Security Inconsistencies
CH3CH2OH
Thread Starter
Security Inconsistencies
Not a new topic I know, surely inside one country the standards should be the same.
I had the misfortune to transit through Manchester today, I have never seen so many rejected bags at the scanners in any airport worldwide. One of the biggest elements contributing seemed to be the non removal of smaller Kindle sized devices triggering a rejection, not something that seems to bother any other airport I have been in over the last 12 months. There were many bewildered people who didn’t understand what they had done wrong.
The airport itself isn’t a shining example of progress and good design, use of space, not something that can be fixed quickly or without considerable investment, may be better to start again elsewhere and just bulldoze that one..
I had the misfortune to transit through Manchester today, I have never seen so many rejected bags at the scanners in any airport worldwide. One of the biggest elements contributing seemed to be the non removal of smaller Kindle sized devices triggering a rejection, not something that seems to bother any other airport I have been in over the last 12 months. There were many bewildered people who didn’t understand what they had done wrong.
The airport itself isn’t a shining example of progress and good design, use of space, not something that can be fixed quickly or without considerable investment, may be better to start again elsewhere and just bulldoze that one..
Paxing All Over The World
The request,: Please remove laptops, means all computing devices. A tablet or E reader (Kindle) is a computer and will cause a bag to be selected for hand search.
It may be that the request has to be more detailed
It may be that the request has to be more detailed
The problem is a total lack of consistency worldwide; you can't complain about SLF not knowing the rules and therefore not being prepared when the rules change from airport to airport, country to country, and even time to time. In the case of the latter, for example, the last time my wife and kids travelled through LAX they had everything ready and out - only to be told to put everything back in their bags, put their tops and belts back on and just walk through the scanner even when it beeped as it was "Happy Hour"!
It's a pain in the aris...some places ask me to remove my belt, others my shoes and some both (BKK). Some don't ask me to remove either. Some swab the computer for residues, some don't, some ask me to switch the computer on, some just ask to put the 'puter through the x-ray by itself...some want all liquids in a clear bag, some will accept say a gel rather than a liquid, some places when you go through the security at the gate itself reject toothpaste for example that goes through the earlier check okay or you actually bought in the airport (airside).
So when SLF turn up at an unfamiliar security it's no surprise so many mistakes are made leading to frustration and delay - as I've had at several airports. We know security is important but some consistency would help.
...
So when SLF turn up at an unfamiliar security it's no surprise so many mistakes are made leading to frustration and delay - as I've had at several airports. We know security is important but some consistency would help.
...
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: #N/A
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Unfortunately inconsistencies are the nature of the game; requirements differ between countries, and within countries airports have different equipment (tech and policy evolves faster than the lifecycle of these expensive machines).
For real frustration try the BA flight out of NBO - when I last did it there were 4 security screening checks for SLF; screening at entry to building, screening to airside, screening at gate (airport), screening at gate (BA).
Or Kota Kinabalu, where they inexplicably mix screened departing pax with arrival pax and then have to rescreen everyone before they go down to gate
For real frustration try the BA flight out of NBO - when I last did it there were 4 security screening checks for SLF; screening at entry to building, screening to airside, screening at gate (airport), screening at gate (BA).
Or Kota Kinabalu, where they inexplicably mix screened departing pax with arrival pax and then have to rescreen everyone before they go down to gate
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: en route
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
'For real frustration', try having your flight blown out of the sky.
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: #N/A
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are eight or nine active, capable, and determined insurgent/jihadi groups operating within the Nairobi route matrix in Africa alone. Since BA cut their African routes to the bone NBO is a popular transit hub from African countries to the UK.
'For real frustration', try having your flight blown out of the sky.
'For real frustration', try having your flight blown out of the sky.
There is nowadays a vast self-justified security "policy" industry, let alone the actual measures, with policy advisers, policy managers, you name it. Inevitably, working separately, they all come up with different standards, different manuals, different training, etc.
It was a London - Dublin day return a few years ago where on the two legs I got "leave your laptop in its bag, don't hold everyone behind you up taking it out by fiddling to take it out" and "take your laptop out of its bag, can't stay in there, don't hold everyone behind you up by leaving it in there". Can't remember which way round the two contradictory policies were.
It was a London - Dublin day return a few years ago where on the two legs I got "leave your laptop in its bag, don't hold everyone behind you up taking it out by fiddling to take it out" and "take your laptop out of its bag, can't stay in there, don't hold everyone behind you up by leaving it in there". Can't remember which way round the two contradictory policies were.
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: world
Posts: 3,424
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From my experience standards can be inconsistent at the same airport in the same country. My biggest commute is between Düsseldorf and Birmingham. I travel with the same bag, same minimal contents and the same equipment (which includes a camera and a rather large lens) on every flight. Requirements as to whether that lens should be separated from the bag have never been consistent either at BHX or DUS. I always ask. One time it's yes and another it's no, not necessary. Basically it comes down to the whim of the security person on the day.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: en route
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry for stating the obvious, gents, but security isn't there for the convenience of passengers. If that was the primary objective, there wouldn't be any security at all, you'd just breeze straight through from taxi to plane and be on your way. The different standards from airport to airport, day to day, line to line is surely because there is no common standard. But that has the effect of making it very hard to plan an attack, which is the real point of security. No one thinks that any individual security officer will stop an individual attack, but the chaotic and unpredictable totality of the process makes if very hard to plan an attack with any degree of certainty.
As noted, this is a statement of the obvious, and I'm sure everyone gets it. And I know there's a huge global industry that depends on keeping everyone nervous. I guess my own feeling (as a 3 x a month long haul pax to lots of strange places) is that if we want to get home in one piece, we just have to smile more and grumble less, and accept that this is the time we live in.
As noted, this is a statement of the obvious, and I'm sure everyone gets it. And I know there's a huge global industry that depends on keeping everyone nervous. I guess my own feeling (as a 3 x a month long haul pax to lots of strange places) is that if we want to get home in one piece, we just have to smile more and grumble less, and accept that this is the time we live in.
Security at MAN is a pain. Ms RM2's MacBook Air went through the scanner, FOUR TIMES, naturally always ending up at the back of the queue of rejects from passengers processed later. (If you suggest process improvements i.e. re-scans could perhaps be prioritised, you get a bollocking that draws blood...) The first 2 times because "the barcode on the tray doesn't work" (and it would have gone through in the same tray a THIRD time had I not pointed out Einstein's words on insanity). On the 3rd attempt, someone came up with the idea that "it's too light" and bunged something weighted in for the (successful) 4th attempt.
Mad....
Mad....
UK Airports for the last couple of years the instruction has always to take out all laptops, Ipads etc and Kindles. I can't think on one it hasn't been the practice (probably 15 or 16 airports, from Shetland to Heathrow)
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: mids
Age: 58
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If it was up to the security types the requirements would change on a random requirements/rotation some days strict as hell other days next to nothing.
The whole point is they don't want any rules or procedures to be predictable or known.
The UK is a bit special anyway because it instigates tighter requirements than required. Airports have to show compliance with the minimum standard, there is nothing stopping them going further than the minimum requirement.
Manchester is a pain in the bum, huge security empire and it seems to be pretty much untouchable. There is huge gapping holes in what they do and a lot of things rely on people following the rules (how many people up to no good follow the rules?)
BTW the EU base rule is anything with a larger screen than 6" needs to be separate. But there is nothing wrong or illegal for an airport to insist that all devices need to be separated or for that matter everyone is required to take their shoes and belts off.
The grunts on ground are videoed and if they don't enforce the local rules they get the sack. So I do actually have some sympathy with them. There are of course nasty individuals with huge chips on their shoulders which cause major grief enforcing said rules. And there are nice people doing a job and make the process as painless as possible and a full range in between which may float between the extremes. Just like the people they are dealing with.
the only thing you can do is avoid the place if you can. I do know pilots that have changed jobs just to get away from MAN. Dealing with an engine failure was less stress than getting from the car to the aircraft.
The whole point is they don't want any rules or procedures to be predictable or known.
The UK is a bit special anyway because it instigates tighter requirements than required. Airports have to show compliance with the minimum standard, there is nothing stopping them going further than the minimum requirement.
Manchester is a pain in the bum, huge security empire and it seems to be pretty much untouchable. There is huge gapping holes in what they do and a lot of things rely on people following the rules (how many people up to no good follow the rules?)
BTW the EU base rule is anything with a larger screen than 6" needs to be separate. But there is nothing wrong or illegal for an airport to insist that all devices need to be separated or for that matter everyone is required to take their shoes and belts off.
The grunts on ground are videoed and if they don't enforce the local rules they get the sack. So I do actually have some sympathy with them. There are of course nasty individuals with huge chips on their shoulders which cause major grief enforcing said rules. And there are nice people doing a job and make the process as painless as possible and a full range in between which may float between the extremes. Just like the people they are dealing with.
the only thing you can do is avoid the place if you can. I do know pilots that have changed jobs just to get away from MAN. Dealing with an engine failure was less stress than getting from the car to the aircraft.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 61
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Travel regularly? Expect it.
Surely it is easier to expect shoes/ belt/ watch/ other jewellery off without waiting to be asked and just do it in or porior to joining the queue as a matter of course? Same goes for jackets, coats electronic gadgets and fluids. I can understand first time or very infrequent travellers being confused, but so many people grumbling here are clearly not in that bracket!
Surely it is easier to expect shoes/ belt/ watch/ other jewellery off without waiting to be asked and just do it in or porior to joining the queue as a matter of course? Same goes for jackets, coats electronic gadgets and fluids. I can understand first time or very infrequent travellers being confused, but so many people grumbling here are clearly not in that bracket!
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Inconsistencies, whilst aggravating for us, actually provide for better security as you never know what is going to be checked.
Security could check everything every time and cause massive delays which we would like to avoid. By being a bit random between lanes in the same airport let alone between airports and countries means you never know what will be checked.
Unfortunately the days of enjoyable air travel are long gone and the terrorist have achieved their goal of causing disruption.
Security could check everything every time and cause massive delays which we would like to avoid. By being a bit random between lanes in the same airport let alone between airports and countries means you never know what will be checked.
Unfortunately the days of enjoyable air travel are long gone and the terrorist have achieved their goal of causing disruption.
Inconsistencies, whilst aggravating for us, actually provide for better security as you never know what is going to be checked.
Except for when you get shouted at for taking shoes and belts off as it causes congestion at the other side of the scanner.
About the one consistency found pretty much everywhere is 7 sets of checkpoint equipment installed, but only 3 staffed. And when this finally causes much criticism, the answer is commonly - to install more equipment. Because on the airport agreeing the budget for it the equipment salesman got there first.
Paxing All Over The World
Well said WHBM. It is always the staffing. If they paid for more staff, then the staff would not be pressured. But we all know the meaning of the word 'efficiency' ...
go from lands end to the scilly isles st marys - fab no security and a twotter flight over the islands