ETOPS alternates? I can't find this mentioned in the documentation.