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It's not all about you.......
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Then it shouldnt be Class G....
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Spot on, Alpha.
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Wow. All the work I did 20 years ago so we could fly with relative freedom and less complication as they do in the USA , Canada and Europe has been wasted.
My book, which comes out in November tells how I attempted to bring in the overseas system to Australia. I will have to do an update and explain my failure! |
It is a failure, Dick.
If, just once, you used your political power to its full extent, you'd get all of what you want. But you seem to be unable to stop yourself from falling, over and over, for the tricks of the dumb and dumber political parties. Old dogs; old tricks; really, really boring, pointless journeys in circles. |
Originally Posted by triadic
(Post 11080634)
It is a dedicated positon in the Bris AACC. No other frequencies.
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Originally Posted by atcnews
(Post 11079437)
Ballina SUP now published - going live next month.
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What is the lower level of the SSR coverage at Ballina?
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Somewhere around 3000ft for primary & SSR
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Originally Posted by cogwheel
(Post 11081788)
Somewhere around 3000ft for primary & SSR
Thanks Dick, There’s your answer! Has the penny dropped yet on AsA’s biggest confidence trick. And fills in the blanks on the A320 / Jabiru incident! Going to be pretty hard for ATSB to cover this or MNG up now! Still only four killed…. Someone in AsA must have a smidgeon of morals and ethics as apparently the VFR traffic issuance to IFRs is now done and with far more accuracy according to people that monitor the relevant sector frequency above Ballina. How interesting! Ex FSO Griffo your time approaches…. |
Sorry Matey,
I ain't leavin' the 'Wild West'....especially with dat dere Covid hangin' around. And.....I've forgotten more than I ever knew...... Now, where ARE those f'n car keys..?? (Wots a car..??) |
Cogwheel,
Thanks for that altitude - is it the same over LIS? If so, the Jabiru reported at 5300 feet at LIS so did ATC pick it up? (CA/GRO does not have any surveillance other than FR24) We await the ATSB report with interest........ |
Originally Posted by Geoff Fairless
(Post 11082308)
Cogwheel,
Thanks for that altitude - is it the same over LIS? If so, the Jabiru reported at 5300 feet at LIS so did ATC pick it up? (CA/GRO does not have any surveillance other than FR24) We await the ATSB report with interest........ |
The SFIS seems to me to be like buying a proven 747 or 777 and putting piston engines on them because that’s what we did in the 50s.
Surely we should be using ATCs to actually control and separate IFR aircraft. Not give a Flight Service traffic information service. Maybe they could bring Griffitho over from the west to show them how to go back to the 50s and do it in style! |
That's hilarious - you're the one who transferred FS to ATC. We're ATSOs now, providing services in whichever class of airspace we work.
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Yes. I did. However that was part of the AMATS changes which placed class E to low level so the ATCs would be separating aircraft that were in IMC.
That did not go ahead because pilots and others believed that self separation in IMC was acceptably safe. Maybe after Mangalore there could be a different view! |
That did not go ahead because pilots and others believed that self separation in IMC was acceptably safe. Executive Summary. • Government responsibility for CSOs has been captured by proponents of "user pays" and "affordable safety". The Class G Trials were an example of public policy being captured by sectional interests that included AOPA, ATC Executive Management and Mr. D. Smith. ! Australia has a "World's Best" system of Directed Traffic Information provided by Flight Service. • Airservices Australia has promoted Airspace 2000 in part as justification for limitations of is expensive TAAATS project. • The capture of policy making has allowed a section of the aviation community to become an "economic free rider" • The senior management of CASA have shown themselves to be influenced if not captured by those whom they are to regulate. • The tr ials were a safety fraud - the Safety Case had flaws in it. • BASI's recommendation to terminate the trial is to be applauded. • An airspace bureau within the Department of transport should design airspace, CASA should regulate implementation and management of policy to ensure safety and quality processes, • Management of airspace should reside with RAAF and Airservices Australia. • BASI should retain its current independant role as investigator. |
Looks a little biased to me. Who actually wrote that report. ? Affordable safety is a fact. Not an opinion.
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No, it was the simple integration of FS into ATC.
You slag off FS as 1950s level yet fully embrace 1910s unalerted see and avoid. Why aren't you vigorously pushing for VFR aircraft to adopt modern technology? |
If by “ modern technology “ you mean VFR aircraft should be fitted with extra expensive equipment.
I supported such an aim at my meeting with Mr McCormack a couple of months ago. I said it would cost less than 2 cents a litre on avtur to cover such costs. He didn’t seem that enthusiastic! |
Oh so you're happy if someone else pays? That makes anything affordable. Looks like you'll just have to stick with Edwardian aviation.
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I quite like the idea of spreading the cost over those who benefit.
Le Ping. I can afford these upgrades but there are many who can’t and will simply leave aviation. It’s been happening for years. |
class E to low level so the ATCs would be separating aircraft that were in IMC. |
Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was
(Post 11083459)
But in reality, in Australia, they'd be mostly separating aircraft that weren't in IMC.
Is there a reluctance to on behalf of the pilot community (or particular airlines or specific pilots) to report visual? Is this because responsibility for separation would then switch from the ATC to the pilot? |
If they're not in IMC then surely they are visual are then able to self separate. Unfortunately, you don't turn airspace classification on and off with the weather. If it's E, you're getting separated whether in IMC or not. My point is that there is a lot less aircraft in IMC in Aus than in the US. |
AAHH...Dick,
I've told ya a MILLION times NOT to exxagerate so much...... I reckon you would have NOT been flying 'in the 50's'...except in your dreams....just like 'yours truly'. I have NO 'ordinary' idea of wot 'they' did in the 50's, and I suspect, neither does yerself - March '44 would have been a 'good year' for you?? Perhaps we should all go back to MORSE? - T'would save a LOT of unnecessary chatter......... AND....Yer 2 cents / litre on fuel was PRECISELY what funded that nasty ole FLIGHT SERVICE thingy....you know, the one you got rid of because you reckoned 'we' cost too much. It was all about the MONEY.. It was ALWAYS about the MONEY!. NOW you want a 2 cent levy on fuel to fund WHAT?? Tell 'im 'es dreamin'...... Cheeerrrsss.... and tks again for the........... |
We're ATSOs now, providing services in whichever class of airspace we work. I suspect the urge to 'control' will be difficult to overcome? |
Griffo. I loved Flight Service. Especially Dubbo FS when they would call me a taxi and put in my flight plan.
It was those Airlines who were the problem. They reckoned that GA should pay most of the FS cost because GA got most of the service. I could see we were not going to have a GA industry if that happened! But we hardly have a GA industry anyway so we may have well kept FS. But remember the big redundo! |
We've been doing so for nearly 25 years - FS literally went from being done by FSOs to being done by ATCs overnight. The large majority of en-route and TMA controllers provide services in class G every day.
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Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was
(Post 11083482)
Then you don't need E.
Unfortunately, you don't turn airspace classification on and off with the weather. If it's E, you're getting separated whether in IMC or not. My point is that there is a lot less aircraft in IMC in Aus than in the US. And, yes, I understood your point regarding the WX in AUS being better than the WX IN USA. |
Hey Dick,
I do.....Every Day.......And...... I secretly 'lurve ya' for it........... (But, I would NEVER NEVER NEVER admit it publicly...................) BUT......by those days most, or if not ALL of those 'nasty' big aeroplanes - 'AIRLINES' types were 'TURBOS / JETS' and burned AVTUR...??. As far as I am / was aware, the 2c levy for FS was based on AVGAS.....so the AIRLINES got us for FREE...?? Please correct me if I'm wrong..... |
I think an excise was/is imposed on both Avgas and Jet A1 consumed in Australia. Hence, Jet A1 loaded onto an aircraft about to depart on an international flight was/is not subject to excise. But that's just a cloudy memory. Maybe others with more recent knowledge will correct me if I'm wrong.
There was a bunch of complexity around 'past period franchise fees' charged by states for fuel, tobacco etc, but I don't know whether that applied to Avgas and Jet A1 supplied in a state and, in any event, the High Court in the late 90s finally declared them to be unconstitutional duties of excise because only the Commonwealth has power to charge excise (whereupon the Commonwealth said "thank you very much", imposed its excise instead and pocketed the extra billions, thus contributing further to the vertical fiscal imbalance). |
Originally Posted by Missy
If they're not in IMC then surely they are visual are then able to self separate.
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Especially Dubbo FS when they would ........ put in my flight plan. |
Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was
(Post 11085124)
They weren't doing you a favour. That was part of the job. You remember things called Briefing Offices?
That loss of an education source is incalculable. Now students and pilots either have to muddle through themselves or ask their instructor, who sadly more often than not these days might not know much more than they. And yes, instructors too used to come in to ask questions and to clarify things. |
BNA SFIS begins operations 8am tomorrow.....in lockdown !
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Why hide the idents? They need to know.
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I'm surprised it didn't stop happening very shortly after that screen shot.
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Originally Posted by Capt Fathom
(Post 11094505)
Why hide the idents? They need to know.
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