Get out of aviation now – further important information
Interesting article CT
"In information given to the Senate committee, the agency reported Ms McNaughton had used $19,424 of travel with Qantas between July 1 2017 and May 24, and just $575 with Virgin in the same period. A spokesperson defended the spending based on the flexibility of travelling Qantas between Sydney and Canberra, with the lowest practical fare of the day, departure time, routing and connections also key considerations."
Qantas do run 20 departures on the day I checked compared to 10 for Virgin however there are a number of QF that are 15 mins apart (so we have a very good idea of when people are knocking off) and needing to rely on a certain 15 minutes (for an advanced booking) in aviation is foolish. All 30 are direct flights and almost always Virgin was cheaper.
I wonder how often a free upgrade to bizzy class happens on the 717?
"In information given to the Senate committee, the agency reported Ms McNaughton had used $19,424 of travel with Qantas between July 1 2017 and May 24, and just $575 with Virgin in the same period. A spokesperson defended the spending based on the flexibility of travelling Qantas between Sydney and Canberra, with the lowest practical fare of the day, departure time, routing and connections also key considerations."
Qantas do run 20 departures on the day I checked compared to 10 for Virgin however there are a number of QF that are 15 mins apart (so we have a very good idea of when people are knocking off) and needing to rely on a certain 15 minutes (for an advanced booking) in aviation is foolish. All 30 are direct flights and almost always Virgin was cheaper.
I wonder how often a free upgrade to bizzy class happens on the 717?
However, you (or more properly, your attitude) reminds me of somebody I do know well, who was always of the view, every time a competitor ( or anybody, really) wound up in trouble with CASA --- Serves them right/where there's smoke, there's fire/ favourite appropriate pejorative standard phrase, ---- this went on for years, all holier than thou.
CASA could do no wrong.
Then, guess what, their tame Airworthiness Surveyor retired, and a new one turned up ---- who turned out to be a pedant of the worst kind, with a very imperfect knowledge of the actual regulation, but the ignorance was well supported by "attitude". A list of several hundred NCNs ( as they then were) covering just about every facet of what happens in a hangar --- most nonsense, but given the power of the "delegate" --- of "legal substance".
After costs, losses and dislocation costing close to seven numbers, this small outer urban CAR 30 org. did survive, but only because the proprietor was independently wealthy.
The examples of CASA buggery that informed the Forsyth Report were not the whinging of a few incompetent operators, and were not confine to GA.
I do not doubt your management skills, but you have had luck so far with CASA, "compliance" has little to do with it, for your sake, I hope your luck holds out.
If (or more likely when) your CASA luck changes, it will be a searing and life changing experience, psychologically you will never be the same again.
Tootle pip!!
So the only reason I am still here is because of good luck and being holier than thou. OK.
That is not quite what I said, is it ??
As for the "holier than thou" --- that didn't apply to anything but the person I described --- You may or may not be, I don't know, because I don't know you, but you do have little appreciation of the disastrous effects of CASA on many quite reasonably well run businesses --- because it hasn't happened to you. Beware hubris.
I have no doubt your success to date must indicate a smart business person, but that will avail you naught if some CASA aggro. bastard decides to take you apart.
Look up the history of Polar Air, for a prime example of what a determined "aggressive audit" can do, it is all on public record. There are so many like it.
And remember, that financial disaster started because the proprietor refused the demands of the FOI to operate a light twin outside it's certified flight envelope and outside of AFM conditions --- and, of course, CASA backed the FOI,despite his demands being contrary to aviation law, despite the long record of fatal crashes (they are not accidents) in twin training, cause by exactly what the FOI was demanding.
Tootle pip!!
The first thing I thought of after reading it was New Zealand GA which doesn't have these issues.
GA the world over is static or in decline.
Thirty years ago, my mates and I drove around Australia. We stopped and did some joy flights at places such as Wilpena Pound, The Witsundays, Kakadu, Kununurra, Rottnest Island and a few others. There were only one or two operators to chose from at each of those places, not 5 or 10 (if GA was in it's heyday and declining ever since). I imagine there's still only 1 or 2 to choose from now.
Last edited by Traffic_Is_Er_Was; 27th Jan 2019 at 04:22.
What New Zealand has is the topography and tourist appeal to support these services, all contained in an area the size of Victoria. It's not really comparable.
GA the world over is static or in decline.
Thirty years ago, my mates and I drove around Australia. We stopped and did some joy flights at places such as Wilpena Pound, The Witsundays, Kakadu, Kununurra, Rottnest Island and a few others. There were only one or two operators to chose from at each of those places, not 5 or 10 (if GA was in it's heyday and declining ever since). I imagine there's still only 1 or 2 to choose from now.
GA the world over is static or in decline.
Thirty years ago, my mates and I drove around Australia. We stopped and did some joy flights at places such as Wilpena Pound, The Witsundays, Kakadu, Kununurra, Rottnest Island and a few others. There were only one or two operators to chose from at each of those places, not 5 or 10 (if GA was in it's heyday and declining ever since). I imagine there's still only 1 or 2 to choose from now.
Imagine if "RPT" rules did not apply to below 5700 kg or pressurised aircraft.
Selling seats around those areas would be a big increase in GA possibilities. Combined with ground tour options some great tourist packages could be set up.
Arrive Darwin with partner and kid jump on a C208/B200 out to Kakadu, do a trip or two and spend a night or two, then out to a Arnhem Land fishing or hunting spot for a day or a night. Maybe head out to Gove or Groote for a fishing or sailing day, then head off to Batchelor for a Litchfield ground tour, Off to Kunnanara for a cruise then on to Broome. Then a Broome Darwin or a reverse leg.
While that is a long trip even parts of it, on selling seats in the past has proven desired compared to a charter.
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Look GA is all but dead, those trying to hang on in CASA's stifling world me takes me hat off to uze, but it's inevitable, GA will be a thing of the past for Ausraya, just the way it is:-(
Their legal team has sided with me and not their FOI. And it didn’t involve bucketloads of cash to fight it. No more cash than my employment wages already covered, just a little bit of time and effort on our behalf.
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Wow, what an interesting thread. I thought we in the UK had the world championship for whingeing about the decline of GA in the bag. Now I'm not so sure!! And we have much worse weather to contend with.
I flew around a bit in Australia a few years back from Camden and I didn't see much evidence that it was any much worse than here. Cheer up and keep flying. It's quite fun don't you think? At least we don't get parking tickets/ speeding tickets and any equivalent of middle lane drivers in the sky. As for overpriced landing fees and PPR restrictions, we definitely win on that level. I was quoted over £60 for a landing fee at a regional airport recently and then mandatory handling on top... do you have that down your way?
If flying makes you smile, keep doing it and ignore Dick Smith. He may be an awesome bloke but his logic is mental!
I flew around a bit in Australia a few years back from Camden and I didn't see much evidence that it was any much worse than here. Cheer up and keep flying. It's quite fun don't you think? At least we don't get parking tickets/ speeding tickets and any equivalent of middle lane drivers in the sky. As for overpriced landing fees and PPR restrictions, we definitely win on that level. I was quoted over £60 for a landing fee at a regional airport recently and then mandatory handling on top... do you have that down your way?
If flying makes you smile, keep doing it and ignore Dick Smith. He may be an awesome bloke but his logic is mental!
I flew around a bit in Australia a few years back from Camden and I didn't see much evidence that it was any much worse than here. Cheer up and keep flying. It's quite fun don't you think? At least we don't get parking tickets/ speeding tickets and any equivalent of middle lane drivers in the sky. As for overpriced landing fees and PPR restrictions, we definitely win on that level. I was quoted over £60 for a landing fee at a regional airport recently and then mandatory handling on top... do you have that down your way?
If flying makes you smile, keep doing it and ignore Dick Smith. He may be an awesome bloke but his logic is mental!
If flying makes you smile, keep doing it and ignore Dick Smith. He may be an awesome bloke but his logic is mental!
Surprising as it may seem to you, but I deal with UK CAA, and in recent years the reforms seem to have worked for light GA and sports aviation --- and I still have my Campaign Against Aviation CAA t-shirt!!
As for matters of airport charges of all kinds, light GA has been priced out of major airports, and GA related businesses just don't get leases renewed at any price, in favor of shopping centers and warehouses etc.
The latest wheeze is demanding in advance very high minimum insurance levels, and that the aerodrome operator be included as a named covered (whatever the correct term) in advance of gaining PP.
Tootle pip!!
In the deep north of Oz , late 80s/early?,. there was also an anti CAA T shirt produced, limited edition dozen? which sold out in about a week
Excusing the French, but it was The Cunza Against Aviation, being a take on the Hunza a tribal people that do things in life to live long.
The Cunza tribe being the opposite...do regulatory genocide to kill off people, businesses and an Industry..
Maybe for this CFS issue we need another.... Cretins Against Sensible Aviation
Excusing the French, but it was The Cunza Against Aviation, being a take on the Hunza a tribal people that do things in life to live long.
The Cunza tribe being the opposite...do regulatory genocide to kill off people, businesses and an Industry..
Maybe for this CFS issue we need another.... Cretins Against Sensible Aviation
Warnervale Airport is owned by the Central Coast Council. The Central Coast Aero Club (which owns Warnervale Air, the flying school and engineering facility) has nothing to do with the draconian landing fee structure or airfield management.
That is all I can say publicly...
That is all I can say publicly...
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GA dead........not at Cessnock it seems.... Quote, " VISION FOR AIRPORT SOARS" A five year plan for Cessnock airport highlights it's vision to be a viable, user friendly, and vibrant aviation hub in the hunter region. An extended runway, increased power availability, improved water and sewerage, improved development controls and upgraded facilities for the western side of the airport are among the short and long term actions in the plan.
Cessnock mayor Bob Pynsent said the airport was a public asset. " The central location of the airport makes it a fantastic asset and the plan identifies ways to further develop as an aerodrome business hub " he said.
Go to cessnock.nsw.gov.au to view and provide feedback on the plan by 20th february. "unquote.
Pretty amazing from a rusted on Labor council, Show this to your council.
.
Cessnock mayor Bob Pynsent said the airport was a public asset. " The central location of the airport makes it a fantastic asset and the plan identifies ways to further develop as an aerodrome business hub " he said.
Go to cessnock.nsw.gov.au to view and provide feedback on the plan by 20th february. "unquote.
Pretty amazing from a rusted on Labor council, Show this to your council.
.
Thread Starter
I did receive a letter from the Council in relation to this issue. Here is the wording:
So from what I can read from this, whilst they prefer 24 hours’ notice, if you happen to be flying up the coast and want to land and spend some money there, there is a good chance you will be allowed to land! Simply ring the ARO I would presume.
Of course, if the weather is bad, remember “Don’t push it, land it.”
By the way, to land a Cessna Caravan there costs $91.68, so you have been warned!
“Dear Mr Smith
Letter to Mayor Smith: 24 hour notice requirement
Thank you for your email to the Mayor of 24 January 2019 regarding the 24 hour notice requirement for landing approval.
At its meeting held 27 November 2017, Council resolved to support the Warnervale Restrictions Act (WAR Act) 1996. In response, staff have recently implemented a requirement for itinerant aircraft to provide at least 24 hours’ notice prior to wanting to land and/take-off from Warnervale Airport.
Council understands that there are instances where it is not possible to provide 24 hours’ notice and in those cases the request has been accommodated.
Council is aware that pilots are trained to land at any airport in an emergency and legally able to do so. The ERSA entry does not remove this provision but aims to best manage aircraft movements in accordance with the Council resolution and the Warnervale Airport Restrictions Act 1996.”
Letter to Mayor Smith: 24 hour notice requirement
Thank you for your email to the Mayor of 24 January 2019 regarding the 24 hour notice requirement for landing approval.
At its meeting held 27 November 2017, Council resolved to support the Warnervale Restrictions Act (WAR Act) 1996. In response, staff have recently implemented a requirement for itinerant aircraft to provide at least 24 hours’ notice prior to wanting to land and/take-off from Warnervale Airport.
Council understands that there are instances where it is not possible to provide 24 hours’ notice and in those cases the request has been accommodated.
Council is aware that pilots are trained to land at any airport in an emergency and legally able to do so. The ERSA entry does not remove this provision but aims to best manage aircraft movements in accordance with the Council resolution and the Warnervale Airport Restrictions Act 1996.”
Of course, if the weather is bad, remember “Don’t push it, land it.”
By the way, to land a Cessna Caravan there costs $91.68, so you have been warned!
If you read the "Warnervale Airport Restrictions Act 1996" https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/acts/1996-57.pdf it appears it only applies to aircraft operating on runways constructed after 1996. Am I reading that right?
Thread Starter
I despair regarding Warnervale.
An experienced pilot was recently prevented by smoke from heading towards Maitland and was forced to come back and land at Warnervale. Yes the Council made it clear in a letter to me that in times of emergency, people could land without any repercussions, however this is the wording that the pilot was sent after his landing:
Of course, more and more aerodromes will start copying this 24 hour prior notice principle and general aviation will be further destroyed.
What a joke! People wonder why I advise business operators to get out of general aviation before they lose everything.
An experienced pilot was recently prevented by smoke from heading towards Maitland and was forced to come back and land at Warnervale. Yes the Council made it clear in a letter to me that in times of emergency, people could land without any repercussions, however this is the wording that the pilot was sent after his landing:
“No problem, however for future reference, there will not be any short notice approvals even though this was partially due to conditions, this was a once off. The fact that enough time was not allowed for to fly diversion around the smoke before last light will need to be taken into account as no further short notice (less than 24hrs) approvals will be forthcoming.
If we make an exception for one everyone will expect it.”
If we make an exception for one everyone will expect it.”
What a joke! People wonder why I advise business operators to get out of general aviation before they lose everything.
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You are correct! They absolutely do wonder why.
Could it be they wonder why you are unable to substantiate the detail of how your advice is meant to work? Maybe they wonder why you flounder at the detail that for someone to get out, someone else must get in? Do they wonder how illogical you appear with every post? Could they be wondering the damage you cause to those ever diligent, hard working types, aiming to build their businesses, their club memberships and their industry patronage? Could they be wondering why a person so keen for the decline in Australian GA keeps contributing? Or maybe they just wonder why you need to write in the first person, broadcast your heroes, telegraph your correspondences and articulate your significant financial resources, meaning you are unaffected by the hardship most in the industry are experiencing right now. Or could it be they wonder why this person is forever all headline and no story. Do they wonder why a person so light on detail could possibly believe their words don't cause others substantial hardship?
Maybe already, some people no longer need to wonder.
Or maybe they just may wonder when will a close friend tap you on the shoulder and say hey, that's enough, its time to go quietly, enjoy your retirement and dispense with this conflicted defeatism.
Could it be they wonder why you are unable to substantiate the detail of how your advice is meant to work? Maybe they wonder why you flounder at the detail that for someone to get out, someone else must get in? Do they wonder how illogical you appear with every post? Could they be wondering the damage you cause to those ever diligent, hard working types, aiming to build their businesses, their club memberships and their industry patronage? Could they be wondering why a person so keen for the decline in Australian GA keeps contributing? Or maybe they just wonder why you need to write in the first person, broadcast your heroes, telegraph your correspondences and articulate your significant financial resources, meaning you are unaffected by the hardship most in the industry are experiencing right now. Or could it be they wonder why this person is forever all headline and no story. Do they wonder why a person so light on detail could possibly believe their words don't cause others substantial hardship?
Maybe already, some people no longer need to wonder.
Or maybe they just may wonder when will a close friend tap you on the shoulder and say hey, that's enough, its time to go quietly, enjoy your retirement and dispense with this conflicted defeatism.