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About Qantas' Project Sunrise and 787-9's range...

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About Qantas' Project Sunrise and 787-9's range...

Old 22nd Oct 2019, 07:13
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About Qantas' Project Sunrise and 787-9's range...

Hi guys its my first time posting and I really wanna know the answer to this:

So Qantas are now doing this Project Sunrise which is basically having direct flights between SYD and JFK/LHR. They just completed their trial flight from JFK to SYD two days ago with 787-9. So I googled the distance from JFK to SYD, which is 16,003 km. But the problem is the range for a 787-9 is 14,800 km??? How is the flight possible then??

Thank you so much for whoever that can answer me this. Much appreciated
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Old 22nd Oct 2019, 11:56
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Ya need to Google: Coriolis force.
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Old 22nd Oct 2019, 21:31
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The effective range of the aircraft depends on the amount of fuel loaded, vs the total mass of the aircraft. For this flight the mass of freight (human bodies plus baggage) was limited. A very large amount of fuel was loaded, comprising a larger proportion of the take off weight.

I read that all the passengers were accommodated in business class, which is at the front of the aircraft. So I wondered if their baggage was loaded to the rear of the cargo hold, to keep the center of gravity in the optimum location. The high fuel load would affect CofG as well.

Having an optimum CofG would presumably make the aircraft more efficient, by requiring less trim elevator input, so maybe there was some juggling of mass distribution as well.
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Old 22nd Oct 2019, 22:36
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I guess the stated 14,800km range is based on filling most of the 280 seats with passengers.
The Qantas flight took only 50 passengers, and so could take more fuel to squeeze out more range.
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Old 22nd Oct 2019, 23:50
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That is why it was capped at 49 passengers and the pilots spent the flight ‘changing routes and levels’ to optimise fuel burn. That is according to the press release, I seem to remember about 15 years ago BA did a direct Sydney - LHR just to show they could, I think it had a couple of Royals onboard.
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Old 23rd Oct 2019, 00:58
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BA B777-200ER did Brussels direct Melbourne with Tony Blair onboard for the 2006 Commonwealth Games.
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Old 23rd Oct 2019, 03:23
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Cheers, that would have been it :-)

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...els-to-205768/

Last edited by Ollie Onion; 23rd Oct 2019 at 03:26. Reason: add link
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Old 23rd Oct 2019, 04:39
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Old 23rd Oct 2019, 22:41
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OR..........VH-XFE Airbus A330-243

VH-XFE Toulouse to Melbourne 20 hours and 35 minutes. on 18 June 2012


Distance from London to Sydney 16,983 km
Distance from Toulouse to Melbourne 16,889 km
Distance from Brussels to Melbourne 16,605 km
Distance from New York to Sydney 15,979 km

Last edited by ad-astra; 23rd Oct 2019 at 22:52.
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Old 24th Oct 2019, 00:48
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How soon we forget.......

OJA - London to Sydney in August 1989 for a total flight time of 20hrs and 9 minutes at a total flight distance of 18,012km

...................... or are we still not allowed to mention 1989
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Old 24th Oct 2019, 00:49
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In 1993, Airbus flew an A340-200 Paris-Auckland-Paris, flying eastbound. That was to counter the Boeing/Qantas London to Sydney effort!
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Old 24th Oct 2019, 02:19
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Typical...!!!


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Old 24th Oct 2019, 04:21
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From the HARs site regarding VH-OAJ

Stall Speed (clean, max takeoff weight): 205 kt
Typical Climbout Speed: 180 to 190 kt
Cruising speed: Mach 0.84 to 0.86 – about 500 kt / 933 km/h (at optimum cruise altitude)
Typical Landing Speed: 140 kt
Is that stall speed correct?
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Old 24th Oct 2019, 04:48
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Originally Posted by 601 View Post
From the HARs site regarding VH-OAJ
Is that stall speed correct?
From my reading of the graph, it should be 206 knots. So, yes, close enough.
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Old 24th Oct 2019, 06:37
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JFK-SYD is well over the Boeing website range for the 789. 8,646 nm vs. 7530 nm. Is the max range they give based on MTOW?

What airframe could Boeing offer to deliver consistently reliable Syd-JFK and return operability with a commercial load? The 777-8 range is quoted by Boeing at 8,750 nm which is just over the Great Circle distance, but what are the air miles flown? Surely you'd need more range than just the Great Circle distance? And that's on paper anyway - fuel consumption might be worse with a plastic rather than paper aeroplane.

AB is quoting 8,700 nm range for the A350-1000. A strategically-chosen number?
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Old 24th Oct 2019, 08:29
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Originally Posted by ad-astra View Post
OR..........VH-XFE Airbus A330-243

VH-XFE Toulouse to Melbourne 20 hours and 35 minutes. on 18 June 2012

At least some of the Qantas A330-200s ferried to Melbourne direct well before 2012
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