Comments / Assistance for Grass RWS Op's Please
 

Local council are trying to stop RWS ops - Have been using this grass safely for 30 years . Don't know why it is suddenly an issue ?


I know a lot of other airports with grass RWS that councils are happy to accommodate - Really don't see the problem


Any suggestions or comments please ?

Likewise grass runways that were used by various aircraft from C152 through cabin class twins was deemed to be unsafe by a local council, funny that CASA had no problems with said grass runways.

Apparently council consultant deemed they were an OH&S issue!

Funny any these days of airport security, ASIC cards and fluoro vests, some airports allow car clubs to use the airfield for events such as time trails etc!

Much easier to land a tail skid fitted Tiger Moth on a grass strip.

Thanks all .


I have operated J3 cubs - Tiger Moths - Decathlon and Pitts S2A from this spot for a long time ( 30 years ) and now it suddenly becomes an issue ?
Very strange ? Especially when so many other airports happily have RWS ops .


It stems from one council employee who is not a pilot trying to make a stand and issuing a NOTAM - Is this what we should expect at other airports in the future ?

Where is this?

Grass is...
 

Better for taildraggers all round.:ok:

Time to tell these non experts to FOXTROT OSCAR !!:ok::ok:

And to advise the Council that plonker is making it LESS safe and that grass landings will continue in the interests of safety.....which is the prime consideration with airport ops.

AND the PIC decides regarding the landing...NOT a non aviating OH&S tosser.

Time to wave the Eureka flag and show the baseball bat.:ok:

Ah yes, the over zealous non pilot public servant trying to justify their position. Nevermind the fact that grass ops/RWS OPS is perfectly safe and has been conducted for decades, it doesn't fit with their understanding of some obscure definition and all hell breaks loose. Seen it at a few places now.

May I ask where? If it's nearby I'll have to cross it off the list of places to drop in and pick up gas/go for the $100 hamburger.

j3

No!
Just continue to use the grass strip...
No doubt they'll eventually make it unusable, but until then....

If you think local governments and their airfields are difficult to deal with, try it with mining companies.

The problem is the way we have followed the Yanks with litigation for every scratch, ding or dent on our persons or property.
Local Councils often don't have a resident expert who knows enough about grass runways and whether the surface remains safe after heavy rain, or when it has not been cut for so long, etc. So the soft cock option is simply to opt out.
This attitude is everywhere. Try asking the NSW coast guard whether conditions are suitable to cross a river bar. The operator may waffle with a caution about the possibility of breaking waves etc but he/she will never say yes or no. The best you could get is that a 50 foot trawler just made it without reported incident. But even that much information is unlikely because it could induce you to thinking it is OK for your tinny.
Hypothetically, suppose the airport published a standing NOTAM stating that the condition of the grass was not monitored and pilots used at their own risk. Along comes some cashed up bogan/doctor/lawyer in his shiny new plastic fantastic. On landing the nose wheel drops into a rabbit hole and the whole shebang inverts, killing the passenger and mutilating the pilot. Who ya gonna sue? 'At your own risk' is a meaningless caution in law, it seems.
The authorities who run public services are not to blame - the law makers are. And the unwashed public because so many won't accept the consequences of their own actions.

Well said. A comment that is only too true.:ok:

I think it's more the threat than the actual prosecution of action, but whatever it is, we sure have become 'risk averse'!

QD - It Is the once user friendly airport at Hervey Bay

Capt Fathom ....They cant make it unusable - It is the RWS and must comply with MOS 139 .... therefore must be smooth and free of obstacles.
They have issued a NOTAM though saying aircraft movements are restricted to " prepared surfaces " - I can't find a definition of " prepared surface " and when I asked for clarification was told it was in the CASR'S and AIP and I need further info to call CASA ? - Still cant find it tho - even emailed Air Services - I think he means sealed surfaces ? ?

Mach E
The resident experts used to be local pilots that had a fair idea of what they are doing - Now the expert isn't even a pilot ?

Bankstown airport is on the verge of being closed by Development sharks.
You sure your grass runway is not converted by a developer?
Seems Minister Truss is open to any offer by development sharks ( for the right donations to party funds of course)

3dextra,

Why don't you become the local expert? Collect all the data about grass strips, and present it to the council.
Ring the council and ask to speak to the person in charge of insurance and get the documentation regarding their legal worries. Deal in facts, not hearsay.

The only way to 'beat' them is to do the leg work and give them a solution. The council would prefer to take the easy route and stop grass strip ops because they don't have a vested interest in it.

Take it on yourself and give the council the answer you want.

Thanks - Have been doing as you suggested , but they are digging heels in and putting heads further in the sand - as well as moving the goal posts -


There are always more wild statements trying to baffle us with B/S which would be intended as a smoke screen to throw us off - but its far from over

Good to hear you're giving it a go. The aviation community needs peylike you to fight the going fight. We can't let 'them' destroy our aviation infrastructure any more.

Good luck. Sorry I can't offer much more than best wishes. :ok:

The issue here - and in many places - is explained if you think from the public servant's perspective.

If you as a public servant don't screw up, you can plan for retirement (or at worst a big payout). If you do your job 200% better than the guy next to you, you get no reward. There is no incentive to increase productivity.

If a public servant can see the slightest bit of risk in being sued if an aircraft comes a cropper on a grass strip, then he'll try and stop it. What's in it for him to let it happen? 10,000 happy grass takeoff/landings a year won't see him retire ritcher. The threat of legal action from the one cockup might see him passed over for the next level up promotion or axed and retire a lot poorer.

It's the system we have. Those working in the government have no incentive to let these things happen, and indeed have an incentive to NOT let them happen. :ugh:

Governments fly from risk in anyway they can. There's no reward in it for them.