What's the Problem at BA Now?
A real problem is that you also lose control over flexibility. You outsource- you have a contract for people to do things - but that never covers emergencies or unknowns - if it does it's often at prohibitive rates.
When you need to react fast you get trapped into discussions with lawyers and contract folk trying to sort out who pays what
When you need to react fast you get trapped into discussions with lawyers and contract folk trying to sort out who pays what
With the Easter holidays, Covid, Brexit, passport control, fuel prices, staff shortages, supply problems, the war in Ukraine etc., one might be able to work out that extra delays are very likely at the moment, but still nice to be given a heads-up.
I think I would rather be warned of potential disruption, even if the actual delays on the day could not be quantified or accurately predicted. I would probably turn up at the airport three hours early instead of 90+ mins early for example.
Regarding outsourcing, I remember Sir John Harvey-Jones in the late 70's or early 80's going around telling companies to buy components in rather than make them in-house. That works up to a point but as has been pointed out, you lose control - if a component is sub standard, you can't walk downstairs onto your factory shop floor and find out what is going on, you have to start a correspondence with the boss of the supply company, who might in turn claim that all is well, or get their legal people to go through the small print of the contract. So things can take weeks or months, rather than days to resolve. The same applies to services such as IT.
Problem is, companies lose sight of the purpose they were formed for. They start off making a high quality component or providing a high quality service, but after a number of years, they start to reduce costs to increase the bosses' pensions and bonuses, and the company changes into making money, rather than making the quality widget or quality service they started out with. Or, they rest on their laurels, without realising that newer companies are providing a much better widget or service at a lower cost.
I think I would rather be warned of potential disruption, even if the actual delays on the day could not be quantified or accurately predicted. I would probably turn up at the airport three hours early instead of 90+ mins early for example.
Regarding outsourcing, I remember Sir John Harvey-Jones in the late 70's or early 80's going around telling companies to buy components in rather than make them in-house. That works up to a point but as has been pointed out, you lose control - if a component is sub standard, you can't walk downstairs onto your factory shop floor and find out what is going on, you have to start a correspondence with the boss of the supply company, who might in turn claim that all is well, or get their legal people to go through the small print of the contract. So things can take weeks or months, rather than days to resolve. The same applies to services such as IT.
Problem is, companies lose sight of the purpose they were formed for. They start off making a high quality component or providing a high quality service, but after a number of years, they start to reduce costs to increase the bosses' pensions and bonuses, and the company changes into making money, rather than making the quality widget or quality service they started out with. Or, they rest on their laurels, without realising that newer companies are providing a much better widget or service at a lower cost.
In BA’s case, they always seem to be more focussed on the process rather than the end result. A minor example of this is the pilots rostering and scheduling as is. Daily begging texts for pilots to volunteer at short notice could be avoided if they allow pilots to pick trips up electronically. While the eMaestro system is slowly being reinstated, the rostering system is still assigning TASS days on the last days of the month on pilots rosters meaning that any overtime will be reduced by the amount of TASS, making it hardly worth it. Incidentally, the pilot overtime rate in BA is 1.25 x Normal rate . Knock off 50% for tax, and most guys and girls will rather sit at home .
Talking to the engineers and terminal staff, there is a lack of motivation to help the company out, even at double time being offered. Chickens and roosts come to mind.
Talking to the engineers and terminal staff, there is a lack of motivation to help the company out, even at double time being offered. Chickens and roosts come to mind.
I'm currently awaiting a response to a message sent to the Chairman's Office two weeks ago, after it took two weeks for the Executive Club to decide that my concerns were not theirs....
Jack
Jack
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I started to lose faith in BA's system five years ago when they failed to book/pay for a JAL connection in a return ticket bought long in advance. Then took 18 months to respond to the complaint and refund the extra charge. The recent logistical crises are massively exacerbated by IT incapacity and I'm simply no longer booking BA long haul, for the sake of:
1. being able to check in and
2. finding a plane and a crew there when I do.
1. being able to check in and
2. finding a plane and a crew there when I do.
The last four return short haul flights I have taken with BA have seen three sectors cancelled prior to departure, and three delays of 1 - 3 hours.
This is in addition to the inability to check in on line, the queues to check in at Heathrow, and the queues at immigration in Europe as the EU get even for Brexit, which cumulatively add over two hours to any short haul journey.
And sky high prices.
Which is why I am staying at home this Easter.
This is in addition to the inability to check in on line, the queues to check in at Heathrow, and the queues at immigration in Europe as the EU get even for Brexit, which cumulatively add over two hours to any short haul journey.
And sky high prices.
Which is why I am staying at home this Easter.
Paxing All Over The World
I am getting emails direct from BA several times a week telling me of all the offers. The kids in marketing still justifying their existence or perhaps they have been told to counteract all the bad publicity with low prices.
With the Easter holidays, Covid, Brexit, passport control, fuel prices, staff shortages, supply problems, the war in Ukraine etc., one might be able to work out that extra delays are very likely at the moment, but still nice to be given a heads-up.
I think I would rather be warned of potential disruption, even if the actual delays on the day could not be quantified or accurately predicted. I would probably turn up at the airport three hours early instead of 90+ mins early for example.
Regarding outsourcing, I remember Sir John Harvey-Jones in the late 70's or early 80's going around telling companies to buy components in rather than make them in-house. That works up to a point but as has been pointed out, you lose control - if a component is sub standard, you can't walk downstairs onto your factory shop floor and find out what is going on, you have to start a correspondence with the boss of the supply company, who might in turn claim that all is well, or get their legal people to go through the small print of the contract. So things can take weeks or months, rather than days to resolve. The same applies to services such as IT.
Problem is, companies lose sight of the purpose they were formed for. They start off making a high quality component or providing a high quality service, but after a number of years, they start to reduce costs to increase the bosses' pensions and bonuses, and the company changes into making money, rather than making the quality widget or quality service they started out with. Or, they rest on their laurels, without realising that newer companies are providing a much better widget or service at a lower cost.
I think I would rather be warned of potential disruption, even if the actual delays on the day could not be quantified or accurately predicted. I would probably turn up at the airport three hours early instead of 90+ mins early for example.
Regarding outsourcing, I remember Sir John Harvey-Jones in the late 70's or early 80's going around telling companies to buy components in rather than make them in-house. That works up to a point but as has been pointed out, you lose control - if a component is sub standard, you can't walk downstairs onto your factory shop floor and find out what is going on, you have to start a correspondence with the boss of the supply company, who might in turn claim that all is well, or get their legal people to go through the small print of the contract. So things can take weeks or months, rather than days to resolve. The same applies to services such as IT.
Problem is, companies lose sight of the purpose they were formed for. They start off making a high quality component or providing a high quality service, but after a number of years, they start to reduce costs to increase the bosses' pensions and bonuses, and the company changes into making money, rather than making the quality widget or quality service they started out with. Or, they rest on their laurels, without realising that newer companies are providing a much better widget or service at a lower cost.
"nd the queues at immigration in Europe as the EU get even for Brexit,"
It was pointed out throughout the Brexit negotiations that this would happen - the British Govt denied it , as they denied so many things that have come to pass
It was pointed out throughout the Brexit negotiations that this would happen - the British Govt denied it , as they denied so many things that have come to pass
At all of the major European airports with which I’m familiar, there have been two queues for immigration purposes for many years; EU and non-EU. Anyone who thought that UK passport holders would continue to be able to use the EU queue after Brexit is, quite frankly, a moron.
Last edited by Doug E Style; 6th Apr 2022 at 17:30.
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I don't think that it is a problem with just BA but it appears to be a post-Brexit, post-privatisation thing in the UK. I was recently quoted over £800 for two returns on the train from my home in Cheshire to London Euston. I decided to fly myself to Elstree for half the price and in half the time.
Anyone who thought that UK passport holders would continue to be able to use the EU queue after Brexit is, quite frankly, a moron.
As a postscript to my first post in this thread, T5 on Monday last was crowded but operating well. One or two cancellations on the board, but no sign of the disruption BA warned might occur. I could observe this for 5 hours having got there early! There were plenty of security staff, don't know about handling.
My original thoughts of the uselessness of a warning on the website of "potential disruption" still stand. If the warning has any purpose other than later claiming they warned people so cannot be held responsible if passengers turned up to be told of disruption, it should provide facts and information to allow readers to make an informed assessment of the risk.
On the flight itself, I'm not sure of a bottle of water and small bag of crisps really substitutes for catering. Why bother?
But no worse than a loco. I did have a look at fare prices 4 hours before departure and they were breathtakingly high, eg GBP600 for basic economy, 1-way, for a 2-hour flight.
My original thoughts of the uselessness of a warning on the website of "potential disruption" still stand. If the warning has any purpose other than later claiming they warned people so cannot be held responsible if passengers turned up to be told of disruption, it should provide facts and information to allow readers to make an informed assessment of the risk.
On the flight itself, I'm not sure of a bottle of water and small bag of crisps really substitutes for catering. Why bother?
But no worse than a loco. I did have a look at fare prices 4 hours before departure and they were breathtakingly high, eg GBP600 for basic economy, 1-way, for a 2-hour flight.
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PPRuNe Handmaiden
I flew BA to Lisbon on the first weekend of the UK school holidays in April. (Not my choice, it was for work). The airport was very busy but seemed to be moving ok. (I am fortunate to be able to use the First Class check in and screening at T5 - so I have no idea how security was coping).
I loved the upgrade but I wished my bag could have joined me. It took BA 2 days to get it to me.
I suspect the ramp services are really feeling the pinch as who wants to work in all weathers for not brilliant money? BA and other UK airlines are really struggling to (re)hire ground staff after the pandemic.
I loved the upgrade but I wished my bag could have joined me. It took BA 2 days to get it to me.
I suspect the ramp services are really feeling the pinch as who wants to work in all weathers for not brilliant money? BA and other UK airlines are really struggling to (re)hire ground staff after the pandemic.
