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-   -   Aerobatics Rating (https://www.pprune.org/pacific-general-aviation-questions/471498-aerobatics-rating.html)

jnicholas 12th Dec 2011 04:38

Aerobatics Rating
 
Hi Guys,
Have done some aero's before in a CT-4B/E as well as the super decathlon.

Wanting to do an official "rating" if possible as my brother would really love to go up and do some for the thrill.

I'm just wondering whether this is an experience thing, or whether it is an official rating that gets a little signed sticker in the front of my logbook? Also, how many hours instruction (approx.) does everyone think it would take in something fairly simple at first? i.e citarbria or Super Decathlon?

Cheers

AMEandCPL 12th Dec 2011 05:49

Why don't you talk to the guy who runs the CT4E. He teaches aeros for a living. You need formal training and an endorsement in your logbook.

jnicholas 12th Dec 2011 06:07

just doing some prelim investigations before i start doing some calling around. Also, the CT4 is 3 hours away so it's not the most convenient

in-cog-nito 12th Dec 2011 06:45

Hi there,

As far as hours go for the training, about 7 to 10 if it is done properly. No sticky label but it is a logbook endorsement like your first solo stamp. The prerequisite is a GFPT.

Have a read of CAAP 155 before and during your training. It covers the human factors and air law stuff you need to know.

The Decaf is a good rocket to do your training in and you get a Tailwheel endo as well.

It is a pity that Matt is too far away from you. Very experienced and a nice bloke too. Highly recommended!

Hope you go ahead with the aeros. It really enhances your handling skills, confidence and gives you a much better appreciation of principles of flight. And its the best fun you will have your pants on!
Cheers,
In-cog

jnicholas 12th Dec 2011 07:35

Thanks for that I will have a read up of those doc's before I kick things off.

It is a shame Matt is so far away, I did some prep work with him before I went on Flight Screening (advanced course = tonnes of aero's!!) for the ADF and it helped like you wouldn't believe! I nailed all aspects of the course and have been fast tracked (was going for ADFA but now been moved to DEO) to OTS with their hopes being for me to end up on the Fast Jets.

So i've really only got 2 months or so to do this and have a bit of fun with it before all the RAAF training starts.

Cheers guys.

Tarq57 12th Dec 2011 08:14

What types are available nearby?
I did mine in a 152. Not a bad aerobatic trainer, in that the lack of power kind of forces you to use the appropriate finesse on the controls, otherwise you end up spending most of the time climbing back up after each manoeuvre.
Fairly tame, probably one of the cheapest options, there are some manoeuvres you can't really do properly, but a good basic trainer.

601 12th Dec 2011 22:08

There is no such thing in CAR/CAOs called "aerobatic" :ugh:

peterc005 13th Dec 2011 00:32

You can get an "aerobatic" endorsement in your log book. You can also get a waiver from CASA to do aerobatics below 3000ft after the initial endorsement.

Contact the Queensland Chapter of the Australian Aerobatic Club:

AACQLD HomePage

Ask for a list of instructors/schools where you can do an aerobatic endorsement.

Joker89 13th Dec 2011 07:12

Just to make it clear, if I'm stamped for loops rolls etc on ct4b I can only do it on that type and need stamps for Any other type I may wish to do aero's in above 3000?

Nicholas, you have a long way to go, don't get ahead of yourself, pilots course is a different beast to fsp but aim for jets if it's what you want.

jnicholas 13th Dec 2011 10:14

I read the CAAP 155 earlier today and recall reading somewhere it says that once endorsed the maneuvers aren't restricted to that aircraft type only, however right now I can't find said reference - I will look harder in the morning.

I don't expect the training process for the RAAF to be easy at all, but I am looking forward to it dearly and can not wait to start doing what I have always had the dream of doing.

MakeItHappenCaptain 13th Dec 2011 12:08

Have a chat to Gerry Dick at Redcliffe behind Bob Tait.

Citabria, Decathlon, very passionate about his aeros and good reputation.:ok:

601 13th Dec 2011 12:55


You can get an "aerobatic" endorsement in your log book.
I am sure a good QC would have a field day if the word "aerobatic" is used in a log book endorsement.

jnicholas 13th Dec 2011 22:35

Hopefully that would go without saying :ugh:

peterc005 14th Dec 2011 09:15

Happened to have my logbook on the desk.

The stamp reads:

"GENERAL FLYING SERVICES" ... "Acrobatic Endorsement"

It lists "Loops, Barrel Rolls, Stall Turns, Spins, Aileron Rolls"

Signed and dated by the Instructor.

There may not be an "aerobatic endorsement", but there is definitely an "acrobatic endorsement".

MakeItHappenCaptain 14th Dec 2011 10:45

Ah...yes, the basic manoeuvres that form aeros (sorry, acros??).
Yes Peter. We get the point.

Jnicholas,
Nowhere in the rules is the approval type specific, but according to CAAP 155, the approval extends to any aircraft with a strong recommendation that a proficiency check be carried out periodically or in a new type, however, upright and inverted spins must be certified separately.

601 14th Dec 2011 10:50


but there is definitely an "acrobatic endorsement".
Just as the CARs and CAOs spell it.

MakeItHappenCaptain 14th Dec 2011 11:01

And yet the CAAP doesn't mention "acrobatic" once.

Gotta love consistency.:rolleyes:

ps, 601 does the QC know where a sample of the stamp wording is that says acrobatic? Can't really see that spelling of a word for the purpose of an activity that has such an obvious meaning would invalidate the approval.:confused:

CAR 262AM para 7d(ii).

Yeah, I'm bored.....can you tell?

metalman2 14th Dec 2011 20:46

I've never actually read the entry in my log book, it says acrobatic, strange that aerobatic is so widely used, any ideas on why the different terms ?

601 14th Dec 2011 21:52


Can't really see that spelling of a word for the purpose of an activity that has such an obvious meaning would invalidate the approval.
I would not bet my left te***icle on it.


CAR 262AM para 7d(ii).
The legal drafting folk cannot read or do not know their own legislation.:ugh:
CAR 2(1) "acrobatic flight"

tail wheel 14th Dec 2011 22:03

aer·o·bat·ics
noun
1. ( used with a plural verb ) stunts performed in flight by an airplane, glider, or the like.

2. ( used with a singular verb ) the art or technique of performing such stunts.

Related forms
aer·o·bat·ic, adjective


ac·ro·bat·ic   
adjective
1. of, pertaining to, or like an acrobat or acrobatics.

2. having the good balance, agility, and coordination of an acrobat.

Curious? I suspect the term "acrobatic" is used due to being an adjective, as in "acrobatic endorsement", whilst "aerobatic" is a noun?

I guess the holder of an acrobatic endorsement is authorised to perform aerobatics?


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