Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > The Pacific: General Aviation & Questions
Reload this Page >

Skippers Aviation Cessna Conquest makes forced landing on highway

Wikiposts
Search
The Pacific: General Aviation & Questions The place for students, instructors and charter guys in Oz, NZ and the rest of Oceania.

Skippers Aviation Cessna Conquest makes forced landing on highway

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 13th Jun 2021, 06:11
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 684
Received 81 Likes on 25 Posts
but I do know there are written procedures to allow it's use in the Garrett engine
ATSB – AO-2013-183 - Investigation into an accident involving an Ayres Thrush TPE331 variant

Fuel
The operator reported that the fuel being used in JAY was a 70/30 blend of diesel and aviation turbine fuel, and included a fuel additive. The manufacturer of the fuel additive advised that the purpose of the additive was to offset the potential adverse effects of using diesel fuel in turbine engines. A fuel sample was taken from the operator’s refuelling equipment and sent to a National Association of Testing Authorities-approved laboratory which reported that the chemical composition was consistent with a predominantly diesel blend. The engine manufacturer advised the ATSB that the TPE331-5-252M engine was not approved to use diesel, nor were they aware of a supplemental type certificate allowing it. They also advised that, in general, running on diesel fuel instead of aviation turbine fuel will lead to:

• Increased carbon build-up on the fuel atomizer and combustor due to the higher distillation end point

• Increased fuel system deposit or gum formation as fuel thermal stability and gum formation are not controlled in diesel fuel

• Decreased altitude relight envelope due to lower volatility

• Poor cold weather starting due to higher fuel viscosity

• Poor cold weather operation due to higher fuel freeze point

• If the diesel was ultra low sulfur diesel it would typically have poor lubricity (unless lubricity additives were added) which could degrade fuel pump life

• If the diesel was high sulfur, it could degrade turbine coatings • Diesel fuel can contain bio-diesel…currently not approved in jet fuel

• Diesel fuel can contain any number of additives which are not approved for aircraft gas turbine engines, and the effect on the engine is unknown

In addition, the engine manufacturer stated that none of their engines were approved to use the fuel additive reported to be in the fuel blend. On 26 May 2014, CASA issued Airworthiness Bulletin 28-0155 relating to the use of diesel fuel.

This bulletin stated that the use of diesel fuel in turbine engines was only acceptable if the fuel was approved by the manufacturer and the fuel conformed to a specification detailed in their approved data.


Diesel Fuel | Civil Aviation Safety Authority (casa.gov.au)

Even though the ATSB found that the engine was producing significant power at impact, and which indicated that the engine was unlikely to have been adversely affected by the use of unapproved fuel, it seems pretty clear that Garrett doesn't approve the use of diesel fuel OR additives in its engines.
SIUYA is offline  
Old 13th Jun 2021, 07:18
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Brisbane, Qld
Posts: 1,370
Received 29 Likes on 15 Posts
Why are we even talking about Diesel engines here?
Ixixly is offline  
Old 13th Jun 2021, 12:07
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: NZ
Posts: 261
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Ixixly
Why are we even talking about Diesel engines here?
Exactly...this is farcical
Dookie on Drums is offline  
Old 14th Jun 2021, 04:34
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N/A
Posts: 5,933
Received 392 Likes on 207 Posts
Why are we even talking about Diesel engines here?
You need to read post #9 by Bend alot. Diesel is legal in some turbine powered aircraft depending on the jurisdiction.
megan is offline  
Old 14th Jun 2021, 05:09
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Enzed
Posts: 2,289
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
We are talking about a turbine engine not a recip diesel engine.

The quote in post 9 by Bendalot is about diesel engines which is of no relevance here.

The effects of water on both engines will be very different. I very much doubt the diesel engine problems Bendalot is worried about are a concern for a turbine engine. For a start there are no injectors in a turbine.
27/09 is offline  
Old 14th Jun 2021, 05:42
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Brisbane, Qld
Posts: 1,370
Received 29 Likes on 15 Posts
Originally Posted by megan
You need to read post #9 by Bend alot. Diesel is legal in some turbine powered aircraft depending on the jurisdiction.
Yeah, but what does diesel have to do with this incident?!?!
Ixixly is offline  
Old 14th Jun 2021, 10:12
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Planet Earth
Age: 55
Posts: 33
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Ixixly
Yeah, but what does diesel have to do with this incident?!?!
Nothing what so ever, except for one poster who tried to show the problems water creates in JetA1 by quoting an article which talked about the problems caused by water in diesel when the diesel is used in reciprocating engine. Chalk and cheese. I fail to see the relevance but apparently someone did.
KeepItStraight is offline  
Old 14th Jun 2021, 11:42
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: FNQ ... It's Permanent!
Posts: 4,290
Received 169 Likes on 86 Posts
Regardless the subject, some posters just love the sound of their own keyboard.
Capt Fathom is online now  
Old 14th Jun 2021, 19:50
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 225
Received 5 Likes on 2 Posts
During the northern winter in the Arctic I know the Twin Otters run on the same diesel as everything else. It is approved for PT6 but I am not sure about the TPE331.
Propstop is offline  
Old 15th Jun 2021, 05:07
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N/A
Posts: 5,933
Received 392 Likes on 207 Posts
Regardless the subject, some posters just love the sound of their own keyboard
A rather ironic statement to make, as is this.
megan is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.