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CPL and class two medical

Old 29th Jul 2018, 00:11
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CPL and class two medical

I have had two opinions regarding the new CASA medical concession to allow CPL for certain operations to hold a class two. It appears this is only available to existing CPL holder and you still need a class one to take the CPL flight test.
Does anyone have anything that confirms or disproves this?
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 05:21
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Yes thatís correct, spoke with CASA regarding this a few weeks ago. The reasoning that I was given being that the flight test is a simulated passenger charter flight hence the requirement...
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 05:55
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Originally Posted by Munz View Post
Yes thatís correct, spoke with CASA regarding this a few weeks ago. The reasoning that I was given being that the flight test is a simulated passenger charter flight hence the requirement...
You could then argue that since it is a simulated charter flight, then you can use your class 2 medical to simulate a class 1 medical.
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 08:18
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CPL

That sucks
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 10:33
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Wonder if you need a class one, for a BFR of a cpl?
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 10:49
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Well, much as I deftest rules, hasnít a Class 1 been part of getting a CPL since Smithy was a boy?

just saying ....
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 11:35
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A hundred years later, the data show that the aviation medical certification system is very effective at employing and remunerating medical certifiers and boosting the egos of the medically certified, but not much else.
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 14:03
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LB I call BS on that.
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 22:06
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Ya got me. All those self-certified glider pilots operating in controlled airspace over the decades have proved themselves to be ticking medical time-bombs. And no holder of a Class 1 medical certificate has ever died at the controls...
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Old 29th Jul 2018, 23:49
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swh

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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
Well, much as I deftest rules, hasnít a Class 1 been part of getting a CPL since Smithy was a boy?

just saying ....
The difference now is you can fly a metro freight or instruct with a class 2, you no longer are required to hold a class 1 for that.
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 00:50
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Yep, SWH, I can also instruct on my Class 2. And I agree with LB, the system is/has been a sham with doctors who never see patients overruling the opinions of doctors who have seen and examined said patients. The new Class 2 allowances are a step in then right direction and I agree with the original poster, if you can operate commercially on a class 2, why the heck can't you do a CPL test on one?
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 01:03
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Does anyone have a link to these new rules allowing to instruct on a Class 2 .
Thanks
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 02:49
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Originally Posted by gsrk1 View Post
I have had two opinions regarding the new CASA medical concession to allow CPL for certain operations to hold a class two. It appears this is only available to existing CPL holder and you still need a class one to take the CPL flight test.
Does anyone have anything that confirms or disproves this?
CASR 61.1300
(3) A flight examiner commits an offence if:

(a) the examiner conducts a flight test for a pilot licence in an aircraft; and

(b) when the test begins, the examiner is not satisfied that:

(i) if the test is for a licence other than a recreational pilot licence--the applicant holds:

(A) a current medical certificate of the class required for the exercise of the privileges of the licence; or

(B) a medical exemption to exercise the privileges of the licence; or

(ii) if the test is for a recreational pilot licence--the applicant holds:

(A) a current class 1 or 2 medical certificate or recreational aviation medical practitioner's certificate; or

(B) a medical exemption for the exercise of the privileges of the licence.

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Old 30th Jul 2018, 02:53
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Originally Posted by Ejector View Post
Does anyone have a link to these new rules allowing to instruct on a Class 2 .
Thanks
https://www.casa.gov.au/licences-and...l-certificates
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 11:06
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Class 2 medical is all that is required for the CPL test.
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 12:05
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Originally Posted by Ozgrade3 View Post
Class 2 medical is all that is required for the CPL test.
Word directly from CASA is that you need a Class 1.
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 12:27
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You can not instructor a student for the issue of a pilots licence. You can instructor a student for an additional design feature or flight activity. ie, aerobatics instruction of a PPL or CPL holder.
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 13:02
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Originally Posted by Stretch06 View Post
You can not instructor a student for the issue of a pilots licence. You can instructor a student for an additional design feature or flight activity. ie, aerobatics instruction of a PPL or CPL holder.
How to you figure that one? The exemption applies to an exempted activity, defined in the exemption as:

exempted activity means a flight that:
(a) is wholly within Australian territory; and
(b) is in an aircraft with a maximum take-off weight less than 8 618 kg; and
(c) does not carry a passenger


The exemption also states:

Definitions
Note In this instrument certain terms and expressions have the same meaning as they have in the Civil Aviation Act 1988 and the regulations. These include: Australian territory, class, current, flight, maximum take-off weight, medical certificate, and passenger.


Now the Civil Aviation Safety regulations contain the definition of a passenger as:
passenger, in relation to an aircraft, means a person:
(a) who:
(i) intends to travel on a particular flight on the aircraft; or
(ii) is on board the aircraft for a flight; or
(iii) has disembarked from the aircraft following a flight; and
(b) who is not a member of the crew of the aircraft for the fligh
t.

Now funnily enough "crew" isn't defined. Flight crew member and cabin crew member are:
flight crew member means a crew member who is a pilot or flight engineer assigned to carry out duties essential to the operation of an aircraft during flight time.
cabin crew member, in relation to an aircraft, means a crew member, other than a flight crew member, who performs, in the interests of the safety of the aircraft's passengers, duties assigned by the operator or the pilot in command of the aircraft.


So the question at the end of all this is when is a student receiving training a passenger and when are they a crew member? Do they have to hold some other license as asserted by Stretch? Btu that still wouldn't meet the definition of a flight crew member and more than not having any licence at all.

I dont know but for all the words CASA produce I am not sure they know either...

Last edited by no_one; 30th Jul 2018 at 13:03. Reason: Capitals
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Old 30th Jul 2018, 13:37
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swh

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Originally Posted by Ejector View Post
Does anyone have a link to these new rules allowing to instruct on a Class 2 .
Thanks
from the CASA link provided

ĒHolders of a Commercial Pilot Licence can conduct commercial flights that do not carry passengers with a Class 2 medical certificate if the maximum take-off weight is less than 8618 kilograms. This includes flight training. Read the legislative instrument (CASA EX25/18) that permits this condition.ď

read the execption

https://www.legislation.gov.au/Detai...00167/Download

it says class 2 are exempt from

A person who holds a commercial pilot licence or an air transport pilot licence is exempt from compliance with sub regulation 61.065 (1) of CASR to the extent that the subregulation requires that the person also hold a class 1 medical certificate to be authorised under Part 61 of CASR to conduct an exempted activity.

look up 61.065(1)

of unauthorised activities--holders of flight crew licences (1) The holder of a flight crew licence commits an offence if:
(a) the holder conducts an activity mentioned in this Part while:
(i) piloting a registered aircraft; or
(ii) acting as flight engineer of a registered aircraft; or
(iii) acting as an instructor or examiner; and



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Old 30th Jul 2018, 14:28
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The long and the short of it is that the exemption only applies to existing CPL holders. To take the CPL flight test you need a class 1 after that a class two if you are not doing paid passenger operations (Advice by phone and email from CASA today)
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