Navajo Spar Mod - Can we drop it yet?
 

Anyone know who to write to get this thing rescinded?

Looking at importing Navajo from the US or UK and there are plenty of good ones out there but many are around 10-12k hours.

Our Australian-only 13,000 hour $60k+ spar strap mod for the PA31 means it just doesn't make any sense to import one.

Seeing as no other country in the world imposed this directive, and wings have not been peeling off PA31s around the planet one could deduce that it was a pointless, costly directive that has dried up the supply of good PA31s in the country, was based on faulty stress analysis and cost operators of the type lots of money.

Not everyone can afford a Caravan, plus, they're boring

On the plus side I guess Mahindra made a bit of money out of it

I don't know that your concern is totally correct.

You might like to have a natter with Steve Swift and Martin Aubury. I don't have a current contact for Martin but Steve certainly will.

Both are technical experts in this stuff as well as being good lads ...

Caravan boring?

I think you will find that the navajo is 11000 hr and the chieftain is 13000hr, from memory.:confused:

Does a Caravan excite you?

Yes making a business decision based on what planes are boring is perfectly reasonable.

CASA will never rescind it, that implies they were wrong.


The best bet would be to campaign for a review of the requirement times based on new and current data of hours of current PA31's with no straps but still have wings attached and still in service.

It seems strange to have a C208 compared to a PA31-350, what type of operation is it?

Didn't Don Kendall do one of the first Navajo spar mods, back in the mid 1970's when they were using Pa-31's on Reg203 ops?

unless you are asetpa approved i'd imagine the van is a pretty boring business decision

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And operating a 40 year old aircraft with paying pax on board is a great business decision

What if said Navajo was immaculate with all round 10s? Would the age be an issue to you?

Caravans debuted in 1982 FYI

Of course not, but how many all round 10s chieftains have you flown? certainly not any I have had the luxury of operating.

There is not much point comparing a chieftain to a caravan anyway really, different leagues all together.

Navajos and 400 series sure, thats a different ball game.

Old piston twins are dead in the water these days. Only good piston twins are the new ones which are only useful as luxury items if you are lucky enough to afford one. Even then if I had the cash to splash a low time second hand turboprop would probably be cheaper than a new Baron, with a lot more bang for the buck per mile.

Nail on the head

They are not dead in the water for what they are per se. Seat for seat nothing can do ad-hoc charter as cost effectively as a PA31 can. They are perceived to be dead in the water because they were the backbone of the industry, an industry that is very well dying. The OP is merely highlighting another stab wound.

Let's be perfectly honest. That is spoken with the bias of a pilot. What is going to be a better business decision? You'll suggest something that involves tying up more capital, that costs more to operate resulting more in more expensive quotes which will turn more jobs away than it attracts.

The sooner we get rid of these old piston twins the sooner the industry will start to turnaround. A number of ga charter and rpt operators are doing just this and the tide is turning. Even the last chieftain off the production line will be around 32 years old this year.
I must say I am little biased however, there has always been something strange about chieftain/navajo-only charter operators.

I'm sorry. There is just no substance behind this statement. As I alluded to before, how is an industry which is already crippled by costs brought on by the regulator going to turn around simply because businesses buy new Caravans? Hell, You can't even just go an do IFR charter in them for some silly reason.

I agree CASA adds unnecessary costs to a already struggling industry, however I'd say over half if not more of GA operators need to have a hard look at themselves as the source of the problem. Particularly rpt operators who think they can still get away with putting paying public on old tired piston twins. However, I agree you need capital to change it, just like any other business in any other industry.

I don't know of any RPT guys "putting paying passengers in tired old twins"....If you look around, charter GA guys are moving to Caravans and King Airs. Smaller GA guys are still operating pistons, but they are generally not RPT.

We also have to look at how much a company is willing to pay for a charter. LCC RPT has led the general public to believe that $50 is a perfectly acceptable price for a flight Melbourne to Sydney, and therefore anyone who charges $200 for a 30 minute scenic is a complete rip off merchant. Only the government can afford to pay $8k for a Conquest charter YPAD / YPAG / YPAD, as reported in the weekend papers.

And if piston twins are so tired and old, why is the thread-starter trying to import one? Why doesn't he / she go straight to the turbines that we apparently should all be flying - could it be because turbines are expensive bits of kit to buy and to operate (particularly with our regulators assistance) which is why GA are still using pistons?

Yes here in Australia we shall remain a couple of decades behind the rest of the developed world with our infinite wisdom, that includes the regulator.