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Chief Pilot package

Old 1st Jun 2021, 22:48
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Chief Pilot package

Hi all, if there is anyone operating as chief pilot of a small GA piston multi and single IFR/VFR operation could you please share what remuneration package you are on? Mostly charter but with a occasional instruction as well. PM is fine. Thanks in advance.
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Old 1st Jun 2021, 23:26
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A starting point for your negotiation

Hi Fly,

This would be the starting point for your negotiation with the bosses, but even before that, I would be seeking some guidance from the Union, if you are a member, or an IR lawyer, but I guarantee the AFAP will be the cheapest and more relevant option.

https://www.fwc.gov.au/documents/doc...f/ma000046.pdf

Also, keep seeking out current, or former, CPís of similar operations. It is a role that comes with a lot more responsibility than may be evident at first glance.

Good luck.

Roj
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 00:46
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Expect about 60k for a small operation. Bigger schools with new twins and foreign students low 100s.

Many have been in the roles for a long time. I see the younger ones coming through donít last the distance in such jobs. As mentioned above, many things to juggle.
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 06:52
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Originally Posted by PoppaJo View Post
Expect about 60k for a small operation. Bigger schools with new twins and foreign students low 100s.

Many have been in the roles for a long time. I see the younger ones coming through donít last the distance in such jobs. As mentioned above, many things to juggle.
$60k? Are you kidding?! For the responsibility at hand, thatís pathetic. Youíd earn about that as a normal line driver these days.
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 07:24
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Originally Posted by morno View Post
$60k? Are you kidding?! For the responsibility at hand, thatís pathetic. Youíd earn about that as a normal line driver these days.
Which is why turnover is so high for young GA pilots. The average house price in Melbourne and Sydney is now $1 million. I know some GA pilots up north who actually have had job offers down south, and they could not actually go because the low ball salary on offer, they actually could not survive after the rent is paid! They went to PNG instead.

Whilst I actually enjoyed my stint in that level job many moons ago compared to my current job at the other end of the scale which is just miserable shit, unfortunately for bills, mortgage, kids, more bills, Iíd love to stay around but I need to sort of survive...
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 08:39
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Paying towards the lower end of the scale indicates a stepping stone job for a younger pilot who will move on as soon as things pick up. Paying towards the upper end should get you a career GA pilot with a reasonable experience level. Offer enough and you could poach someone already employed by another operator in a similar role which should get you an easy approval from CASA.

Location counts as well, easier to get someone if they donít have to move to Horn Island or rural NT.

Profit share or a decent annual bonus helps to lock someone in.

With the current situation it might be worthwhile looking at laid off airline pilots in their late 50s who probably wonít get back on a flight deck, particularly if they have a GA background or check and training experience.
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 08:55
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I know of a few ex airline pilots in their 50s and beyond who would happily take a 60K CP job with good GA operator.

COVID has presented a reality check for most of the old buggers - me included! The smart ones will survive and prosper, the procrastinators and reminiscers will quietly drift away un-noticedÖ

The new rules will kill the old timers if they arenít smart enough!

Last edited by Duck Pilot; 2nd Jun 2021 at 09:10.
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 19:24
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Thanks for the replies and messages everyone.
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Old 2nd Jun 2021, 20:30
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Did anyone actually click the above link and read the award?

$60k minimum for a chief pilot of a single/multi operation with training involved will be below the award.

The industry will never crawl out of such fiscally abusive relationships when such behavior is displayed.
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Old 3rd Jun 2021, 08:48
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Originally Posted by t_cas View Post
Did anyone actually click the above link and read the award?
$60k minimum for a chief pilot of a single/multi operation with training involved will be below the award.
I believe "about 60k" was the figure mentioned.

For a chief pilot, some instruction, flying small singles and multis, the figure I calculated based on award wages and additions was $61.6k.

I don't agree with the award, but that's aviation.
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Old 3rd Jun 2021, 12:23
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Assuming your operation's largest type is Baron or PA31, the number in the award is currently $66,323.

I have to laugh at "Profit share". Even the big RTO schools are struggling at the moment.

Best of luck with it. Despite talk of economic recovery, there is precious little Charter happening on the East Coast and most of the schools I know of are struggling.
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Old 3rd Jun 2021, 12:40
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There are many less stressful and local jobs pulling north of $60k.

It is simply not worth the risk.
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Old 3rd Jun 2021, 14:06
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Originally Posted by Duck Pilot View Post
I know of a few ex airline pilots in their 50s and beyond who would happily take a 60K CP job with good GA operator.

COVID has presented a reality check for most of the old buggers - me included! The smart ones will survive and prosper, the procrastinators and reminiscers will quietly drift away un-noticedÖ

The new rules will kill the old timers if they arenít smart enough!
.

Give up flying. Drive trains. Itís so much better. Iím sorry I did not do it 15 years ago.
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Old 3rd Jun 2021, 22:43
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Unless it is a squeaky clean operation and well-funded with good support from the CEO, avoid any CP post like the pox. As CP you become the fall guy with CASA any time there is non compliance or an incident.
Once you come to CASAís attention...well, no need for me to elaborate.
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Old 4th Jun 2021, 08:54
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CP salary.

Surely if the average wage in Australia is $90,000 per annum.

if you read the regs for the responsibilities, and the repeated use of the words, you will ďensure......Ē

And you accept that every flight that goes out, may result in you tragically coming before a court, and justifying every aspect of your operation,

and you appreciate that when it turns to shit almost every bodies interest is that you are the fall guy/gal.

And you answer to a regulator that may not be well intentioned.

And you will not be working 9 to 5 Monday to Friday, and most likely not a 38 hour week.

And you wonít get to take holidays when it suits you.

and you operate in a complex regulatory environment with unparalleled levels of responsibility and accountability

and....... well you get the point.

Common sense says you wouldnít get of bed for less than an average Australian salary

so i suggest discussions start at that!
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Old 4th Jun 2021, 08:56
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Or

Work at CASA if your competent and well intentioned. somewhere around $170,000 per annum as an FOI
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Old 4th Jun 2021, 10:34
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Originally Posted by glenb View Post
Work at CASA if your competent and well intentioned. somewhere around $170,000 per annum as an FOI
Administer the punishment for alleged non compliance with any reason you can get away with, without any riskÖÖ..allegedly.

agree button for these last comments.
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Old 4th Jun 2021, 13:47
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Thatís why........

competent and well intentioned is so important
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Old 5th Jun 2021, 09:52
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Ah yes, however what are CASA Inspectors exactly competent in?

Your average FOI certainly is not competent with regards to flying currency? 39 hours a year doesnít cut the mustard, and thatís if they are lucky enough to even get half of that!

I hoped the Cessna 441 accident with an excellent FOI in the back would have been a significant turning point for CASA to change their attitude/policies. Obviously notÖ.
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