BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
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gr8tballsofire:
Are you referring to the letter that was sent during the first strike when they were discussing the levy for funds?
If not is it possible for you to provide a link to the letter you reference?
Thank you.
Are you referring to the letter that was sent during the first strike when they were discussing the levy for funds?
If not is it possible for you to provide a link to the letter you reference?
Thank you.
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And back to court we go...
Our lawyers wrote to Unite yesterday evening to highlight potential flaws in the ballot process that led to seven days of strikes in March and the 20 days of strike action planned from next week.
The Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992 requires unions to send everyone eligible to vote details of the exact breakdown of the ballot result. This point of law was clarified in April following Network Rail’s successful application for an injunction to stop a strike by the RMT.
We do not believe Unite properly complied with this requirement. We wrote to the General Secretaries of the union yesterday asking them to explain to us how they discharged this obligation and, based on Unite’s replies, we believe that they failed to comply with the legal requirement.
On this basis we have applied to the High Court for an injunction to stop the 20 days of strikes planned from Tuesday.
The Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992 requires unions to send everyone eligible to vote details of the exact breakdown of the ballot result. This point of law was clarified in April following Network Rail’s successful application for an injunction to stop a strike by the RMT.
We do not believe Unite properly complied with this requirement. We wrote to the General Secretaries of the union yesterday asking them to explain to us how they discharged this obligation and, based on Unite’s replies, we believe that they failed to comply with the legal requirement.
On this basis we have applied to the High Court for an injunction to stop the 20 days of strikes planned from Tuesday.
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Another part of the same message from "The Other Thread"
All previous emphasis not copied ... draw your own conclusions. Anyone who doubted that WW had thought all this through, including the various paths that the dispute could take, really should sit up and take notice.
That paragraph implies, at least to me, that the "P-45 Printer" has names and staff numbers primed for output. BA has proved it can operate [in a slightly limited way] without 3-4k strikers. It can operate in a similar way without 3-4k unemployed ex-BA CC, while it recruits and trains replacements, and slowly restores full service across the airline.
If i were a BA striker, I would be VERY afraid. But then I wouldn't probably read PPRuNe, or other websites, or any communications from BA management.
If the union has failed to comply, all the strike action that resulted from that ballot would be unlawful and their members would only have limited protection while taking part in strike action. The union would also be liable to BA for some of the financial losses that we have suffered as a result of the strikes.
That paragraph implies, at least to me, that the "P-45 Printer" has names and staff numbers primed for output. BA has proved it can operate [in a slightly limited way] without 3-4k strikers. It can operate in a similar way without 3-4k unemployed ex-BA CC, while it recruits and trains replacements, and slowly restores full service across the airline.
If i were a BA striker, I would be VERY afraid. But then I wouldn't probably read PPRuNe, or other websites, or any communications from BA management.
Paxing All Over The World
beaudale
This is a pax forum on which we are allowed by our host to discuss items of mutual interest. It has been stated before that we are not at liberty to slag off airline staff en masse. Making reference to no CC on aircraft has not been well received before. On this site, the owner and moderators are very keen to keep each thread to a single topic. The more so, given the powerful nature of this thread.
If you want to discuss the likelihood of one member of CC per a/c then it would be best to start a new thread on that topic. On other occaisions I have seen thread discussion commercial flights without flight crew, so your thread would be a natural companion discussion to that.
As to the term 'SLF', that is dealt with in our forum FAQ which I'm sure you have read. http://www.pprune.org/passengers-slf...-term-slf.html
Sorry thought this was a Pax thread, did I miss something?
A lot has also been said on here about the need to respect all groups and this thread has been moderated accordingly. In this vein I would like to point out that the thread running else where with a theme about "Stupid SLF" is somewhat offensive to the Pax group who do after all pay everyone's salaries.
A lot has also been said on here about the need to respect all groups and this thread has been moderated accordingly. In this vein I would like to point out that the thread running else where with a theme about "Stupid SLF" is somewhat offensive to the Pax group who do after all pay everyone's salaries.
If you want to discuss the likelihood of one member of CC per a/c then it would be best to start a new thread on that topic. On other occaisions I have seen thread discussion commercial flights without flight crew, so your thread would be a natural companion discussion to that.
As to the term 'SLF', that is dealt with in our forum FAQ which I'm sure you have read. http://www.pprune.org/passengers-slf...-term-slf.html
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This obviously begs the question why the company has only decided to do this until now.
Seems more of a tactical maneouvre to put the wind up Unite rather than avoid a strike, like at Christmas where the company was nowhere near as prepared and there was the emotive aspect of the timing of the strike.
Seems more of a tactical maneouvre to put the wind up Unite rather than avoid a strike, like at Christmas where the company was nowhere near as prepared and there was the emotive aspect of the timing of the strike.
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@ LD12986 ... I doubt very much that WW/BA are doing tactical responses. Having read into this dispute closely, and daily, for the last 6 months or more I would surmise that there is a well-developed set of options [all carefully staffed and checked for legality] that resembles the wiring loom of a 747. There is no way that WW is playing this off the cuff.
@ PAXboy ... a very fair call. I have learned, at my cost, that we all dribble here under the Site rules - and breach them at our peril.
So - an exciting week ahead, eh?
Wheeeee - I'm flying BA on Tue/Wed.
I wonder what will happen while I'm out of touch?
After daily doses of updates, actually being there, as opposed to reading about it, is going to be quite strange. I'm looking forward to the experience.
@ PAXboy ... a very fair call. I have learned, at my cost, that we all dribble here under the Site rules - and breach them at our peril.
So - an exciting week ahead, eh?
Wheeeee - I'm flying BA on Tue/Wed.
I wonder what will happen while I'm out of touch?
After daily doses of updates, actually being there, as opposed to reading about it, is going to be quite strange. I'm looking forward to the experience.
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BA have clearly been planning their actions carefully throughout this dispute, but I don't think this latest move to apply for an injunction will have been part of their long-term game plan. The clue is in JetSetLady's post -
So it looks like this has only become an option from early April.
For me, though, the interesting thing is what happens after 12 June, whether or not the strikes take place. As I understand it, any industrial action taken after that date is not protected. Lots of people seem to think that at that point, BA will be able to 'lance the boil' by dismissing the strikers. But I don't think they can, unless further industrial action is taken after that date.
So where does that leave things? BA has already 'imposed' its preferred solution. No further industrial action can be taken without risk of dismissal. So does the status quo simply remain, since BA will have achieved their original aim?
This point of law was clarified in April following Network Rail’s successful application for an injunction to stop a strike by the RMT.
For me, though, the interesting thing is what happens after 12 June, whether or not the strikes take place. As I understand it, any industrial action taken after that date is not protected. Lots of people seem to think that at that point, BA will be able to 'lance the boil' by dismissing the strikers. But I don't think they can, unless further industrial action is taken after that date.
So where does that leave things? BA has already 'imposed' its preferred solution. No further industrial action can be taken without risk of dismissal. So does the status quo simply remain, since BA will have achieved their original aim?
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70 odd pages in and it is not a hamster wheel?
There are two sides, each has their own opinion and equally valid as far as the poster's intention.
The outcome - well one would hope that common sense prevails.
There are two sides, each has their own opinion and equally valid as far as the poster's intention.
The outcome - well one would hope that common sense prevails.
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The legal action is a simple tactic to delay industrial action beyond the 12 week point at which legal dismissal of those involved is allowed with no come back.
If Unite have any sense they will call off next week's industrial action pending the result of the injunction. They are exposed already and I doubt they'd want to bet the farm on being on the hook for more damages.
If BA gets an injunction, Unite will conduct a fresh ballot then this farce will carry on for another few months.
If BA does not get an injunction then, as you say, the clock starts ticking towards the 12 week deadline.
Whatever the motives behind this, I doubt (as the BASSA acolytes would like to think) it is because BA is panicking.
Last edited by LD12986; 14th May 2010 at 23:29.
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They, Unite, should not back down period. And lets get over the future security of the company fallacy that management resort to in order to push their useless rationale across.''If you don't back down we are facing bankruptcy'' the cheapest moral suasion for such laureates of management.
What they mean is back down so we can continue drinking our fine tea in waterwold and help us pay off our personal exesses that we accumulated when the going was good.
This is simply a battle where the feudalists are trying to deduct from the working class in order to afford their champagne lifestyle.And in the process they are calling the union communists.
This is a battle for transfer of wealth.
Can I ask, If management are so worried about the future of the company why is it then that they will not be part of it in the future but will have moved on somewhere else delivering the same destructive rhetoric of people's livelyhoods?
BA used to be a renowned product because of its staff and the way they delivered their customer service. They did that because, they were rewarded for their services. And thats what attracted the yields.
The crew felt that they belonged to and subsequently devoted their lives to their job and have treated it like their own home and that attitude permeated in the way they delivered their customer service.BA used to be an inspiration for both staff and passengers.
Neo-style mangers treat their job as a hotel room instead.Thats the difference.
Neo-style managers in their pursuit of greed reckon that employing staff on peanuts will yield the same customer service and deliver the same historical profits for less. What UTTER RUBBISH.
Why is it then that Virgin always post if any, such low profits? Must be the Superlative service and not absent minded, flint faced 18 year olds promoting two finger rhetoric.
Its not the crew's fault that the pension pot is empty, its pernicious management.
The path of austerity should commence at the top and not start and end at the bottom.
The Pilots should not be such rabid supporters of management's fallacy because they will be next in the firing line and Cameron and mates should be the last place to be eulogising, as he, Cameron has proven his dexterity by asking the ferals help him extend his ego!
Tell me then, why is it that we now live in a society that has no job security, people have no aspirations, the customer service is non existent no matter where you go and yet we pride ourselves on the fact that we(the western world) have specialists everywhere for everything?
What they mean is back down so we can continue drinking our fine tea in waterwold and help us pay off our personal exesses that we accumulated when the going was good.
This is simply a battle where the feudalists are trying to deduct from the working class in order to afford their champagne lifestyle.And in the process they are calling the union communists.
This is a battle for transfer of wealth.
Can I ask, If management are so worried about the future of the company why is it then that they will not be part of it in the future but will have moved on somewhere else delivering the same destructive rhetoric of people's livelyhoods?
BA used to be a renowned product because of its staff and the way they delivered their customer service. They did that because, they were rewarded for their services. And thats what attracted the yields.
The crew felt that they belonged to and subsequently devoted their lives to their job and have treated it like their own home and that attitude permeated in the way they delivered their customer service.BA used to be an inspiration for both staff and passengers.
Neo-style mangers treat their job as a hotel room instead.Thats the difference.
Neo-style managers in their pursuit of greed reckon that employing staff on peanuts will yield the same customer service and deliver the same historical profits for less. What UTTER RUBBISH.
Why is it then that Virgin always post if any, such low profits? Must be the Superlative service and not absent minded, flint faced 18 year olds promoting two finger rhetoric.
Its not the crew's fault that the pension pot is empty, its pernicious management.
The path of austerity should commence at the top and not start and end at the bottom.
The Pilots should not be such rabid supporters of management's fallacy because they will be next in the firing line and Cameron and mates should be the last place to be eulogising, as he, Cameron has proven his dexterity by asking the ferals help him extend his ego!
Tell me then, why is it that we now live in a society that has no job security, people have no aspirations, the customer service is non existent no matter where you go and yet we pride ourselves on the fact that we(the western world) have specialists everywhere for everything?
Last edited by wet vee two; 15th May 2010 at 01:29.
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They, Unite, should not back down period
- Peter.
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I sincerely hope you are right and they keep this up so that hopefully Walsh can fire the whole stinking bunch and get some people in there who are happy to have a job.
- Peter.
- Peter.
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The Pilots should not be such rabid supporters of management's fallacy because they will be next in the firing line and Cameron and mates should be the last place to be eulogising, as he, Cameron has proven his dexterity by asking the ferals help him extend his ego!
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Made me laugh
BA used to be a renowned product because of its staff and the way they delivered their customer service
Why is it then that Virgin always post if any, such low profits?
Tell me then, why is it that we now live in a society that has no job security, people have no aspirations, the customer service is non existent no matter where you go and yet we pride ourselves on the fact that we(the western world) have specialists everywhere for everything?
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Send some mexicans over then to help them out.
These people need to be weeded out so that BA can become great once again. There are lots of decent hardworking crew members at BA who must be sick and tired of being tarred with the same brush as the "Wake me up over Windsor" crowd.
Tell you what, if your T's and C's are that bad and your working life is so hard, why not just leave? After all, other airlines must be falling over themselves to employ people of your calibre? I'm sure you'll have no trouble at all in attracting a salary equal to or superior to your current one, will you?
It's all gone quiet over there...
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Summer Breeze is was not referring to you.
I also was patently not sitting on the fence rather referring to Ancient Observers post.
My post being because BASSA have always got away with it in the past they think they will again, patently they aren't so they need to revise their policy.
I also was patently not sitting on the fence rather referring to Ancient Observers post.
My post being because BASSA have always got away with it in the past they think they will again, patently they aren't so they need to revise their policy.
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Sorry to step on your management rhetoric Ten west. There is the channel tunnel of course.
Winch- what an incomprehensible and impotent retort.
Laureates or friends of the quantitative easing solution, as when there ain't no assets left, printing a fallacy(legacy) is the only option left.
As an outsider, I perhaps can highlight the failure of the neo-liberal regime!
Just like Sir Fred from RBS, but he's happy on £700k a year from his incompetence never mind his staff who are left with the .............!
Winch- what an incomprehensible and impotent retort.
Laureates or friends of the quantitative easing solution, as when there ain't no assets left, printing a fallacy(legacy) is the only option left.
As an outsider, I perhaps can highlight the failure of the neo-liberal regime!
Just like Sir Fred from RBS, but he's happy on £700k a year from his incompetence never mind his staff who are left with the .............!
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Letter to all Unite BA mmbers
Diplome
Here is the link....http://uniteba.com/ESW/Files/20100512145940215.pdf
Clearly they are trying to justify themselves to the rest of the BA (non CC) community.
They have a responsibility for ALL their members, something which seems to have been missed somewhere!!!
Here is the link....http://uniteba.com/ESW/Files/20100512145940215.pdf
Clearly they are trying to justify themselves to the rest of the BA (non CC) community.
They have a responsibility for ALL their members, something which seems to have been missed somewhere!!!
