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$165,000 debt and no flying job. Advice?

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$165,000 debt and no flying job. Advice?

Old 25th May 2023, 13:18
  #121 (permalink)  
 
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a few comments. i think HECs (do they still call it that?) / VET is a double edged sword. however i thought that it was a great way to get people who could not afford it to get a CPL. 20 years ago when I looked, there was no such thing and i wondered how on earth people could afford a CPL which was quoted at c.50k-75k at that time. Having VET, one has more options, and the potential for an airline career is more attainable.

Also, VET/HEC (do they still call it that?) indexation is a fair thing - better than forcing a student to take out a student loan. For a long time this indexation was running at 2-3%, and one could get out ahead by simply investing the excess money in the stock market. However the 15% discount was a great incentive to pay it off quickly....

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Old 26th May 2023, 01:47
  #122 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Mach E Avelli
Exactly.

If the OP wants to salvage his dire situation, and if he has any money left at all, he should round up a few mates, hire a C206, throw beer, fishing gear, a tent and swags in the boot and head off on some cost-sharing trips around the bush. If he could find another pilot needing PIC, they could do a combined 50 hours. Each could only log 25 hours as PIC - and none as 'co-pilot' (don't even think about doing that) - but could log the other 25 as observer or supernumerary, not counting it towards total flying hours of course.
Take advantage of the trip to throw a few resume's around during refuel stops. Approaching the chief pilot from airside could be advantageous.
It's only exposure to the real world of GA that's going to help him now.
Appreciate that. I am planning to make a final trip to Darwin, Katherine, Alice and Broome (and maybe a few others). I'll probably base myself in Katherine for longer but was very worried about the crime levels there last time. I spent some time in Katherine and met the Kath Av operator there and in the 2 weeks I was there, the shop windows at the service station were smashed in by Aboriginals and the next door neighbour at the place I stayed was broken into. So it's all good and well for people here to say "base yourself in Alice" or somewhere else but then there's the insane crime levels at some of these places which I've seen first hand. You cannot walk down the main street of Katherine without feeling like you are going to get robbed! Almost all of the shop windows are boarded up in Katherine. It's a dangerous place. When I spent time in Alice Springs, I saw the level of street crime I've never seen before. I had previously been to Alice in 2014. I also spent time in Alice looking for a flying job very recently and you cannot go outside at night. It's too dangerous now! Much of this youth violence is moving north through Katherine and up into Darwin.

In a final note, I rented a car in Darwin to drive out to Jabiru and meet and greet the pilots there and the lady I spoke to who has lived in Darwin all of her life said the crime in Darwin is the worst it has ever been. According to her, this "crime wave" has moved from Alice Springs and the surrounding "communities". So this is an element to the pilot job hunt that nobody has really talked about. I have felt more save walking through the slums in Brazil (2013- years ago!) then hanging around Katherine and Alice.

G
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Old 26th May 2023, 01:51
  #123 (permalink)  
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Just a thought - what about Namibia or Botswana? I haven't searched the forum yet but anyone reading this thread have any experience in breaking that market?
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Old 26th May 2023, 02:06
  #124 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by deja vu
I don't understand. Spend $165,000 that you don't have and then look for advice after.
Well deja vu old chap - if only it was as simplistic and easy as making an asinine comment such as that that.

Grant certainly look into going out to Southern Africa - that has been many the stomping ground - particularly for European wanna be pilots. You can get a years' worth of VFR flying - snow free!

Last edited by CDRW; 26th May 2023 at 03:10.
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Old 26th May 2023, 03:16
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Originally Posted by grant.lebronte
Just a thought - what about Namibia or Botswana? I haven't searched the forum yet but anyone reading this thread have any experience in breaking that market?
I don't know much about flying in Africa, only having been briefly in and out a few times. But from what I saw in Sierra Leone and Nigeria, the crime rate was pretty bad, and whites were seen as targets. It seems we now have a few towns in Australia descended to similar levels.
On the other hand, I had a positive experience in Rwanda, but at the time the place was buzzing with U.N. peace keeping forces. Apparently it's not so safe now.
However, I have met a few pilots who really enjoyed their time in G.A. in Africa, so it can't all be bad. Being such a vast continent with so many different governments and cultures, there must be a few good places.
Research first, not just on these forums, but through various government travel advisories.
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Old 26th May 2023, 03:40
  #126 (permalink)  
 
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Re the crime rates, one of our aircraft used to do a fair bit of remote flying but now itís complicated by the way there are lot of places where you canít leave the aircraft overnight as it will be vandalised, and there is no safe accomodation for the pilots either. Society has completely broken down in some places now.
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Old 26th May 2023, 03:54
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I'm not sure comparing Sierra Leone problems with Australia will get you much draw. Having your wallet or car stolen is a far way from being murdered with a machete for going down the wrong road. Or being shot and your car stolen just for stopping at an intersection at a red light.

In any case I know quite a few that have lived in Africa and survived, some pilots in central to southern Africa had some fun, but witnessed a lot of eye openers. And its not all Antonovs and ageing 60s equipment, some GA over there actually have modern, even new, equipment.
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Old 26th May 2023, 06:07
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one of our aircraft used to do a fair bit of remote flying but now it’s complicated by the way there are lot of places where you can’t leave the aircraft overnight as it will be vandalised, and there is no safe accomodation for the pilots either. Society has completely broken down in some places now
All fixed when we get the "Voice".
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Old 26th May 2023, 06:11
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I donít think anything is going to fix it
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Old 26th May 2023, 06:49
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That is why I quite specific to mention Southern Africa - Not central or West Africa (Kenya would be the exception here), not North Africa.
Botswana, Zambia, Zimbabwe and South Africa would be good stomping grounds to get some good GA experience.
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Old 26th May 2023, 07:44
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Originally Posted by Clare Prop
Re the crime rates, one of our aircraft used to do a fair bit of remote flying but now it’s complicated by the way there are lot of places where you can’t leave the aircraft overnight as it will be vandalised, and there is no safe accomodation for the pilots either. Society has completely broken down in some places now.
A bit off-thread now, but one of the reasons I sold my delightful little Sonex was because I was worried about where I could safely park it while away. Even leaving it overnight at Rottnest would have worried me. There be Bogans at Rotto
I get it that poor people would steal stuff that they could sell. But selling aircraft gear is not so easy, and simply vandalising property for ****s and giggles... a good kicking is what 'the voice' needs to prescribe for this. I'm not holding my breath.
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Old 26th May 2023, 07:53
  #132 (permalink)  
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Best keep away from that subject on this thread, keep on topic!
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Old 27th May 2023, 06:03
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The first job is always the hardest to get. Weíve all been 200 hour CPLs before so I know what youíre going through.

This looks like a good opportunity for you.

https://www.afap.org.au/pilot-jobs/p...3GRADE1,2AND3?

Give it your best shot and good luck.
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Old 28th May 2023, 03:02
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Originally Posted by smiling monkey
The first job is always the hardest to get. Weíve all been 200 hour CPLs before so I know what youíre going through.

This looks like a good opportunity for you.

https://www.afap.org.au/pilot-jobs/p...3GRADE1,2AND3?

Give it your best shot and good luck.
I really appreciate it! I saw this ad only 2 or so days ago! I applied last night. I've come to learn the job market in Australia is really bad (for entry level GA flying jobs). I will head up to the Top End one more time for a few months and study a trade or something on the side. If I have no luck by the end of 2023, I'm going to shoot off to Africa and play the waiting game over there. Maybe Namibia for 3 months on a tourist visa. It appears as though Botswana has a 500 hour TT minima for work permits nowadays. From what I've read, the crime is a lot less in Windhoek (Namibia) than in Alice Springs or Katherine. As mentioned, I played the waiting game in Alice and Katherine and could not leave my hostel at night (too dangerous according to the locals).

Appreciate everyone's input and help. I'll hit the ground running and check-in again in 6 months or so. All the best to everyone!

Grant
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Old 28th May 2023, 03:10
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Have you applied to all the larger flying schools? Even ones like the Rex school in Wagga and other country based colleges. I'm pretty sure all the large schools are struggling for any instructional staff and they generally have the experienced staff to monitor you while a junior instructor.

As for the dangers in central Australia, please try to be sensible. Your biggest fear in Alice is being in a punch up with some drunks who might roll you for your shoes with at most a knife, yes you might be broken into in certain areas and your wallet stolen. Generally while the locals might stare at you and make you feel 'uneasy' your life is not really threatened as of yet. Namibia while relatively safe for an African country most crime is armed holdups with guns as the weapons, and also kidnapping of tourists for hostage demands. Carjackings are still a threat and the police are corrupt and often in on the crime. In most of these countries the people will be friendly and welcoming until they are not, which is usually when you have gone somewhere you should not and then you are already beyond the point of no return, good luck. So until the locals of Australia start carrying around AKs, murdering tourists and killing you for your car at an intersection they will never be anywhere near as dangerous as parts of Africa can be.

Ie going out at night and having rocks thrown at you by some drunk kids does not equal being robbed at gun point or taken hostage.

Go take a holiday in the highlands of PNG, when a bunch of Rascols come out of the bush with Machetes and AKs you will know the difference between dangerous and not, and will need a new set of undies and therapy for the next few years.

Last edited by 43Inches; 28th May 2023 at 03:36.
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Old 28th May 2023, 06:34
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I see a future entry job problem rising with the Government now saying they are going to open the door to bulk Kiwis. Love those Kiwis as I do I see a situation where bulk new NZ CPLs are going to migrate to the land of milk and honey (Australia) as they see it with the view that they all pick up that first job here. It appears that Kiwi land has the same problem as Australia in that too many flight schools are training more CPLs than the system has jobs for.
'Get your CPL and then go across to Australia to pick up that first job and experience' is what they appear to be told.
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Old 28th May 2023, 06:41
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I've worked with a lot of Kiwis that have come to Australia for flying work, pretty sure it's been an open door for a long time, nothing new. A lot went back to work in Kiwi land as soon as they got some experience up and are flying there now.
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Old 28th May 2023, 11:19
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Yep, the Kiwis have been stealing our low end pilot jobs for a solid while now.
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Old 28th May 2023, 12:36
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Yep. TTMRA.
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Old 29th May 2023, 11:06
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a situation where bulk new NZ CPLs are going to migrate to the land of milk and honey (Australia) as they see it with the view that they all pick up that first job here.
The entire country of New Zealand has about the same population as Melbourne alone, so I can't see this a a massive wave.
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