BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions II
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Edit:
Originally in response to a post that has now been deleted.
Both quotes, by a striker, originate from here.
How about:
Originally in response to a post that has now been deleted.
Both quotes, by a striker, originate from here.
Willie is bugging the room phones at the Aurora!!
(That's my favorite.)
(That's my favorite.)
Duncan is a wally. I mean, have you read his updates?
Last edited by BillS; 23rd Jul 2010 at 11:28.
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Yet another ballot!
Here we go again, Unite will ballot the CC for yet more Industrial Action. I imagine that BA's legal team are rubbing there hands together in anticipation of yet more legal action!
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Can any of you sensible cc help me.
We are booked on a long haul flight on 3rd Sept. but have a connecting flight on the morning from Newcastle. Whilst I would feel comfortable enough once in Heathrow does anyone know what would happen if this was a strike day and I was stuck in Newcastle airport (or what previously happened) on the friday morning.
Can I also take this opportunity to thank the cc and vcc who attempted to keep the service going as normally as possible.I think the majority of passengers are grateful for your efforts. I wish you luck and hope that the neanderthal thinking of the minority of your colleagues will soon be a thing of the past.I am an ex union rep (retired NHS) and cannot for the life of me understand what they are thinking of in these hard times when many people are facing the loss of their job and there are many greater injustices to contend with.
Good luck for the future and long live BA
We are booked on a long haul flight on 3rd Sept. but have a connecting flight on the morning from Newcastle. Whilst I would feel comfortable enough once in Heathrow does anyone know what would happen if this was a strike day and I was stuck in Newcastle airport (or what previously happened) on the friday morning.
Can I also take this opportunity to thank the cc and vcc who attempted to keep the service going as normally as possible.I think the majority of passengers are grateful for your efforts. I wish you luck and hope that the neanderthal thinking of the minority of your colleagues will soon be a thing of the past.I am an ex union rep (retired NHS) and cannot for the life of me understand what they are thinking of in these hard times when many people are facing the loss of their job and there are many greater injustices to contend with.
Good luck for the future and long live BA
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she's had more than enough and just wants to go to work and do a decent job, the sooner BASSA allow her the better, is her view.
Has BASSA got her locked up?
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Teesider,
From what I could see when travelling on previous strike days to/from Newcastle, they kept the early and late flights and it was the middle ones that suffered. As soon as the schedule was announced, you could swap onto the flights that were planned to operate without penalty. And in my experience, those flights operated perfectly (better than usual actually!!) If you really wanted to play safe, you could swap to the day before and nightstop perhaps?
Though from what I understand, WW says that there will be even more shorthaul flights if they are mad enough to strike again. Are they?? Who knows?? I cannot understand their thinking at all!! I would really take heart from the fact that there now seems to be only the 'duty' BASSA poster on the other forum whereas in the early days there were some who were more obviously just cabin crew who did not know which way to turn. I think most of those have decided and have turned away from BASSA judging by the lack of BASSA sympathisers expressing views now.
Good luck! And try not to worry about it. I'm also going on holiday in September and am still planning to fly BA because I don't want to let these few wreck the lives of so many!! I have great admiration for the VCC who have stepped in and kept the company going.:
From what I could see when travelling on previous strike days to/from Newcastle, they kept the early and late flights and it was the middle ones that suffered. As soon as the schedule was announced, you could swap onto the flights that were planned to operate without penalty. And in my experience, those flights operated perfectly (better than usual actually!!) If you really wanted to play safe, you could swap to the day before and nightstop perhaps?
Though from what I understand, WW says that there will be even more shorthaul flights if they are mad enough to strike again. Are they?? Who knows?? I cannot understand their thinking at all!! I would really take heart from the fact that there now seems to be only the 'duty' BASSA poster on the other forum whereas in the early days there were some who were more obviously just cabin crew who did not know which way to turn. I think most of those have decided and have turned away from BASSA judging by the lack of BASSA sympathisers expressing views now.
Good luck! And try not to worry about it. I'm also going on holiday in September and am still planning to fly BA because I don't want to let these few wreck the lives of so many!! I have great admiration for the VCC who have stepped in and kept the company going.:
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Good for her. Why doesn't she go back to work and do a decent job, then?
Has BASSA got her locked up?
Has BASSA got her locked up?
I'll give you a silly example if you like: How about the debate she has with some crew each flight when she is spotted reaching for the hot towles..!
..or how about the atmosphere when she requests that crew dont sit in the gally filling in forms claiming strike pay during a flight, or the grilling that follows being spotted taking refreshments to flight crew, I could go on with more serious examples, I really could.
Regardless of who you believe is at fault all is not usual at work and hasnt been for some time. Some will state it's down to BA's management I know, she holds the view that it's BASSA, you have your own position I'm sure - which view is correct is the subject of this forum debate is it not.
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That other thread is so much 'same old, same old.'
Would someone in the know please start a new thread when something actually happens? Probably on or after 1st August.
Possible title: "'The Bill' - BA vs BASSA."
Would someone in the know please start a new thread when something actually happens? Probably on or after 1st August.
Possible title: "'The Bill' - BA vs BASSA."
Last edited by Neptunus Rex; 23rd Jul 2010 at 17:12.
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Snas..
I follow; I read your post as BASSA not allowing her to go back to work, rather than BASSA (or rather those acting in its name) not allowing her to do a decent job when she is at work.
So, apologies and I understand.
I follow; I read your post as BASSA not allowing her to go back to work, rather than BASSA (or rather those acting in its name) not allowing her to do a decent job when she is at work.
So, apologies and I understand.
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Teesider,
I would not trust BA to protect your short-haul connection. During the last strike BA cancelled our connecting flight out of Heathrow and, despite promises in the media to reroute us on other airlines, other flights, other ... , they didn't. We were given an option of returning a day earlier or a refund. So we agreed to travel the day earlier, a non-strike day. They then cancelled the day earlier connecting flight out of Heathrow, and told us we could 'stand-by' for a later flight that day. No guarantees, no compensation, nothing. After sweating for 24 hours or so, not knowing if we could get home, we did.
Expect the worst. (and I'm ex-gold, currently silver, and soon to be blue). You can't trust these bar-stewards.
I would not trust BA to protect your short-haul connection. During the last strike BA cancelled our connecting flight out of Heathrow and, despite promises in the media to reroute us on other airlines, other flights, other ... , they didn't. We were given an option of returning a day earlier or a refund. So we agreed to travel the day earlier, a non-strike day. They then cancelled the day earlier connecting flight out of Heathrow, and told us we could 'stand-by' for a later flight that day. No guarantees, no compensation, nothing. After sweating for 24 hours or so, not knowing if we could get home, we did.
Expect the worst. (and I'm ex-gold, currently silver, and soon to be blue). You can't trust these bar-stewards.
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CC Really should visit here
From the other place
Colonel White posts what I have posted for a long time
"THERE REALLY IS NO WORK OUT THERE"
SNIP
COLONEL WHITE
Came across the following article which may be of interest to those cabin crew thinking of taking further industrial action
'Pier Walker, 45, has been unemployed for over a year after a long and successful career working for British Airways in its first class cabin crew. Pier says: “I would like a job in customer services. Initially I was quite selective in what I applied for, but now I’m so desperate that I’m looking in any sector. On average I’m making two job applications a day but I have only been able to secure one interview for a permanent role and that has taken months to arrange. I have received no job offers to date.”'
Full article here =>Online Recruitment - Today?s jobseeker: over-qualified and undervalued
Article is dated 23/7/10, so very recent. Does make you think about the value of hanging on to your job as opposed to throwing it away defending BASSA's principles
HOT WINGS REPLIES
Why hasn't he managed to get a job as a paramedic, firefighter, or midwife Surely he's Qualified"
"
END SNIP
I obviously can not reply on the other place
If you can, then tell HotWings and the rest of them
Because there are thousands of the above fully qualified in the profession already unemployed looking for the work
They are not going to take someone who has a knowledge of the job when there are people who have done the job waiting for another one to pop up
What used to be school girl leavers doing office work for peanuts, have been replaced by UNI Gradutates doing office work for peanuts
OTHER AIRLINES have staff turnover, because they are UNI Graduates gap yearing and earning a lot more than burger flipping
LOSE YOUR JOB and you are destitute for at least five years, until your home and family have gone, all your savings, and by then your knowledge of the job is five years out of date and NO CHANCE
My employment, I now have ex proud well off men (and Ladies) with the BMW big house inc £90k they are now on £120 per fortnight Job Seekers Allowance for six months, then nothing until all the above have GONE then £120 a fortnight Income support, this has been for over eighteen months now
You can not keep a big house, nice car, and model wife on that, They ALL go
2010 is not the year to risk losing what you have
Jack McHammocklashing
Colonel White posts what I have posted for a long time
"THERE REALLY IS NO WORK OUT THERE"
SNIP
COLONEL WHITE
Came across the following article which may be of interest to those cabin crew thinking of taking further industrial action
'Pier Walker, 45, has been unemployed for over a year after a long and successful career working for British Airways in its first class cabin crew. Pier says: “I would like a job in customer services. Initially I was quite selective in what I applied for, but now I’m so desperate that I’m looking in any sector. On average I’m making two job applications a day but I have only been able to secure one interview for a permanent role and that has taken months to arrange. I have received no job offers to date.”'
Full article here =>Online Recruitment - Today?s jobseeker: over-qualified and undervalued
Article is dated 23/7/10, so very recent. Does make you think about the value of hanging on to your job as opposed to throwing it away defending BASSA's principles
HOT WINGS REPLIES
Why hasn't he managed to get a job as a paramedic, firefighter, or midwife Surely he's Qualified"
"
END SNIP
I obviously can not reply on the other place
If you can, then tell HotWings and the rest of them
Because there are thousands of the above fully qualified in the profession already unemployed looking for the work
They are not going to take someone who has a knowledge of the job when there are people who have done the job waiting for another one to pop up
What used to be school girl leavers doing office work for peanuts, have been replaced by UNI Gradutates doing office work for peanuts
OTHER AIRLINES have staff turnover, because they are UNI Graduates gap yearing and earning a lot more than burger flipping
LOSE YOUR JOB and you are destitute for at least five years, until your home and family have gone, all your savings, and by then your knowledge of the job is five years out of date and NO CHANCE
My employment, I now have ex proud well off men (and Ladies) with the BMW big house inc £90k they are now on £120 per fortnight Job Seekers Allowance for six months, then nothing until all the above have GONE then £120 a fortnight Income support, this has been for over eighteen months now
You can not keep a big house, nice car, and model wife on that, They ALL go
2010 is not the year to risk losing what you have
Jack McHammocklashing
Last edited by JackMcHammocklashing; 23rd Jul 2010 at 22:17.
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Jack
I might be wrong, but i think the "why doesnt he get a job as a paramedic, midwife etc" comment was a touch of sarcasm from the poster, rather than serious question, based on the long thread conversations where we hear about all the hundreds of highly qualified BA CC who are lawyers, doctors, teachers, dentists, midwives, who decided to give it up and be CC instead.
(Not that i doubt that there are indeed some former professionals amongst the crew...)
(Not that i doubt that there are indeed some former professionals amongst the crew...)
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Duncans Alter Ego
Looks like DH has time on his hand and has wheeled out one of his female personas for an Anonymous article in todays Guardian.
He has a nice little dig at the Pilots and generally tries to stir up trouble - again
Quote
"And it's not just the passengers you have to look out for. I once saw a fist-fight break out when two of the cabin crew discovered they were sleeping with the same captain. The straight crew probably have the best job of all – they work with all the female staff, rather than being confined to the cockpit, so they get off with more girls than anyone else. It can be a great social life – wild parties in hotels; skinny-dipping, smoking dope and getting drunk. There have been moments where I've thought, thank God the passengers can't see us now, like the time I was sitting by a swimming pool in Cyprus at 5am, drinking martinis and watching our drunken flight captain flirting with a girl, and thinking, "He's got to fly a plane in less than four hours' time." Still, he was flying Airbus, which means they hardly have to do a thing – the computer almost lands it for them."
Maybe he is playing Miss M or Ava in this one. I wonder how he gets into character?
But typical how the CC job is implied to be more dificult than Pilots, who "hardly have to do a thing".
How can a national newspaper print such utter tosh - well it is the Guardian I suppose
He has a nice little dig at the Pilots and generally tries to stir up trouble - again
Quote
"And it's not just the passengers you have to look out for. I once saw a fist-fight break out when two of the cabin crew discovered they were sleeping with the same captain. The straight crew probably have the best job of all – they work with all the female staff, rather than being confined to the cockpit, so they get off with more girls than anyone else. It can be a great social life – wild parties in hotels; skinny-dipping, smoking dope and getting drunk. There have been moments where I've thought, thank God the passengers can't see us now, like the time I was sitting by a swimming pool in Cyprus at 5am, drinking martinis and watching our drunken flight captain flirting with a girl, and thinking, "He's got to fly a plane in less than four hours' time." Still, he was flying Airbus, which means they hardly have to do a thing – the computer almost lands it for them."
Maybe he is playing Miss M or Ava in this one. I wonder how he gets into character?
But typical how the CC job is implied to be more dificult than Pilots, who "hardly have to do a thing".
How can a national newspaper print such utter tosh - well it is the Guardian I suppose
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Lanyards
A few posts have mentioned militant CC wearing BASSA lanyards while on duty. Are additional items of this nature, allowed to be worn with/on their uniform, (bearing in mind all the previous fuss about a member of the checkin staff wearing a crucifix), as it appears on the surface that the wearing of this lanyard is possibly being used to cause dissension/possible intimidation amongst crews. It can't give too good an impression to passengers who are aware of the BA/BASSA problems.
Or is this a molehill looking to be a mountain?
Or is this a molehill looking to be a mountain?
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Not sure how BA could let something like that stand unchallenged
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@baggersup
It's a whole other category to allege staff were using drugs and a captain was abusing the alcohol policy, inferring he was an unsafe pilot as a result. That's actionable.
I'm sure the paper will be receiving a phone call from BA's lawyers forthwith.
Not sure how BA could let something like that stand unchallenged in a major daily. Hope the paper's publishers have very deep pockets.
It's a whole other category to allege staff were using drugs and a captain was abusing the alcohol policy, inferring he was an unsafe pilot as a result. That's actionable.
I'm sure the paper will be receiving a phone call from BA's lawyers forthwith.
Not sure how BA could let something like that stand unchallenged in a major daily. Hope the paper's publishers have very deep pockets.
Note that nowhere within this article is British Airways, or indeed the name of any Airline mentioned.
It is a touch unfortunate however that BA is the subject of all of the articles in the Related section. This might lead some readers to conclude that British Airways was the target of the article.
I would have thought the related articles are selected by some type of algorithm rather than by a human?
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Jack
You are right. People need to know when they’ve got it good and to put their livelihood at risk at a time when there are no viable alternatives is a folly.
But we still hear of executive excesses (e.g. M&S) and management using the economic situation to exploit the workforce (e.g. unpaid internships). I’m afraid the Victorian mill owner instinct for exploitation is never far away! Unions still have a role in protecting workers in this environment. An eternal struggle in which the balance of power shifts with the prevailing economic and political environment.
But we still hear of executive excesses (e.g. M&S) and management using the economic situation to exploit the workforce (e.g. unpaid internships). I’m afraid the Victorian mill owner instinct for exploitation is never far away! Unions still have a role in protecting workers in this environment. An eternal struggle in which the balance of power shifts with the prevailing economic and political environment.
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Unions still have a role in protecting workers in this environment.
I completely agree but would suggest that in the case of BASSA/Unite and BA CC they have acted in such a fashion as to have jeopardised the continued employment of many and indeed already concluded the employment of a few.
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With respect I would suggest that there is a deal of difference between the stereotypical victorian mill owner and modern management. To kick off with, the mill owners were in the main deeply religious men with a strong work ethic who were not responsible to shareholders and who invariably did not have a senior management team running the enterprise. Any profits from the mill went into the owner's pocket, thus he had a vested interest in operating at the lowest cost threshold.
Contrast this with the management teams of companies like BA, where although the senior execs do get bonuses, they invariably come in the form of share options. The profits don't go into their pockets, they are shared by all the shareholders (assuming the company pays a dividend). It is utter tosh to suggest that the management team of any company is exploiting the current economic situation to undermine its staff. In any organisation employee costs invariably figure as one of if not the highest cost items. So in a time when revenues are down, the logical area to tackle is cost reduction and employee PPI costs are a prime target.
Unions are in a difficult position. They should be aware of the economic realities but it runs counter to their position. They know that cutbacks are required, but the notion of losing a few in order to protect the many is opposed to the idea of protection for all.
As far as executive pay goes, yes, the amount that Stuart Rose gets as part time chairman of M&S does seem ridiculous, but then so is the amount that football clubs pay for players. At least Stuart Rose has been able to help M&S make a profit. And on the subject of pay, why does nobody shout about the package that TU leaders enjoy ?
Contrast this with the management teams of companies like BA, where although the senior execs do get bonuses, they invariably come in the form of share options. The profits don't go into their pockets, they are shared by all the shareholders (assuming the company pays a dividend). It is utter tosh to suggest that the management team of any company is exploiting the current economic situation to undermine its staff. In any organisation employee costs invariably figure as one of if not the highest cost items. So in a time when revenues are down, the logical area to tackle is cost reduction and employee PPI costs are a prime target.
Unions are in a difficult position. They should be aware of the economic realities but it runs counter to their position. They know that cutbacks are required, but the notion of losing a few in order to protect the many is opposed to the idea of protection for all.
As far as executive pay goes, yes, the amount that Stuart Rose gets as part time chairman of M&S does seem ridiculous, but then so is the amount that football clubs pay for players. At least Stuart Rose has been able to help M&S make a profit. And on the subject of pay, why does nobody shout about the package that TU leaders enjoy ?
