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Light aircraft crash Leigh Creek

Old 11th Jul 2019, 22:06
  #121 (permalink)  
 
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With the amount of sunshine we're getting, wouldn't fluorescent lights or even paint be an acceptable backup to PAL units in remote airstrips?
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Old 11th Jul 2019, 23:17
  #122 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Okihara View Post
With the amount of sunshine we're getting, wouldn't fluorescent lights or even paint be an acceptable backup to PAL units in remote airstrips?

RWY lights are not only for the illumination of the physical location and dimension of the Rwy they are there so the pilot can position themselves in the circuit to complete the various legs of a circuit, reflective lights are of no use unless lights are shone directly on the paint. In order to define the Rwy edge with reflective paint or other medium one would need very powerful landing lights, then there is the manuvering area that also needs to be illuminated.
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Old 11th Jul 2019, 23:21
  #123 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by YPJT View Post
There are basically two methods which ERSA describes in a very long winded way. Where a PAL is on the same frequency as the CTAF it is one second on, one second off. When the PAL is on its own frequency it is normally 3 seconds on and 1 second off.
As I alluded to earlier, what can be really stressful even if you are sure that you are keying the correct tx sequence is that no confirmation message is being transmitted from the unit. Not fun flying to a location in the dark and not knowing if you have lights until you're visual with the field. Leigh Creek has one such unit. The only saving grace being that there is a flashing beacon that is visible for quite a ways out on a clear night. From memory though, the flashing (rotation) interval on the beacon is not as per the published 6 seconds. Might be time for a bit of maintenance of the system out there.
YLEC lights work best when you do it this way: (key mic) count one and two and three and (release mic) count off and two and three and, then repeat twice more.

From memory that beacon flash is 9 seconds. As far as a bit of maintenance on the system then perhaps you should contact the aerodrome owners (Outback Areas) & voice your concerns. If enough people complain (especially RFDS pilots) then maybe something will get done.

I had a phone call from one member of Outback Areas a few days ago who was checking up on how I was feeling after Saturday night, & in the course of our conversation I mentioned about my husband going out there & doing roo runs before the RFDS aircraft landed at night. He didn't see why that was necessary, until I told him how many roos hubby had chased off in just one night alone - he gave up counting after 30!

DF.

DF.
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 00:23
  #124 (permalink)  
 
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As YPJT said, ERSA says the beacon flashes at 6 second intervals, not 9. Potentially confusing.

I was going to observe that if infrastructure investment is a good way to stimulate the economy, I can nominate a thousand or so aerodromes that are crying out for maintenance and upgrade. But then I reflected on the fact that a bit of fog at Sydney still creates chaos across almost the entirety of the airways, and that if Australia lacks the smarts and capacity to upgrade a capital city airport to first world standards itís no wonder that so many aerodromes are in the condition they are.
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 03:02
  #125 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sunfish View Post
To put that another way, I do not consider my training as a GA pilot makes me somehow safer than a similarly motivated RAA pilot.
I was originally an RAA pilot, and now am GA/GFA only.

My training as a GA pilot does make me safer - I've done NVFR and PIFR training. What RAA pilot does those?
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 04:09
  #126 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by outlandishoutlanding View Post
I was originally an RAA pilot, and now am GA/GFA only.

My training as a GA pilot does make me safer - I've done NVFR and PIFR training. What RAA pilot does those?
Plenty!

Because many do the reverse of what you did. Raaus is full of ex-airline and commercial pilots.
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 04:33
  #127 (permalink)  
 
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Does the Brumby have an artificial horizon? Although these are VFR aircraft it is certainly wise for pilots to be familiar with whatever blind flying instruments are installed in case they are suddenly needed.
While some LSA have quite sophisticated Garmin type EFIS, there may be a tendency for pilots to be experts at dialing in GPS and other you beaut-features, but no clues on basic instrument flying skills.
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 05:49
  #128 (permalink)  
 
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If you have an EFIS then for about another 2kg. you have a pretty good autopilot
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 06:18
  #129 (permalink)  
 
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Thats a broad brush statement.Im a retired airline pilot with 23,000 hours and fly RAA.Quite a few of us do for all sorts of reasons.
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Old 12th Jul 2019, 06:45
  #130 (permalink)  
 
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I fly RA but not GA and regularly get the attitude out and about. According to the GA Pilots I am some inexperienced dangerous some nobody pilot. The young flight instructors are usually the worst, totally cocky. Until I let them know Iíve got 20,000 Airbus hours and growing. They usually pipe down at that point.

Last edited by PoppaJo; 12th Jul 2019 at 10:09.
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 05:18
  #131 (permalink)  
 
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PoppaJo, having 20,000 Airbus does not make one a good GA Pilot just as having 20,000hours GA wouldn't make one a good Airbus pilot
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 06:47
  #132 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Centaurus View Post
Does the Brumby have an artificial horizon? Although these are VFR aircraft it is certainly wise for pilots to be familiar with whatever blind flying instruments are installed in case they are suddenly needed.
While some LSA have quite sophisticated Garmin type EFIS, there may be a tendency for pilots to be experts at dialing in GPS and other you beaut-features, but no clues on basic instrument flying skills.
It depends on how the aircraft is customised. A few are steam with no attitude, but most of those that I've seen are EFIS equipped. Some have really good stuff too. But, the problem with the RAAus system is that there is no requirement for any IF. That doesn't stop CFIs with GA quals from doing some real life IF with their students, particularly when they get up to cross-country training. With a Dynon EFIS, and analog basics around it, my Brumby 610 allows for some reasonable 'IF' exposure. If students have been trained from scratch in attitude x power flying, and it's well correlated to the instrument presentation, then they are better able to cope with a little basic IF.

My experience has been that, with the above IF exposure, they very easily convert to the RPL IF in a analog C172.
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 07:04
  #133 (permalink)  
 
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An emergency PAL frequency (universal) that simply requires a greater than 2 second transmission to activate would be very handy.

I know of a number of activation issues for a variety of reasons and locations over the years.
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 09:35
  #134 (permalink)  
 
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As they say....' A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing'
The LSA/RAAuS exists to satisfy a need for basic flight, day VMC & works well, mostly. GA is there for a much broader opportunity to fly under more challenging conditions, if needed.
It's a fine line between legal, competent and marginal. It's up to a well trained and disciplined pilot NOT to find out where his skills lie outside of proper training!
Flying IMC or at night especially in the outback takes far more discipline than a jolly in a basic machine during the day for fun!
I truly hope this sad event makes others out there think twice!

Foot note: Many Years ago not long after I obtained my Class IV rating I found myself in an uncomfortable situation at night Sth of YBDV after being unable to land at YINN, had been at the races (don't drink) due a low setting sun and a seriuosly bugged windscreen (no GPS in those days). A missed App meant I had to fly on to YBHI via Moomba. The FS guy stayed back till we landed to make sure we where safel. I was in a well equiped C210 with A/P and legal BUT I did not enjoy it, never flew again in a SE plane NVFR! The poor unfortunate pilot in the Brumby was way over his head most likely. He must have been almost terrified!
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 10:28
  #135 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
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Originally Posted by machtuk View Post
As they say....' A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing'
The LSA/RAAuS exists to satisfy a need for basic flight, day VMC & works well, mostly. GA is there for a much broader opportunity to fly under more challenging conditions, if needed.
It's a fine line between legal, competent and marginal. It's up to a well trained and disciplined pilot NOT to find out where his skills lie outside of proper training!
Flying IMC or at night especially in the outback takes far more discipline than a jolly in a basic machine during the day for fun!
I truly hope this sad event makes others out there think twice!

Foot note: Many Years ago not long after I obtained my Class IV rating I found myself in an uncomfortable situation at night Sth of YBDV after being unable to land at YINN, had been at the races (don't drink) due a low setting sun and a seriuosly bugged windscreen (no GPS in those days). A missed App meant I had to fly on to YBHI via Moomba. The FS guy stayed back till we landed to make sure we where safel. I was in a well equiped C210 with A/P and legal BUT I did not enjoy it, never flew again in a SE plane NVFR! The poor unfortunate pilot in the Brumby was way over his head most likely. He must have been almost terrified!
"Wet Season" endorsements for RA and GA - it often takes both equally.

Would certainly help night flyers, intentional or not.
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 12:07
  #136 (permalink)  
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The poor unfortunate pilot in the Brumby was way over his head most likely. He must have been almost terrified!
Not to mention his poor passenger. I can only imagine what those last few moments would have been like for both of them.

DF.
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Old 13th Jul 2019, 18:36
  #137 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Desert Flower View Post
Not to mention his poor passenger. I can only imagine what those last few moments would have been like for both of them.

DF.
Absolutely.
Then, at the point he completely lost control of the aircraft,- they knew they were about to meet their maker.
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