China Northeastern Airlines Safety Concerns, Beware!
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China Northeastern Airlines Safety Concerns, Beware!
Flew on Feb. 19th on China Northeastern (NS) Changsha CSX to Shenyang SHE. NS is a start up Chinese LoCo operating currently 1 A 319 out of Shenyang.
Flight was packed and we had a second CC deadheading back to SHE.
Row 1 directly behind bulkhead seat C and D were reserved for deadheads, who piled up their enormous amount of bags and cartons on and before seats B and E, locking two PAX in seats A and F.
Climb out showed a constant struggle of flight deck with engine controls, drove the plane like a Chinese cab driver from full power to idle to full power.
Worst was safety attidude of cabin crew, who had filled first six overhead bins with their personal luggage. Reaching cruising altitude CC pulled out some more bags out of front lav and stored it right at the front exit doors. Just before going into final they all got their bags out of the overhead bins and piled them up before the right front exit!
I could not complain as their English skills were virtually non existant. NS Ground staff with some English contacted later was not interested at all!
Not surprisingly half of the passengers got up and opened overhead bins when the main gear barely had touched the runway and we were still doing around 80 - 90 kn. Again cabin crew was not intervening .
Way to go until I will fly them again!
Frank
Flight was packed and we had a second CC deadheading back to SHE.
Row 1 directly behind bulkhead seat C and D were reserved for deadheads, who piled up their enormous amount of bags and cartons on and before seats B and E, locking two PAX in seats A and F.
Climb out showed a constant struggle of flight deck with engine controls, drove the plane like a Chinese cab driver from full power to idle to full power.
Worst was safety attidude of cabin crew, who had filled first six overhead bins with their personal luggage. Reaching cruising altitude CC pulled out some more bags out of front lav and stored it right at the front exit doors. Just before going into final they all got their bags out of the overhead bins and piled them up before the right front exit!
I could not complain as their English skills were virtually non existant. NS Ground staff with some English contacted later was not interested at all!
Not surprisingly half of the passengers got up and opened overhead bins when the main gear barely had touched the runway and we were still doing around 80 - 90 kn. Again cabin crew was not intervening .
Way to go until I will fly them again!
Frank
Last edited by fendant; 20th Feb 2008 at 16:05.
Everything is under control.
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I fly a lot in China and will be aware of that -- hope they tighten things up.
I often fly with Air China and China Eastern. I think they do a great job.
I often fly with Air China and China Eastern. I think they do a great job.
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Agree, I have flown quite often Air China, China Eastern, China Southern and some others like Hainan or Xiamen. They are all on Western Standards and way above union run US legacy carriers.
I also noticed last year and especially now in 2008 the dramatically increased friendliness at airports during check-in and at security. Speedy, efficient and friendly, they could be a role model for the American TSA cowboys and LHR.
Frank
I also noticed last year and especially now in 2008 the dramatically increased friendliness at airports during check-in and at security. Speedy, efficient and friendly, they could be a role model for the American TSA cowboys and LHR.
Frank
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Climb out showed a constant struggle of flight deck with engine controls, drove the plane like a Chinese cab driver from full power to idle to full power.
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TotalBeginner may have a point too. It is a fact that out of some Chinese airports, multiple step climbs is a fact of life. Some of which happen at fairly low levels too ~ 900m
Stepped climbs............ok fair enough. But have you heard of a mode called VS? If they have no requirement to reach ALT's by a certain DME then they could "smooth things" out a bit by using VS mode to reduce the ROC to say 1000 FPM.
We do this all the time in the 777 out of Asian Ports, knowing we wont get further CLB.
It's not rocket science.
We do this all the time in the 777 out of Asian Ports, knowing we wont get further CLB.
It's not rocket science.
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Use of V/S.... yes that's true. But that by itself does not constitute a "safety concern" as the title of this thread suggests, or such statements as "Climb out showed a constant struggle of flight deck with engine controls, drove the plane like a Chinese cab driver from full power to idle to full power."
It does however indicate un-polished flying, lack of "refinement" perhaps, assuming multiple low level step climbs were indeed the reason for Fendant's experience.
As to cabin crew attitude, agree wholeheartedly.
It does however indicate un-polished flying, lack of "refinement" perhaps, assuming multiple low level step climbs were indeed the reason for Fendant's experience.
As to cabin crew attitude, agree wholeheartedly.
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Warm beer, seats that had been urinated on, music blaring non-stop from tannoys mid-flight, no safety announcements, nobody understanding a word of English (safety), limited aircon and no food -- all in two days flying domestically in China just a few years ago.
I’ve been flying Chinese domestic since 1995, in the old days of TU154s and Yaks. The rumours going around then that if there was a crash and no foreigners were involved they just bulldozed over the hole.
There were the tatty interiors, spit sodden aisle carpets with passengers opening those overhead bins that hadn’t opened on touchdown whilst still rolling down the runway.
Once on the ramp the passengers were let loose to find there own way to arrivals, dodging taxiing aircraft and the airborne contents of plastic rubbish bags that had been thrown onto the concrete by the cleaners.
In the late nineties the CAAC got organised and started reading the Riot Act and quite a few executives were binned. From then on, apart from a few isolated instances the standards improved incredibly.
There are still the one-three horse operators without any proper organisation or training system who will try to get away with it as long as they can. On the whole, the major carriers like Air China, China Southern, Shanghai Airlines etc have standards that are as good as, and in some cases exceed those in the West.
Brand new modern equipment, brand new modern airports, cheerful, smiling assistance at every stage. Flying in China is now a very pleasant experience.
There were the tatty interiors, spit sodden aisle carpets with passengers opening those overhead bins that hadn’t opened on touchdown whilst still rolling down the runway.
Once on the ramp the passengers were let loose to find there own way to arrivals, dodging taxiing aircraft and the airborne contents of plastic rubbish bags that had been thrown onto the concrete by the cleaners.
In the late nineties the CAAC got organised and started reading the Riot Act and quite a few executives were binned. From then on, apart from a few isolated instances the standards improved incredibly.
There are still the one-three horse operators without any proper organisation or training system who will try to get away with it as long as they can. On the whole, the major carriers like Air China, China Southern, Shanghai Airlines etc have standards that are as good as, and in some cases exceed those in the West.
Brand new modern equipment, brand new modern airports, cheerful, smiling assistance at every stage. Flying in China is now a very pleasant experience.
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Climb out showed a constant struggle of flight deck with engine controls, drove the plane like a Chinese cab driver from full power to idle to full power.
Blocking Emergency Exits certainly does though.
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Last month I flew on China Air, China Eastern and Shenzhen and I must say They standards are up to par with any western outfit.
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Having flown Air China, China Southern and Shanghai Airlines domestically in the last 2 years I have no concerns about any of them. Some of the ptractices are admittedly very different (like how mny hundreds of baggage handlers they employ, presumably labour is very cheap and in China a very insignificant cost element compared to buying Western built aircraft).
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King Air, you are dead right, it is Air China indeed ( sorry about the typo) , now a member of Star Alliance and a really good airline nowadays, safe, mostly on-time and friendly, operating well maintained equipment. If you go through the Ameco ( a long time suvcessful JV with Lufthansa) facilities in Beijing you get a very good impression about their maintenance and procedures.
Folks, I know how you feel in stepped climbs from flying in Russia and China also on older TU's and Yaks. This was "digital " from full climb power to idle.
If we would have had cups on the fold out tables they would have emptied into the front seat pockets
.
Fly safe!
Frank
Folks, I know how you feel in stepped climbs from flying in Russia and China also on older TU's and Yaks. This was "digital " from full climb power to idle.
If we would have had cups on the fold out tables they would have emptied into the front seat pockets
. Fly safe!
Frank
What do you mean?
With a digital remote you press the mute button and it shuts off. Press it again and it slams back to what it was before.
Some pilots handle throttles like that.
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Fareastdriver: "Some pilots handle throttles like that. "
I am playing the devil's advocate here, but on an A320 during climbout, it would have been the auto-throttles handling the power.
I am playing the devil's advocate here, but on an A320 during climbout, it would have been the auto-throttles handling the power.