BNA/MNG SFIS info

[le Pingouin]

Oh so you're happy if someone else pays? That makes anything affordable. Looks like you'll just have to stick with Edwardian aviation.

[Dick Smith]

I quite like the idea of spreading the cost over those who benefit.

Le Ping. I can afford these upgrades but there are many who can’t and will simply leave aviation. It’s been happening for years.

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

class E to low level so the ATCs would be separating aircraft that were in IMC.

But in reality, in Australia, they'd be mostly separating aircraft that weren't in IMC.

[missy]

Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was

But in reality, in Australia, they'd be mostly separating aircraft that weren't in IMC.

Why? If they're not in IMC then surely they are visual are then able to self separate.
Is there a reluctance to on behalf of the pilot community (or particular airlines or specific pilots) to report visual? Is this because responsibility for separation would then switch from the ATC to the pilot?

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

If they're not in IMC then surely they are visual are then able to self separate.

Then you don't need E.
Unfortunately, you don't turn airspace classification on and off with the weather.
If it's E, you're getting separated whether in IMC or not. My point is that there is a lot less aircraft in IMC in Aus than in the US.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

AAHH...Dick,
I've told ya a MILLION times NOT to exxagerate so much......
I reckon you would have NOT been flying 'in the 50's'...except in your dreams....just like 'yours truly'.

I have NO 'ordinary' idea of wot 'they' did in the 50's, and I suspect, neither does yerself - March '44 would have been a 'good year' for you??
Perhaps we should all go back to MORSE? - T'would save a LOT of unnecessary chatter.........

AND....Yer 2 cents / litre on fuel was PRECISELY what funded that nasty ole FLIGHT SERVICE thingy....you know, the one you got rid of because you reckoned 'we' cost too much.
It was all about the MONEY..
It was ALWAYS about the MONEY!.
NOW you want a 2 cent levy on fuel to fund WHAT??

Tell 'im 'es dreamin'......

Cheeerrrsss.... and tks again for the...........

[triadic]

We're ATSOs now, providing services in whichever class of airspace we work.

The interesting part of this proposal will be watching the "Controllers" providing what we used to call "Flight Service".....
I suspect the urge to 'control' will be difficult to overcome?

[Dick Smith]

Griffo. I loved Flight Service. Especially Dubbo FS when they would call me a taxi and put in my flight plan.

It was those Airlines who were the problem. They reckoned that GA should pay most of the FS cost because GA got most of the service.

I could see we were not going to have a GA industry if that happened! But we hardly have a GA industry anyway so we may have well kept FS.

But remember the big redundo!

[le Pingouin]

We've been doing so for nearly 25 years - FS literally went from being done by FSOs to being done by ATCs overnight. The large majority of en-route and TMA controllers provide services in class G every day.

[missy]

Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was

Then you don't need E.
Unfortunately, you don't turn airspace classification on and off with the weather.
If it's E, you're getting separated whether in IMC or not. My point is that there is a lot less aircraft in IMC in Aus than in the US.

It's not a change of airspace classification but a change to procedures, a bit like flying a GLS approach vs flying a visual approach, flying an independent visual approach to Sydney vs flying a visual approach, flying PRM approach to Sydney vs flying an ILS approach. They are different procedures in the same airspace classification and are WX / pilot / equipment dependent. Pilot and ATC procedures change to the circumstance.
And, yes, I understood your point regarding the WX in AUS being better than the WX IN USA.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Hey Dick,
I do.....Every Day.......And...... I secretly 'lurve ya' for it...........
(But, I would NEVER NEVER NEVER admit it publicly...................)

BUT......by those days most, or if not ALL of those 'nasty' big aeroplanes - 'AIRLINES' types were 'TURBOS / JETS' and burned AVTUR...??.
As far as I am / was aware, the 2c levy for FS was based on AVGAS.....so the AIRLINES got us for FREE...??

Please correct me if I'm wrong.....

[Lead Balloon]

I think an excise was/is imposed on both Avgas and Jet A1 consumed in Australia. Hence, Jet A1 loaded onto an aircraft about to depart on an international flight was/is not subject to excise. But that's just a cloudy memory. Maybe others with more recent knowledge will correct me if I'm wrong.

There was a bunch of complexity around 'past period franchise fees' charged by states for fuel, tobacco etc, but I don't know whether that applied to Avgas and Jet A1 supplied in a state and, in any event, the High Court in the late 90s finally declared them to be unconstitutional duties of excise because only the Commonwealth has power to charge excise (whereupon the Commonwealth said "thank you very much", imposed its excise instead and pocketed the extra billions, thus contributing further to the vertical fiscal imbalance).

[Capn Bloggs]

Originally Posted by Missy

If they're not in IMC then surely they are visual are then able to self separate.

What is your understanding of "Self-separate", Missy? How do you expect/think it works?

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

Especially Dubbo FS when they would ........ put in my flight plan.

They weren't doing you a favour. That was part of the job. You remember things called Briefing Offices?

[CaptainMidnight]

Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was

They weren't doing you a favour. That was part of the job. You remember things called Briefing Offices?

OT but the closure of the Briefing Offices particularly at the GA main airports e.g. YMMB YPPF YSBK etc. were a great loss to the industry. They were places where one could walk in and ask questions of an ATC or FSO - someone who knew what they were talking about - be educated on regs and procedures, and talk face to face with the MET person.

That loss of an education source is incalculable. Now students and pilots either have to muddle through themselves or ask their instructor, who sadly more often than not these days might not know much more than they.

And yes, instructors too used to come in to ask questions and to clarify things.

[10JQKA]

BNA SFIS begins operations 8am tomorrow.....in lockdown !

[Squawk7700]

If it stops this happening, I’m all for it !!

[Capt Fathom]

Why hide the idents? They need to know.

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

I'm surprised it didn't stop happening very shortly after that screen shot.

[Squawk7700]

Originally Posted by Capt Fathom

Why hide the idents? They need to know.

Believe me… they knew!!