What makes a jet need 2 pilots
 

A long time ago the first Citations required 2 pilots, then the SP version came out. At that time you needed 2 pilots on anything above 12,500 lbs and an ATP. Then came dispensations and a single pilot could tootle along at the blistering speed of 330 kts.

Now we have Cj4's and Phenom 300's at FL450 doing 450Kts with PPL's as SP PIC. These aircraft top out at nearly 18,000 lbs. Yet a Lear 45 at the same weight and speed need 2 crew.

Obviously avionics these days from Garmin, Collins and Honeywell must look like something out of Star Wars to a 1950/60 pilot, auto flight systems, auto throttles, Huds etc. Even the number of switches has reduced to few dozen at most in the G5000 system.

Could the single pilot idea climb to even higher weights, maybe to the Citation 10/ Lear 85 weight around 37,000 lbs or maybe even higher. It seems speed is not the issue, systems are getting more and more simpler to operate, autopilots are ever more capable, synthetic vision and moving maps have done wonders for SA.

So is it the weight that makes an aircraft unsuitable for single pilot ops. I'm not arguing for or against single pilot ops, just considering the practicality of it. Would be interested to hear from anyone who has flown the same type both SP and as a crew in regards to workload etc.

In private ops nowadays it really all comes down to the manufacturer convincing the FAA (in most cases) during the certification process that the workload is low enough for a single pilot to handle, that the cockpit is laid out in such a way that all of the controls are going to be accessible to a single pilot, systems like FMS don't require too much heads-down time etc.

Shhhhhhhhh don't mention such things will ya, the boffins in charge of the asylum (CEO's) will push for SP Ops even on an A380.....so mums the word to keep the boys in the jobs:ok:

But having said that what 'brunner' said as well as redundancy, driver wise. There's Airliners being flown SP all over the world daily even with 2 up front:-) Who would be keen enuf to step aboard say an A320 with only one driver?.....very few I'd say.


Wmk2

The AFM ..............:ok:

What makes a jet need 2 pilots

Boredom......;)

Number of Pilots = 1 / complexity of coffee machine

Regardless of single pilot certification requirements and cost savings involved, there is always the suspicion in most pilots minds that if they personally were to be a passenger on such aircraft, they would prefer to have two experienced pilots in the cockpit rather than just one man/woman. Sure, many airlines are happy to crew big jets with one experienced captain and his apprentice just out of flying school. The passengers wouldn't have a clue who is up front but presume they are grizzled veterans. Something about where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise.

On a dark and stormy night it is no fun flying single pilot IFR - even with the most sophisticated electronics. That is when you need two up front to check on each other and even practice your CRM:ok:

Would have thought that the cost of 2 X crew in relation to the leasing/running etc cost of a Biz Jet would be insignificant.

Seriously, if someone wants to travel in a SP BIZ JET, they probably can't afford afford one and should just buy a ticket like the rest of the world.

Sure most aircraft could be flown single pilot. As someone who flies single pilot, if for nothing else, a second set of eyes is a great thing to have! :ok:

A lot of the appeal in single pilot bizjet ops is with the fairly well-off blokes who want to fly themselves around.

I've been told that the higher insurance premium in single pilot ops often costs more than a second pilot does anyway.

Not yet mentioned, is the need for two people to deal with the aftermath of an emergency. One person to fly, one person to sort out the systems & abnormal checklists.

The automatics which make SP IFR ops possible in normal operation are likely to be in an unknown state - perhaps operative after checking, or perhaps completely unusable.

When I was flying busjets the wealthy charter clients mostly required 2 drivers on their life insurance policies

If one pilot has a dizzy spell the other pilot is there to take over.

I was having a dizzy spell when I signed up for flight training

I had one too the first time I pulled my chequebook out at the flying school :E

Heh, there's even a big biplane that needs two pilots according to the flight manual. ...except when its doing ag op's. :cool:









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Thanks for the input guys, the comment on the state of the automatic systems is one aspect I hadn't thought of. I wasn't originally going with the angle of whether 2 pilots is better, of course it is wonderful to have an extra set of eyes, hands etc. My mrs, while not a pilot is quite adept at looking after charts and generally keeping an eye on me and keeping me on the straight and narrow, spotting traffic, writing down clearances, tuning radios navaids etc.

I've only had an hr in the right seat of a new Citation Mustang and it does seem the workload is way lower than an old Baron/310/Seminole with steam gauges, even with the Mustang being twice as fast. The new Garmin kit is bloody wonderful. Partners who fly often with their spouse should have enough training to get an aircraft on the ground should something medically happen to the PIC.

Comments about weather etc are moot, while I'm qualified and experienced IFR, when flying for personal reasons, if the weather is hard IFR, we stay another day by the pool or in the pub. That's the best part of private flying, you don't have to go when the weather is bad. This seems to be quite common with the Mustang owners I have spoken to.

Four on the flight deck - those were the days. Get airborne, into the cruise and put your feet up down the back to let your number 1 contemplate the solitude of command.

The solitude of command. Now I like that phrase. Except nowadays if you had four on the flight deck the chattering of all four doing their CRM stuff and fighting over areas of responsibility, and who is doing ICUS on HIS leg, would drive you bloody nuts.

It's like everything we do in life, it's all about risk, calculated risk.
The complexity of modern Airliners is getting more in some ways yet less in dealing with it. Black cockpit, redundancy's less is more etc all make for a low workload when normal Ops & moderate yet acceptable work load when non NO Ops. Look at QF32, had that happened in the future with one driver at the helm then that could very well have been the end.

Also it's like why have multi-engined planes? I mean the power output of the biggest engine today is well over 100000lbs thrust, more than enough to propel 250 sets thru the air but we don't allow it, too risky too dangerous just like SP Ops in modern day Airliners.


Where does the future lie?............pilot-less A/C, it'll happen am sure but not in our time:-)


Wmk2

How good is the average pilot?
Military fast jets have one pilot, but there aren't many that good.
I have instructed future airline pilots. I could only recommend about a quarter of them for single pilot ops.
It's not just about passing checkrides on any given day; a single crew member has to not make significant mistakes (and not notice them him/herself) ever - their entire career.

Something that is not considered in certification of single pilot jet operations is the matter of currency. The jet sales people tend to gloss over this vital aspect of owner-driver flying.
A commercial pilot flying a complex aircraft on an almost daily basis is less likely to get into trouble than a PPL with not much prior IFR time doing the same thing maybe once a month.
As someone observed, a new Mustang is way more user friendly than an old Baron, but if you fly any fairly fast aircraft 50 hours a year and that's the sum total of your flying, unless you have plenty of prior relevant experience, you are likely to struggle. Three approaches in 90 days barely covers it if that's all you do.
And put all your faith in the automatics at your peril. Modern automatics rarely fail, but when they do they always choose the worst possible moment.

A turboprop requires two pilots
 

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2 Pilots
 

I know someone mentioned this before, but I will delve into it a bit more.

Despite the CRM, one pilot checking another, two sets of eyes (which are all vital parts), its the pilot incapaciation which is an issue.

Whilst it hasnt happened to me (touch wood), pilot incapacitation is a very real thing. Its the reason why we cant eat the same meals.

For some hypothetical numbers....how many airliners declared a PAN due to flight crew incapacitation globally last year?

Assuming that these were majority short-medium haul 2 crew ops.....now imagine that they were single pilot ops......a whole lotta big jet crashes.

Eternity, I see you point but I think you might be stretching the truth a little. I wonder how many of the incapacitations to which you refer, involved pilots who had a medical that was endorsed with the proviso 'multi crew only / safety pilot required.' The medical requirements for SP IFR operations are more stringent. While not excluding the possibility of an incapacitation, the stricter medical requirements make it difficult to make an apples with apples comparison here. How many pilots flying an airliner around can't hire a Warrior on the weekend by themselves? We'll never know.

It all comes back to the dollars. It has a cousin which gets discussed more often - single engine vs multi engine... Affordable safety... :\

Gee did I just read SE v Multi eng? Now where talkin' as that's right up my alley:-):E
We've covered the main reasons as to why 2 drivers.

Redundancy, pilot incap, 4 eyes are better than two, work load, system complexity, currency,insurance, cost & plain simple too dangerous with just one driver, all revolves around the two key words with flying, COST & safety, typed like that as it's easy to see where the priority lays.

Wmk2

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the majority of pilot incapacitation issues are caused by temporary things like food poisoning, rather than an underlying health issue?

Dr Dre, you are correct, most are due to usually sudden onset of bad food, gastro or flu type illnesses.

Occasionally on very rare occasions someone has a totally out of the blue heart attack etc and just dies right there in the seat.
I remember a few stories where that happened before takeoff over the years. Guy sitting there pre start says something like, " I'm feeling really tired all of a sudden" and a few seconds later, they are gone.
Thankfully That of course is extremely rare.

Most of the other comments re backup, detecting threats/errors, workload levels, recency etc are all true as well.
Most of the time 2 is better than one but of course some recent disasters shows that is not always the case either, the SFO Asiana being a prime example. Again, thankfully, rare events but they could be rarer still.

Big airplanes usually mean longer flights. Are you going to pee in a bottle and sit down the entire 5 or more hour DVT-inducing flight, or call up the attendant to mind the shop while you go back to the can and have a leak? Practicalities.

What makes a jet need two pilots? The willingness of me and my family... and most probably you and yours.... To buy a ticket and get on board.

What makes a jet need 2 pilots
 

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