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Trainee firefighter blows whistle, claiming teachers called students ‘fat f**ks, dumb

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Trainee firefighter blows whistle, claiming teachers called students ‘fat f**ks, dumb

Old 23rd May 2018, 06:16
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Trainee firefighter blows whistle, claiming teachers called students ‘fat f**ks, dumb

Australian firefighter recruit hits back at alleged abusive trainers
So the two perps got "sanctioned" by Airservices for their behaviour. Meanwhile someone who could well have turned out to be an excellent fire and rescue officer had their career flushed down the sh*tter.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 08:52
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Originally Posted by YPJT View Post
Australian firefighter recruit hits back at alleged abusive trainers
So the two perps got "sanctioned" by Airservices for their behaviour. Meanwhile someone who could well have turned out to be an excellent fire and rescue officer had their career flushed down the sh*tter.
Folks,
Sound like some delicate little flowers wilted under the strain??
I suppose Airservices will have to provide "safe spaces" for those demanding it, and guaranteeing that ARFFS perx will not be confronted with upsetting circumstances that cause personal distress.
I am not being entirely sarcastic here, no names no packdrill, but in a certain airline two cabin crew perx under training quit during the cabin evacuation training, finding all the shouting and pushing and shoving "loud, physical and distressing" and in particular apparently felt that "evacuation commands" should have been "requests delivered in a less strident tone".
I kid you not. At least they quit, but will they sue??
Tootle pip!!
PS: PERX: a gender neutral term to describe an alleged member of the human race, consistent with the Australian Government style guide.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 09:26
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"Former Sydney paramedic "

delicate ? Maybe not.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 10:04
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“It’s hard to learn, stay focused and not make mistakes when you are on edge wondering what words might be yelled at you.”
However, it seems the other members of the course managed to learn, stay focused, and not make mistakes, while having various words yelled at them.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 10:17
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“made so many sacrifices through the recruitment process to make it onto this team”

But, being called out for cocking up obviously wasn't one of them.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 11:37
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Typical reply from LeadSled and really shows your age old chum! You can't treat people like that any more!

Airservices aren't the military and not even the military treats their soldiers like that any more and haven't done so for a long time!

On a side note... Was interesting to see The Age running a positive story today about ATC staff being in the top earners at $140k'ish average.

Stay tuned for the next story about them in the news which will be another negative one. Their marketing department will be crapping themselves this week!
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Old 23rd May 2018, 12:05
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Originally Posted by Squawk7700 View Post
Typical reply from LeadSled and really shows your age old chum! You can't treat people like that any more!

Airservices aren't the military and not even the military treats their soldiers like that any more and haven't done so for a long time!
Exactly Squawkie...ASA is vicariously liable for the actions of its staff and these allegations could be taken a lot further by Fair Work or HREOC. I hope they are.

Leadslead’s Neanderthal comments are neither funny nor appropriate.

kaz
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Old 23rd May 2018, 13:53
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“It’s hard to learn, stay focused and not make mistakes when you are on edge wondering what words might be yelled at you.”
Sounds like a few check captains I flew with..
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Old 23rd May 2018, 13:59
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Snoop

Originally Posted by Judd View Post
Sounds like a few check captains I flew with..
and maybe one of them posted here earlier.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 14:19
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Originally Posted by Squawk7700 View Post
Typical reply from LeadSled and really shows your age old chum! You can't treat people like that any more.
7700,
Despite the times we live in, there are some jobs that can be high stress, as I am sure you know. Before I criticise the ASA trainer, I would want to know a lot more about the real circumstances, because I don't believe the original premise, I wonder what the balanced story really was. And I don't have much faith in ASA senior management making other than PC determinations.
As for the airline case I quoted, and I do have confidence in the reporter, it is a pathetic example of the times, in which we live ----- Where "being nice and polite" takes precedence over giving orders and demanding action that might save lives. Sadly, even in the flightdeck, I have come across an inability to give orders, when an order was legally required ---- and this is NOT in circumstances of normal CRM interaction, so don't throw that one back.
Tootle pip!!
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Old 23rd May 2018, 18:37
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But according to Ms Madsen and Ms Davies, the reality of training
There it is in a nutshell.
said she had “made so many sacrifices through the recruitment process to make it onto this team” including a move from Sydney
Is that not what happens when you resign from one position to take up another different career that is in a different locale, and is there no chance of failing this training?
Meanwhile someone who could well have turned out to be an excellent fire and rescue officer had their career flushed down the sh*tter
Or may well have turned out average or even below average, or perhaps not even passed. She pulled the pin just over half way through, so who knows?
her three-page resignation letter
Really?

Last edited by Traffic_Is_Er_Was; 23rd May 2018 at 18:50.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 20:35
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She probably quit when she found out the men were paid more.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 23:53
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Still just trying to get my head around where giving orders and taking action" is justification for someone being called a "fat f*ck" or ""dumb". As Squawk7700 mentioned, even the military doesn't pull that crap any more. When I was an instructor at RMC Duntroon in the early 90s there were still a few knuckle dragging Neanderthals on staff who couldn't quite grasp the fact that you don't get the best out of an individual regardless of gender by shouting and screaming abuse.
If the facts of the complaint were not true I doubt very much that the disgruntled trainee would have gone public. AsA have not denied those facts but even here there seems to be people who subscribe to this type of behaviour.
The trainee may well have not been up to standard but there are more than adequate provisions under the AQTF to deal with this.
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Old 24th May 2018, 00:13
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A three page resignation letter because I heard some nasty words. Did she realise she would attend aircraft fires, with potential deceased on board?

As for Neanderthals, the military have toughened up young snowflakes for centuries with those “nasty phrases”, and to good effect apparently.

If anyone is offended feel free to go to the safe room.
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Old 24th May 2018, 00:13
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Originally Posted by YPJT View Post
Still just trying to get my head around where giving orders and taking action" is justification for someone being called a "fat f*ck" or ""dumb". As Squawk7700 mentioned, even the military doesn't pull that crap any more. When I was an instructor at RMC Duntroon in the early 90s there were still a few knuckle dragging Neanderthals on staff who couldn't quite grasp the fact that you don't get the best out of an individual regardless of gender by shouting and screaming abuse.
If the facts of the complaint were not true I doubt very much that the disgruntled trainee would have gone public. AsA have not denied those facts but even here there seems to be people who subscribe to this type of behaviour.
The trainee may well have not been up to standard but there are more than adequate provisions under the AQTF to deal with this.
Folks,
One of the reasons I doubt the basic premise of the allegation is that I have never , in any aviation training (or other aviation) situation (this is not a building site and/or a CFMMEU "meeting") heard, or heard of such language being used, outside of a bar over a few beers, and never in a professional situation.
But I can well imagine ASA management going to water on the matter. And as some of you well know, I have been around aviation a long time.
If a few of you gave it a bit of thought before you jumped to abuse, yourselves, nothing I originally posted condoned the language allegedly used. I just need a lot of convincing the situation occurred as claimed, as opposed to just accepting the allegations of the disgruntled failed trainee.
Tootle pip!!

Last edited by LeadSled; 24th May 2018 at 06:38. Reason: vital punctuation correction
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Old 24th May 2018, 04:04
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Originally Posted by tio540
Did she realise she would attend aircraft fires, with potential deceased on board?
Given she's a paramedic, she'd probably handle that better than you would.

Originally Posted by Leddie
If a few of you gave it a bit of thought before you jumped to abuse yourselves
I'll try but I just can't help it. Jumping in. To abuse myself.
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Old 24th May 2018, 04:21
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Once in a while a training establishment may have a staff member that over steps the mark. Time will tell.

Some operational environments are challenging, adverse and carry a degree of risk.

This risk can be managed to a degree by the quality of the training provided and the suitability of the candidates. Hats off to any individual that volunteers for these roles.

However not all measure up. Better to discover this early in the selection or training phase than later on operations where the consequences are final. Better for the individual, better for the organisation and better for the recipient of whatever service it is they provide.
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Old 24th May 2018, 04:54
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Bring back National Service...........
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Old 24th May 2018, 05:50
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Capn Bloggs, now there's a mental image that has my trembling hand reaching for some mind-bleach....
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Old 24th May 2018, 06:47
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I'll try but I just can't help it. Jumping in. To abuse myself.
Bloggsie,
Good catch, amazing what a missing comma can do to the intended meaning --- post suitably edited.
Now, back to my major point, I would need a lot of convincing that the claims of the complainant are what really happened.
Tootle pip!!
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