BA response time to complaint?
Paxing All Over The World
- It's standard policy for LCCs to ignore complaints, it's obviously part of their budget policy.
- No LCC will allow itself to be taken to court for something it will lose, the floodgates WILL be kept closed.
- Simples!
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thanks for that advice, have passed it on to herself. You know, I'd forgotten about her asking for her money back from BA for the unused segments. Doh!!!
thanks for that advice, have passed it on to herself. You know, I'd forgotten about her asking for her money back from BA for the unused segments. Doh!!!
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Help!
Some close family friends of mine are currently stuck on a remote island in the bahamas due to Hurricane Irene. As a result they do not have any communications to the outside world, but luckily they got word back that they are safe. BA wont let us rebook any flights and wont put him on any flights for at least 10 days because he missed his original flight (because his local flight wasnt able to fly)... I was wandering if the person who sent the letter to the CEO had a postal address, as I can only find his email... Thanks in advance :/
Some close family friends of mine are currently stuck on a remote island in the bahamas due to Hurricane Irene. As a result they do not have any communications to the outside world, but luckily they got word back that they are safe. BA wont let us rebook any flights and wont put him on any flights for at least 10 days because he missed his original flight (because his local flight wasnt able to fly)... I was wandering if the person who sent the letter to the CEO had a postal address, as I can only find his email... Thanks in advance :/
Paxing All Over The World
Hi JacobRowe and welcome aboard.
The problem is that your friend has been given the right information, according to long established small print. When a flight is canx due to weather or other events the process is this:
The next flight that can operate, will carry all of it's DUE BOOKED pax. THEN they will load as many extras from the canx flight/s. This will continue until all the folks that missed their flight are carried.
The reason is that:
If you take 100% of pax from flight 1 and 2 that did not operate, and put them on to flights 3 and 4, you have upset double the number of pax and caused double the amount of problems for everyone. Then you have to consider if you move 1/2 to 3/4, then you moved all those of 3 and 4 and put them on 5 and 6???
It is far better to keep to the original schedule and then get those other pax away by whatever means possible, including on other carriers etc. On mainland, there are other options of other airports and trains, coaches and hire cars. But an island has a very particular problem ...
I was in NYC when the large scale power cut brought the NE seaboard to a halt in August 2003. My flight was due to leave the next morning and I was already at JFK. That was Thursday night and my Friday flight did not operate. The earliest that BA could get me out was Monday from EWR. I then claimed on my insurance.
Since all the Carribbean islands are used to hurricanes, they have a well established process to get people off (and back on) their island. Sorry, but that is how it's going to be. No, I do not work for a carrier and you will probably find someone who does stops by this thread shortly.
Your friend can plead special circumstances with the carrier but so will every other pax!. Now, at the risk of sounding harsh, they are still alive and will be able to travel home. Yes, it is a pain and yes it may cost them money but - they are alive.
I just checked the BBC, here are the islans that they mention as having received damage of one kind or another.
Sorry, but they will all want to get home or get back home. Unfortunately, on the US mainland, it is reported that 13 people have died.
The problem is that your friend has been given the right information, according to long established small print. When a flight is canx due to weather or other events the process is this:
The next flight that can operate, will carry all of it's DUE BOOKED pax. THEN they will load as many extras from the canx flight/s. This will continue until all the folks that missed their flight are carried.
The reason is that:
If you take 100% of pax from flight 1 and 2 that did not operate, and put them on to flights 3 and 4, you have upset double the number of pax and caused double the amount of problems for everyone. Then you have to consider if you move 1/2 to 3/4, then you moved all those of 3 and 4 and put them on 5 and 6???
It is far better to keep to the original schedule and then get those other pax away by whatever means possible, including on other carriers etc. On mainland, there are other options of other airports and trains, coaches and hire cars. But an island has a very particular problem ...
I was in NYC when the large scale power cut brought the NE seaboard to a halt in August 2003. My flight was due to leave the next morning and I was already at JFK. That was Thursday night and my Friday flight did not operate. The earliest that BA could get me out was Monday from EWR. I then claimed on my insurance.
Since all the Carribbean islands are used to hurricanes, they have a well established process to get people off (and back on) their island. Sorry, but that is how it's going to be. No, I do not work for a carrier and you will probably find someone who does stops by this thread shortly.
Your friend can plead special circumstances with the carrier but so will every other pax!. Now, at the risk of sounding harsh, they are still alive and will be able to travel home. Yes, it is a pain and yes it may cost them money but - they are alive.
I just checked the BBC, here are the islans that they mention as having received damage of one kind or another.
- Bahamas
- Acklins and Crooked Islands
- Puerto Rico
- Dominican Republic
- The Turks and Caicos
- Mayaguana
- Cat Island
- Long Island
- Eleuthera
Sorry, but they will all want to get home or get back home. Unfortunately, on the US mainland, it is reported that 13 people have died.
Last edited by PAXboy; 29th Aug 2011 at 01:36. Reason: Post Script
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In response to the question asked, the address I used was
Mr Keith Williams
CEO British Airways
Waterside
PO Box 365
Harmondsworth
UB7 0GB
I lifted that address from the BA website so don't know whether it is the ideal address or not, but it seemed to work. I hope that the original flight booked off the island was BA linked or the "No show" fine print could be invoked for the return flight
Incidentally a week has now gone by since the Much Beloved sent details of her expenses etc to BA as they requested. There has been no further reaction.
Mr Keith Williams
CEO British Airways
Waterside
PO Box 365
Harmondsworth
UB7 0GB
I lifted that address from the BA website so don't know whether it is the ideal address or not, but it seemed to work. I hope that the original flight booked off the island was BA linked or the "No show" fine print could be invoked for the return flight
Incidentally a week has now gone by since the Much Beloved sent details of her expenses etc to BA as they requested. There has been no further reaction.
Paxing All Over The World
BBC News - Irene: Thousands of British travellers stranded in US
Extracts from the article:
And that's just the mainland, where they can more easily move people. Death toll now at 40.
Extracts from the article:
Airlines are beginning to resume normal services but passengers face delays as UK-bound flights are already full.
British Airways and Virgin Atlantic are putting on extra flights but BA warned delays would take "a few days" to resolve.
Some 9,000 planes were grounded by the storm, with New York among the cities which closed its airports.
British Airways and Virgin Atlantic are putting on extra flights but BA warned delays would take "a few days" to resolve.
Some 9,000 planes were grounded by the storm, with New York among the cities which closed its airports.
British Airways said it had two days' worth of flights to catch up on and had sent three extra planes to serve Newark and JFK airports in New York.
"It's the peak time of year for travel. People are coming back from summer holidays to start school, so flights are full anyway."
Other eastern cities such as Boston and Baltimore were also affected. It is unclear how many British passengers are stranded but the Association of British Travel Agents (Abta) said as many as 10,000 British holidaymakers could currently be in New York.
"It's the peak time of year for travel. People are coming back from summer holidays to start school, so flights are full anyway."
Other eastern cities such as Boston and Baltimore were also affected. It is unclear how many British passengers are stranded but the Association of British Travel Agents (Abta) said as many as 10,000 British holidaymakers could currently be in New York.
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Must be something in the water at Gibraltar.
Got wrongly charged for baggage on return from there the other day. 1 call to customer relations at BA on return - number is on the website, they opened a case file and about 5 minutes later was informed a cheque would be in the post today. Couldnt have been simpler (or better handled)
Got wrongly charged for baggage on return from there the other day. 1 call to customer relations at BA on return - number is on the website, they opened a case file and about 5 minutes later was informed a cheque would be in the post today. Couldnt have been simpler (or better handled)
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Well guys
the Much Beloved received a verbal offer from BA this afternoon.
A refund of the Easyjet ticket, plus £50 "contribution" for petrol for me having to do a round trip of 270 miles to Glasgow to pick her up, plus a £250 discount voucher off her next flight with BA!!!
Note that there was no mention of her Eu400 statutory entitlement for denied boarding under EU261/2004.
BA regard her having missed her last train home as a "consequential loss" equivalent to their flight having been late and therefore deny responsibility!!!!
We have told BA to think again and have threatened solicitor, publicity in the press and the internet etc unless MB gets the Eu 400 plus my £121 cost of 270 miles at 45p/mile.
The BA rep said that he would "consult his boss"
Frankly I never thought that BA would make such a blatant attempt to evade their responsibility.
the Much Beloved received a verbal offer from BA this afternoon.
A refund of the Easyjet ticket, plus £50 "contribution" for petrol for me having to do a round trip of 270 miles to Glasgow to pick her up, plus a £250 discount voucher off her next flight with BA!!!
Note that there was no mention of her Eu400 statutory entitlement for denied boarding under EU261/2004.
BA regard her having missed her last train home as a "consequential loss" equivalent to their flight having been late and therefore deny responsibility!!!!
We have told BA to think again and have threatened solicitor, publicity in the press and the internet etc unless MB gets the Eu 400 plus my £121 cost of 270 miles at 45p/mile.
The BA rep said that he would "consult his boss"
Frankly I never thought that BA would make such a blatant attempt to evade their responsibility.
Last edited by astir 8; 1st Sep 2011 at 16:11.
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Further to my last post, reply from BA that "denied boarding" only applies to an overbooking situation!!!
They are refusing to amend their offer.
Have told them to send the Easyjet fare but it's not stopping there.
They are refusing to amend their offer.
Have told them to send the Easyjet fare but it's not stopping there.
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Astir,
Beware, accepting anything offered may be construed by a court as a full and final settlement. There is quite a lot of legal precedents on this, so if you think the end game is court, be careful.
Beware, accepting anything offered may be construed by a court as a full and final settlement. There is quite a lot of legal precedents on this, so if you think the end game is court, be careful.
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(j) "denied boarding" means a refusal to carry passengers on a flight, although they have presented themselves for boarding under the conditions laid down in Article 3(2), except where there are reasonable grounds to deny them boarding, such as reasons of health, safety or security, or inadequate travel documentation;
2. Paragraph 1 shall apply on the condition that passengers:
(a) have a confirmed reservation on the flight concerned and, except in the case of cancellation referred to in Article 5, present themselves for check-in,
- as stipulated and at the time indicated in advance and in writing (including by electronic means) by the air carrier, the tour operator or an authorised travel agent,
or, if no time is indicated,
- not later than 45 minutes before the published departure time; or
(b) have been transferred by an air carrier or tour operator from the flight for which they held a reservation to another flight, irrespective of the reason.
(a) have a confirmed reservation on the flight concerned and, except in the case of cancellation referred to in Article 5, present themselves for check-in,
- as stipulated and at the time indicated in advance and in writing (including by electronic means) by the air carrier, the tour operator or an authorised travel agent,
or, if no time is indicated,
- not later than 45 minutes before the published departure time; or
(b) have been transferred by an air carrier or tour operator from the flight for which they held a reservation to another flight, irrespective of the reason.
BA screwed up royally on this one. They should simply cut the BS and pay up as required by the regulation.
Paxing All Over The World
astir 8
It's a numbers game.
I never thought that BA would make such a blatant attempt to evade their responsibility.
- Calculate how many pax per year are denied boarding due to failure by the company (all reasons, downsizing/mistake/etc.)
- Calculate the average full legal cost of reimbursment/compensation (they will have detailed figures for every route every day)
- Calculate how many pax accept the first or second offer and then go away. (they will know!)
- Calculate the difference.
- Programme your staff accordingly!
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BA certainly "screwed up royally" and should just pay out without further ado. But if they want to be difficult, they may be able to justify wriggling out of the regulation quoted by ExXB:
BA could argue that the passenger did not in fact have a confirmed reservation on the flight, so could not be "denied boarding" within the meaning of the regulation. Now the reason the passenger did not have a confirmed reservation is that some fool at BA had cancelled it by mistake. But that doesn't change the fact that at the time boarding was denied, a reservation did not exist.
2. Paragraph 1 shall apply on the condition that passengers:
(a) have a confirmed reservation on the flight concerned and, except in the case of cancellation referred to in Article 5, present themselves for check-in,
(a) have a confirmed reservation on the flight concerned and, except in the case of cancellation referred to in Article 5, present themselves for check-in,
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Thanks for all the advice guys. We have withdrawn the request for the Easyjet fare refund and have received an email from BA confirming this.
Concerning the BA offer they state "I am sorry to hear that you do not want to accept the cheque and voucher we offered you. We realised that we had let you down and wanted to pass our apologies to you, together with a gesture of goodwill"
That's a new definition of goodwill in my book!
We'll stick to a full refund of all costs plus 400 Euros for "denied boarding" on the basis of breach of contract resulting from twofold errors by BA (getting the "no show" wrong in Glasgow and then refusal by BA representatives in Gibraltar to verify the facts of the case before denying boarding.
We will continue to make an infernal nuisance of ourselves (letters to CEO, CAA, press etc) and will use small claims court if it goes that far.
cheers again guys
Concerning the BA offer they state "I am sorry to hear that you do not want to accept the cheque and voucher we offered you. We realised that we had let you down and wanted to pass our apologies to you, together with a gesture of goodwill"
That's a new definition of goodwill in my book!
We'll stick to a full refund of all costs plus 400 Euros for "denied boarding" on the basis of breach of contract resulting from twofold errors by BA (getting the "no show" wrong in Glasgow and then refusal by BA representatives in Gibraltar to verify the facts of the case before denying boarding.
We will continue to make an infernal nuisance of ourselves (letters to CEO, CAA, press etc) and will use small claims court if it goes that far.
cheers again guys
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I'm genuinely disappointed in the response you have gotten, considering your letter made it to one of the executive assistants. That said, in some ways, I am not at all surprised. Some of the hideous complaints that I caught, just prior to going legal, was astounding. Many of them easily solved once somebody actually READ the letter, with a little empathy. One of the reasons I transfered out, truth be told.
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Well we have sent BA "Customer Relations" another letter, copied to Keith Williams stating my interpretation of EU261 which certainly doesn't only refer to denied boarding in terms of overbooking.
We also pointed out (having read EU 261 more thoroughly) that after the initial Glasgow - London city flight which was cancelled, the much beloved was involuntarily rerouted on a Glasgow - Heathrow flight which left about 3 hrs after the originally scheduled departure, so BA should consider the "cancellations" section of EU 261 re compensation for that sector too.
Plus was MB given her written statement of cancellation options as specified by EU 261??? No.
Hey ho, let's go on with the show.
We also pointed out (having read EU 261 more thoroughly) that after the initial Glasgow - London city flight which was cancelled, the much beloved was involuntarily rerouted on a Glasgow - Heathrow flight which left about 3 hrs after the originally scheduled departure, so BA should consider the "cancellations" section of EU 261 re compensation for that sector too.
Plus was MB given her written statement of cancellation options as specified by EU 261??? No.
Hey ho, let's go on with the show.
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Well hey, suddenly an instant response from BA offering 250 Euros for the cancelled Glasgow - London City flight, but they are still maintaining that MB was not "Denied boarding" in Gibraltar.
So what was it????
Suggestions please? BA obviously don't understand English
So what was it????
Suggestions please? BA obviously don't understand English
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Maybe you should suggest that if they up their compensation from £250 vouchers to €400 sterling equivalant plus the already offered Easyjet fare plus petrol ay £50 plus the €250 compensation they just offered then you'll settle, albeit while continuing to disagree that the actions of their Gib people were effectively denied boarding. Otherwise you go for more in the small claims court.
That seems fair to me, although I think their incompetence in handling the booking should reach a wider audience.
That seems fair to me, although I think their incompetence in handling the booking should reach a wider audience.
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Hey guess what guys!
Gibon 2 was spot on.
a second email this afternoon from BA "I appreciate that you feel that you were denied boarding at Gibraltar but this was in fact not the case. Due to an error at Glasgow your return ticket was cancelled by mistake. This meant that your ticket was not valid for travel frm Gibraltar. I do understand your inconvenience but unfortunately this is not a situation where we would offer denied boarding compensation"............
"I hope that this will not deter you from chosing British Airways again in the future"
Gibon 2 was spot on.
a second email this afternoon from BA "I appreciate that you feel that you were denied boarding at Gibraltar but this was in fact not the case. Due to an error at Glasgow your return ticket was cancelled by mistake. This meant that your ticket was not valid for travel frm Gibraltar. I do understand your inconvenience but unfortunately this is not a situation where we would offer denied boarding compensation"............
"I hope that this will not deter you from chosing British Airways again in the future"